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@@ -0,0 +1,32405 @@
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 08:14:22 +0100
+From: Mark Murray <mark@grondar.org>
+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site 
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, smustudent1@yahoo.com
+
+root writes:
+> I don't understand why it is important to use an already installed
+> lisp image.  It seems likely to be yet-another-source-of-trouble
+> like the X library issues. What am I missing?
+
+The already-installed lisp versions (may) have been hacked to
+actually work, and they may be standard didtributions of the lisp
+compiler distributed by the OS vendor (.rpm, .deb or FreeBSD "port"
+files).
+
+The Axiom copy of lisp is a fork, and an incompatible one to boot,
+so us OS people (well, me anyway - I'm with FreeBSD) are trying to
+use the one that we already have to get things to work.
+
+After all, when you get (say) X, it doesn't come bundled with the
+version of GCC that the XFree86 folks have certified that it will
+compile with, right? Instead, over time #ifdef hell has developed,
+and configuration stuff has been done to make sure that whatever
+package it is has been put together to work with whatever you already
+have, as far as practical. Sometimes, of course you have to bail out
+and say things like "This needs an ANSI C compiler, K&R won't work,
+ever!", but bolting every tool that is needed onto the side of the
+package concerned is overkill IMO.
+
+I hear what you say about the extensions, and I understand why you
+need them; are Camm's proposals not suitable?
+
+That's the way I'm thinking :-)
+
+\start
+Date: 01 Oct 2003 12:38:21 +0200
+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+
+Hi,
+
+here is a fix for the macro expansion bug. As a test I
+recompiled the complete algebra without any change in generated
+lisp code.
+
+
+diff -c -r1.4 compiler.boot
+*** compiler.boot       2003/06/20 20:58:11     1.4
+--- compiler.boot       2003/09/30 20:07:31
+***************
+*** 670,686 ****
+  compMacro(form,m,e) ==
+    $macroIfTrue: local:= true
+    ["MDEF",lhs,signature,specialCases,rhs]:= form
+!   rhs :=
+      rhs is ['CATEGORY,:.] => ['"-- the constructor category"]
+      rhs is ['Join,:.]     => ['"-- the constructor category"]
+      rhs is ['CAPSULE,:.]  => ['"-- the constructor capsule"]
+      rhs is ['add,:.]      => ['"-- the constructor capsule"]
+      formatUnabbreviated rhs
+    sayBrightly ['"   processing macro definition",'%b,
+!     :formatUnabbreviated lhs,'" ==> ",:rhs,'%d]
+!   ["MDEF",lhs,signature,specialCases,rhs]:= form:= macroExpand(form,e)
+    m=$EmptyMode or m=$NoValueMode =>
+!     ["/throwAway",$NoValueMode,put(first lhs,"macro",rhs,e)]
+  
+  --% SEQ
+  
+--- 670,685 ----
+  compMacro(form,m,e) ==
+    $macroIfTrue: local:= true
+    ["MDEF",lhs,signature,specialCases,rhs]:= form
+!   prhs :=
+      rhs is ['CATEGORY,:.] => ['"-- the constructor category"]
+      rhs is ['Join,:.]     => ['"-- the constructor category"]
+      rhs is ['CAPSULE,:.]  => ['"-- the constructor capsule"]
+      rhs is ['add,:.]      => ['"-- the constructor capsule"]
+      formatUnabbreviated rhs
+    sayBrightly ['"   processing macro definition",'%b,
+!     :formatUnabbreviated lhs,'" ==> ",:prhs,'%d]
+    m=$EmptyMode or m=$NoValueMode =>
+!     ["/throwAway",$NoValueMode,put(first lhs,"macro",macroExpand(rhs,e),e)]
+  
+  --% SEQ
+  
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 07:19:42 -0400
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: mark@grondar.org, acn1@cam.ac.uk
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, smustudent1@yahoo.com
+
+Arthur, Mark,
+
+You make a very convincing case. The key concern, it appears, is forking.
+The hope is to migrate changes back into the common lisp. Unless all of
+the common lisps agree on a socket standard I don't see how this can happen
+but I am willing to try.
+
+It might be the case that every modern common lisp DOES have socket code
+and that the socket support could be rewritten (with #+ for each lisp).
+We also use some X library support code which might will generic support.
+I'll look at that direction. Does anybody know if GCL has sockets at the
+lisp level (not inline C code)? I'd be happy to ditch the C code completely
+but only if I know that the functionality can be re-implemented in lisp.
+
+After I finish the book the next task is to get sman (superman, the thing
+that actually starts when you start axiom) running so the other processes
+can communicate. Dylan's going to look at the graphics process and I will
+focus on getting hyperdoc back to life.
+
+In the near term (at least the next year) I suspect we will still need
+the sources for any common lisp we build upon. These could be
+installed sources.  In the long term I'll plan to push toward using
+installed lisps.  (Keep in mind that the long term plan is for Axiom to
+run on every common lisp.  The fact that GCL has all the support we
+need already built in doesn't mean that we're done.)
+
+In Axiom if you want to use an installed gcl instead of the tar file you just:
+
+cd lsp
+ln -s (yourGCLdistributionPath)/gcl-2.17.1 gcl-2.17.1
+touch gcldir
+cd ..
+make GCLVERSION=gcl-2.17.1
+
+The symbolic link will use the already installed sources.
+The "touch" will convince Axiom that it does not need to build the lisp again.
+The GCLVERSION variable says what version you want to use.
+
+I'll add these instructions to the FAQ in Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+We could make this the default install instructions, I suppose, but
+that shifts the burden of building onto the end user whereas it
+currently resides in the makefile. If the installed sources were
+installed as root then the user will have to install as root which is
+currently unnecessary (one should never work as root :-) ) I'll break
+out the "patching" portion of the stanza so it can be executed against
+pre-installed sources.
+
+If you move to a new, untested version of GCL, the build is likely to
+fail late into the Axiom build because lisp won't contain the Axiom
+extensions.
+
+About Camm's suggestion: I didn't understand the suggestion (and still don't).
+I feel like I "missed a memo" on that one. 
+
+Arthur, what is your feeling about making the Axiom C code part of the
+standard CCL distribution? 
+
+\start
+Date: 01 Oct 2003 11:28:39 -0400
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site
+Cc: mark@grondar.org, smustudent1@yahoo.com
+
+Greetings!  You guys type so fast!  I'm going to try to be brief to
+catch up...
+
+1) Tim, whatever you feel is best for axiom is best in my book too.
+   All the foregoing are offered as suggestions only.  
+
+2) (pros and cons of an external gcl build discussed in a separate
+   reply to your other post)
+        
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> > Having some kind of useful mechanism of adding extensions seems to be
+> > a focal point?
+> 
+> I suppose. The key problem I've had with adding extensions to gcl
+> has been system libraries, not gcl itself. The first attempt at
+> system building was on Redhat 7.3 and required an XFree library
+> which was not part of the standard build. I had included the rpm
+> as part of the CVS zips but was convinced that this was, well,
+> lets just say, ummm, inelegant :-)
+> 
+
+3) non-lisp C extension modules and libraries can now be linked into
+   an externally installed GCL from lisp via compiler::link.
+4) An older faslink method can be reenabled if desired with likely
+   minimal work.
+5) Build dependencies as referred to above are handled automatically
+   in most modern distributions.  Look at the Build-Depends: line in
+   the debian/control file of the GCL source.  There is an analogous
+   line in the Debian axiom package.  IMHO, the vast majority of axiom
+   users will never compile it, but install it and its runtime
+   dependencies automatically with a single command.  The next largest
+   group will compile it, but will do so by downloading the source and
+   automatically installing its build-dependencies also with a single
+   command.  So I think axiom need not fear having external
+   dependencies as long as they are clearly specified, knowing that
+   only the 'experts' will ever have to take care of ensuring their
+   presence when needed.  I think the 'inelegance' you felt above goes
+   right to the heart of the modular software design we're all
+   striving towards, and might arguably pertain to a subsidiary lisp
+   build as well.
+
+> The Mandrake install is giving me similar library issues as is
+> the iMac. I tried getting the latest CVS of GCL but it still
+> doesn't build. How did you get the Mac build to succeed?
+> 
+
+6) When accessing CVS, please use the 'stable' branch, by adding '-r
+   Version_2_6_1' after the 'checkout' command word.  This is
+   explained on our temporary distribution site:
+        http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl
+   We've just put this together in response to ftp.gnu.org's
+   inaccessibility.  And David, thanks for the pointer about the file
+   restorations there (!).  But alas, the machine I used to access the
+   tree is still unavailable, and I cannot get responses from the ftp
+   managers for a new account on whatever new machine is involved.
+
+7) Has Aurelian been in touch with you?
+
+8) If you can provide remote ssh access to your imac, I'll get GCL
+   running for you.
+
+> Dynamically adding extensions will mean that the lisp loader
+> will have to automatically find and link new system libraries.
+> That's quite a large task.
+
+9) If the system libraries are specified, (modern distros use a
+   'soname' to denote compatible shared libraries, so this should be
+   in the specification, but not the minor point release/bug fix
+   release number, i.e. libfoo.so.2, not libfoo.so.2.3), GCL can build
+   this link in already via compiler::link.  This method requires a
+   restart of the lisp, whereas if we were to resurrect the faslink
+   method, a restart would not be necessary.
+> 
+> > The above will need to find a saved_gcl, no? (I'll fix the FreeBSD port
+> > to add this to the installed bits if so).
+> 
+> The above essentially copies saved_gcl to obj/linux/bin/lisp.
+> In some hopeful future you should just be able to find the lisp
+> on the path.
+> 
+
+10) If you just link the external saved_gcl to obj/linux/bin/lisp, it
+    won't have your extensions compiled in.  You will get a saved_gcl
+    with these extensions compiled in if you use compiler::link as
+    outlined in the long email.
+
+> > The FreeBSD port infrastructure takes care of the details, like installing
+> > GCL if its not already there.
+> 
+> Can you point me to the docs on this? How does this magic happen?
+> 
+
+11) At least for Debian, you can look at pbuilder and apt-src.
+
+> > Did you get his long email
+> 
+> Yes, this morning. (Last night was my anniversary so I was kinda 
+> lame about reading email). I'll study it in more detail.
+> 
+
+11) Happy anniversary!  Don't you dare even think about this stuff on
+    such a blissful occasion :-).
+
+Take care,
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 18:46:38 +0200
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+To: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+
+Hello Juergen,
+
+Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+
+> here is a fix for the macro expansion bug. As a test I
+> recompiled the complete algebra without any change in generated
+> lisp code.
+
+Thanks Juergen.
+
+I think I have added your patch to the corresponding bug in the
+database:
+[bug #4871] left hand side macro expansion issue (was: Compiling spad
+file causes value stack overflow)
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=4871&group_id=2938
+
+Have you tried to compile the remaining algebra files?
+
+\section{Broken Files}
+These files need to be added.
+\begin{verbatim}
+
+limitps    SIGNEF
+primelt    FSPRMELT
+nsregset   LAZM3PK
+nregset    NORMPK
+regset     QCMPACK
+regset     REGSET
+regset     RSETGCD
+sregset    SREGSET
+sregset    SRDCMPK
+sregset    SFRGCD
+sregset    SFQCMPK
+transsolve SOLVETRA
+asp        ASP29
+d01agents  D01AGNT
+nsregset   SNTSCAT
+nregset    NTSCAT
+sregset    SFRTCAT
+algcat     CPIMA
+combfunc   COMBF
+ffnb       INBFF
+lodo       LODO
+lodo       LODO1
+lodo       LODO2
+newpoint   SUBSPACE
+sttf       STTF
+zerodim    LEXTRIPK
+zerodim    IRURPK
+zerodim    RGCHAIN
+zerodim    RURPK
+zerodim    ZDSOLVE
+\end{verbatim}
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:59:01 -0400
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+
+David,
+
+The missing algebra is not "fixed" yet. The problem is slightly more subtle. 
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 09:05:30 -0400
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: mark@grondar.org
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, smustudent1@yahoo.com
+
+> Having some kind of useful mechanism of adding extensions seems to be
+> a focal point?
+
+I suppose. The key problem I've had with adding extensions to gcl
+has been system libraries, not gcl itself. The first attempt at
+system building was on Redhat 7.3 and required an XFree library
+which was not part of the standard build. I had included the rpm
+as part of the CVS zips but was convinced that this was, well,
+lets just say, ummm, inelegant :-)
+
+The Mandrake install is giving me similar library issues as is
+the iMac. I tried getting the latest CVS of GCL but it still
+doesn't build. How did you get the Mac build to succeed?
+
+Dynamically adding extensions will mean that the lisp loader
+will have to automatically find and link new system libraries.
+That's quite a large task.
+
+> The above will need to find a saved_gcl, no? (I'll fix the FreeBSD port
+> to add this to the installed bits if so).
+
+The above essentially copies saved_gcl to obj/linux/bin/lisp.
+In some hopeful future you should just be able to find the lisp
+on the path.
+
+> The FreeBSD port infrastructure takes care of the details, like installing
+> GCL if its not already there.
+
+Can you point me to the docs on this? How does this magic happen?
+
+> Did you get his long email
+
+Yes, this morning. (Last night was my anniversary so I was kinda 
+lame about reading email). I'll study it in more detail.
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 19:00:34 +0200
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "David MENTRE" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+
+Thanks for adding the patch.
+
+I compiled all the algebra files a while ago. The problem
+had been the out-of-date database files. It's not related
+to the macroexpansion problem. I posted the
+results to the list at that time 
+(http://www.uni-mainz.de/~weiss/axiom.algebra.jw.20030810.tgz).
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 6:47 PM
+> To: Weiss, Juergen
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Juergen,
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+> 
+> > here is a fix for the macro expansion bug. As a test I
+> > recompiled the complete algebra without any change in generated
+> > lisp code.
+> 
+> Thanks Juergen.
+> 
+> I think I have added your patch to the corresponding bug in the
+> database:
+> [bug #4871] left hand side macro expansion issue (was: Compiling spad
+> file causes value stack overflow)
+> http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=3Ddetailbug&bug_id=3D4871&gr
+oup_id=3D2938
+
+Have you tried to compile the remaining algebra files?
+
+\section{Broken Files}
+These files need to be added.
+\begin{verbatim}
+
+limitps    SIGNEF
+primelt    FSPRMELT
+nsregset   LAZM3PK
+nregset    NORMPK
+regset     QCMPACK
+regset     REGSET
+regset     RSETGCD
+sregset    SREGSET
+sregset    SRDCMPK
+sregset    SFRGCD
+sregset    SFQCMPK
+transsolve SOLVETRA
+asp        ASP29
+d01agents  D01AGNT
+nsregset   SNTSCAT
+nregset    NTSCAT
+sregset    SFRTCAT
+algcat     CPIMA
+combfunc   COMBF
+ffnb       INBFF
+lodo       LODO
+lodo       LODO1
+lodo       LODO2
+newpoint   SUBSPACE
+sttf       STTF
+zerodim    LEXTRIPK
+zerodim    IRURPK
+zerodim    RGCHAIN
+zerodim    RURPK
+zerodim    ZDSOLVE
+\end{verbatim}
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 15:29:26 +0100
+From: Mark Murray <mark@grondar.org>
+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site 
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, smustudent1@yahoo.com, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+
+Tim Daly writes:
+
+> Dynamically adding extensions will mean that the lisp loader will have
+> to automatically find and link new system libraries.  That's quite a
+> large task.
+
+Not really. If you add functionality to a C program by using dlopen(3),
+the ELF loader takes charge of loading any shared libs required by that
+shared object. Can lisp not handle this?
+
+> > The above will need to find a saved_gcl, no? (I'll fix the FreeBSD
+> > port to add this to the installed bits if so).
+>
+> The above essentially copies saved_gcl to obj/linux/bin/lisp.  In some
+> hopeful future you should just be able to find the lisp on the path.
+
+Right. Usually, saved_gcl is not installed, so for the time being, I'll
+make sure that FreeBSD has one.
+
+> > The FreeBSD port infrastructure takes care of the details, like
+> > installing GCL if its not already there.
+>
+> Can you point me to the docs on this? How does this magic happen?
+
+Docs. Hmm :-). There is rather a lot.
+
+Paraphrasing - there is a makefile wrapper, and a collection of diffs.
+Building a port can be broken down into a set of steps:
+
+1) "make fetch" - fetch(1) (like wget(1)) the port distfile(s) from the
+nominated master site/mirrors. Cache this in /usr/ports/distfiles.
+
+2) "make checksum" - use md5(1) to make sure you have the right
+distribution file(s).
+
+3) "make extract" - unpack the distribution files into a dir called
+work/. This may depend on installing required archival software if
+the dist file is in an unusual format. The dependancy is handled
+automatically. The dependancy requirements are supplied in the wrapper
+makefile.
+
+4) "make patch" - apply any patches (local or distributor supplied) to
+the unpacked distro.
+
+5) "make configure" - run any necessary configure commands. This may
+depend on installing required configuration software (such as automake
+or autoconf). The dependancy is handled automatically. The dependancy
+requirements are supplied in the wrapper makefile.
+
+6) "make build" - actually build/compile the software. This may
+depend on installing required software (libraries, specialised
+compilers, etc). The dependancy is handled automatically. The dependancy
+requirements are supplied in the wrapper makefile.
+
+7) "make install" - install the software into ${PREFIX} (usually
+/usr/local), and register it into /var/db/pkg/<portname>. This may
+depend on installing run-time software (data files etc). The dependancy
+is handled automatically. The dependancy requirements are supplied in
+the wrapper makefile.
+
+8) "make package" - make a binary distribution "package". This is
+similar to a .rpm file or a .deb file, and contains meta-information on
+what packages this package depends on. The binary package (a compressed
+tarball with extra stuff) can be installed on another system with
+pkg_add(1). Stash the package in /usr/ports/packages/.
+
+9) "make clean" - rm -rf the work/ subdir created in 1).
+
+Each recursive dependancy install does 1-7, if needed. Sophisicated
+tools are available to maintain ports, packages and dependancies.
+
+If the port creator did his job properly, then for anyone to build
+the package is a no-brainer.
+
+The usual short-circuit of the above is
+
+$ cd /usr/ports/math/axiom	# or whatever port you want
+$ make install			# $ does 1-7 automagically
+$ make clean			# we don't need to make a package if
+				#   we are a single-user site
+
+... or pkg_add the package of your distribution CD.
+
+> > Did you get his long email
+>
+> Yes, this morning. (Last night was my anniversary so I was kinda lame
+> about reading email). I'll study it in more detail.
+
+Anniversary? Congratulations!! :-) All the best!
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 14:49:51 -0400 
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+
+David,
+
+As Juergen says there does not seem to be any problem
+with the remaining algebra files. It is just that Tim's
+version of the algebra Makefile does not yet include
+them. For now they can be compiled manually (or you can
+use Juergen's version of the algebra Makefile).
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Weiss, Juergen [mailto:weiss@uni-mainz.de]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 1:01 PM
+> To: David MENTRE
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+> 
+> 
+> Thanks for adding the patch.
+> 
+> I compiled all the algebra files a while ago. The problem
+> had been the out-of-date database files. It's not related
+> to the macroexpansion problem. I posted the
+> results to the list at that time 
+> (http://www.uni-mainz.de/~weiss/axiom.algebra.jw.20030810.tgz).
+> 
+> Regards,
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss
+> 
+> > -----Original Message-----
+> > From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> > Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 6:47 PM
+> > To: Weiss, Juergen
+> > Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> > Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+> > 
+> > 
+> > Hello Juergen,
+> > 
+> > Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+> > 
+> > > here is a fix for the macro expansion bug. As a test I
+> > > recompiled the complete algebra without any change in generated
+> > > lisp code.
+> > 
+> > Thanks Juergen.
+> > 
+> > I think I have added your patch to the corresponding bug in the
+> > database:
+> > [bug #4871] left hand side macro expansion issue (was: 
+> Compiling spad
+> > file causes value stack overflow)
+> > http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=4871&gr
+> oup_id=2938
+> 
+> Have you tried to compile the remaining algebra files?
+> 
+> \section{Broken Files}
+> These files need to be added.
+> \begin{verbatim}
+> 
+> limitps    SIGNEF
+> primelt    FSPRMELT
+> nsregset   LAZM3PK
+> nregset    NORMPK
+> regset     QCMPACK
+> regset     REGSET
+> regset     RSETGCD
+> sregset    SREGSET
+> sregset    SRDCMPK
+> sregset    SFRGCD
+> sregset    SFQCMPK
+> transsolve SOLVETRA
+> asp        ASP29
+> d01agents  D01AGNT
+> nsregset   SNTSCAT
+> nregset    NTSCAT
+> sregset    SFRTCAT
+> algcat     CPIMA
+> combfunc   COMBF
+> ffnb       INBFF
+> lodo       LODO
+> lodo       LODO1
+> lodo       LODO2
+> newpoint   SUBSPACE
+> sttf       STTF
+> zerodim    LEXTRIPK
+> zerodim    IRURPK
+> zerodim    RGCHAIN
+> zerodim    RURPK
+> zerodim    ZDSOLVE
+> \end{verbatim}
+> 
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 23:14:58 +0200
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Axiom short term roadmap
+
+Hello,
+
+I have started to list tasks that need to be done for a first stable
+release of Axiom. You'll find them at:
+
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/pm/task.php?group_project_id=1222&group_id=2938&func=browse
+
+The proposed list is a first start. Of course, everybody is free to add
+or remove tasks.
+
+The main idea I had doing this is to keep us on focus for some short
+term goals that I think are a prerequisite for the future (community and
+Tim's vision on Axiom). Having a stable release will help us setting a
+reference point for ports and enhancements.
+
+Some remaining tasks I'm hesitating to put as target for this initial
+release:
+ 
+ - external gcl
+
+ - various ports (MacOS X, FreeBSD, Windows, ...)
+
+
+I think I'll add a mid-term goal (all ports, hyperdvi browser, graphics,
+...) and a long term goal (Axiom Journal, Proof Assistant Integration,
+zero learning curve interface, ...).
+
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+PS : I hope I am clear on my intent. The purpose of this email is not to
+     say that Camm, Jaap or Mark work is not useful.
+-- 
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 13:44:56 -0400
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: miked@nag.co.uk, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Scanned image of book
+
+Mike,
+
+Does NAG own the copyright to the Axiom book?
+I know the words were released under the Modified BSD.
+Bill Page has offered to upload a scanned image of the book
+for use while the new one is being written.
+Will NAG allow that?
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 13:42:45 +0100
+From: Mark Murray <mark@grondar.org>
+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site 
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, smustudent1@yahoo.com
+
+root writes:
+> You make a very convincing case. The key concern, it appears, is forking.
+> The hope is to migrate changes back into the common lisp. Unless all of
+> the common lisps agree on a socket standard I don't see how this can happen
+> but I am willing to try.
+
+:-) Whoever said the art of dialogue was dead, was wrong! :-)
+
+Having some kind of useful mechanism of adding extensions seems to be
+a focal point?
+
+If lisp compilers all had some way that you could add external functionality
+/a la/ dlopen(3), then would this not solve the problem?
+
+> It might be the case that every modern common lisp DOES have socket code
+> and that the socket support could be rewritten (with #+ for each lisp).
+
+That would be the best scenario.
+
+> In Axiom if you want to use an installed gcl instead of the tar file you just:
+> 
+> cd lsp
+> ln -s (yourGCLdistributionPath)/gcl-2.17.1 gcl-2.17.1
+> touch gcldir
+> cd ..
+> make GCLVERSION=gcl-2.17.1
+> 
+> The symbolic link will use the already installed sources.
+> The "touch" will convince Axiom that it does not need to build the lisp again.
+> The GCLVERSION variable says what version you want to use.
+
+The above will need to find a saved_gcl, no? (I'll fix the FreeBSD port
+to add this to the installed bits if so).
+
+> I'll add these instructions to the FAQ in Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+Excellent!
+
+> We could make this the default install instructions, I suppose, but
+> that shifts the burden of building onto the end user whereas it
+> currently resides in the makefile. If the installed sources were
+> installed as root then the user will have to install as root which is
+> currently unnecessary (one should never work as root :-) ) I'll break
+> out the "patching" portion of the stanza so it can be executed against
+> pre-installed sources.
+
+As an alternative install method, it suits FreeBSD very well, as all
+a FreeBSD'er needs to do to build it would be
+
+# cd /usr/ports/math/axiom
+# make
+# make install
+# make clean
+
+or, even easier
+
+# portinstall math/axiom
+
+The FreeBSD port infrastructure takes care of the details, like installing
+GCL if its not already there.
+
+> If you move to a new, untested version of GCL, the build is likely to
+> fail late into the Axiom build because lisp won't contain the Axiom
+> extensions.
+> 
+> About Camm's suggestion: I didn't understand the suggestion (and still don't).
+> I feel like I "missed a memo" on that one. 
+
+Did you get his long email
+
+Subject: Re: confusion over patch suggestion
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 22:45:45 +0200
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Axiom book (partially) available?
+
+Hello Bill,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> I have the resources to produce a scanned PDF format
+> copy of the AXIOM book. 
+
+Beware of copyright issues. While Tim has the source of the text of the
+book and the rights to produce a new version, the layout of the original
+book is still copyrighted by its publisher.
+
+I don't remember the duration of copyright until it falls in the public
+domain but I doubt the copyright on the original Axiom book is expired.
+
+In short: you can't do that except if you have the written consent of
+the publisher.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+PS : According to the Gutenberg project, the copyright duration is 50
+     years after the death of the author. There is no such thing as a
+     free world.
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:54:33 -0400
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: weiss@uni-mainz.de
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+
+Juergen,
+
+Time, mostly. The algebra files reference interval. I got interval to
+compile and now have to finish the cleanup task. I'm working on that
+in my local build subtree but haven't completed or tested it. Other
+tasks are being pushed ahead of it (I uploaded a fix for "algebra
+sources in mnt" on monday, (tuesday was an anniversary so I slacked a
+bit).  I'm currently cleaning up the "makes" in Makefiles and writing
+a FAQ entry for the "installed lisp" issue.  Next I will apply the
+Macro patch you sent and set up a build/test/release cycle overnight)
+but progress is being made. It should happen RSN (real soon now), that
+is, once I do the next cleanup of my subtree, test it, polish it for
+upload, and upload it. I haven't forgotten it. Indeed, the main reason
+I wanted David to leave it as a bug was that I wanted to have a record
+that it is still an outstanding issue.
+
+Tim
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 17:01:01 -0400 
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'David MENTRE'" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>, "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Axiom book (partially) available?
+
+David,
+
+Yes, I am very much aware of the copyright issue since
+that is directly related to the work I do (electronic
+publishing and databases for defence). NAG is named in
+the front piece of the book as the holder of the copyright -
+odd perhaps, since often it is the publisher, Spriner-Verlag.
+I look forward to receiving approval from NAG to make a
+scanned version of the book available online.
+
+In the mean time, it seems to me that the usual "fair use"
+practices would permit me to at least distribute some
+parts (how much??) of the book to members of the Axiom
+developer and user groups. After all this is (largely) a
+research project.
+
+Perhaps there is not yet such a thing as a "free world",
+but I am optimistic that it is getting "freer" (as in
+freedom, not free beer ... <grin> )
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 4:46 PM
+> To: Page, Bill
+> Cc: 'root'; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; Tim Daly
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Axiom book (partially) available?
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Bill,
+> 
+> "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+> 
+> > I have the resources to produce a scanned PDF format
+> > copy of the AXIOM book. 
+> 
+> Beware of copyright issues. While Tim has the source of the 
+> text of the book and the rights to produce a new version,
+> the layout of the original book is still copyrighted by its
+> publisher.
+> 
+> I don't remember the duration of copyright until it falls in 
+> the public domain but I doubt the copyright on the original
+> Axiom book is expired.
+> 
+> In short: you can't do that except if you have the written
+> consent of the publisher.
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> 
+> PS : According to the Gutenberg project, the copyright
+>      duration is 50 years after the death of the author.
+>      There is no such thing as a free world.
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:01:43 -0400 
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'texmacs-dev@gnu.org'" <texmacs-dev@gnu.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+
+TeXmacs Developers;
+
+I have posted a new version of tm_axiom to the Axiom
+web site. See Axiom_Texmacs 1.0.2 at
+
+    http://savannah.nongnu.org/files/?group=axiom
+
+This version is compatible with the recent alpha release
+of Axiom/OS (i.e. Axiom / Open Source. We need an
+appropriate name for this new version of Axiom. What do
+you think?). It expects only one initial prompt from
+Axiom, not two like the older version of Axiom. It also
+incorporates the sophisticated LaTeX equation line breaking
+algorithm that was developed specifically for use with
+Axiom by Robert Sutor (a major contributor to Axiom).
+
+I have two questions. First, I would like to be able to
+pass some command line options to the tm_axiom program
+when it is started by TeXmacs. Specifically, for compatiblity
+with the older version of Axiom, it would be nice to be
+able to adjust the number of intial prompts, for example
+by setting it to 2 for the NAG commercial version. Another
+option might be setting the line break length. Right now
+the value of 4.5 inches is hard coded.
+
+Assuming I can pass these options, the next issue is how
+to conveniently set them inside of TeXmacs. The number
+of initial prompts only needs to be set when the Axiom
+interface is installed or changed. But the line break
+length should be easily adjusted by the user and must
+relate to a parameter already maintained automatically by
+TeXmacs and stored with each document.
+
+The second question I have is: What is the best approach
+to implement a new Session menu option that would
+re-execute all of the sessions contained in a document?
+This is a very common operation when using TeXmacs as
+a "worksheet" interface to computer algebra systems. It
+needs to be able to re-execute all of the embedded
+session commands (for Axiom and other external systems)
+starting from the top of the document and working down
+to the end. It must make only the minimum change to the
+document to update all of the session outputs without
+introducing any new session inputs.
+
+Should I try to do this through a scheme script? (Oh no,
+more stuff to learn ... <sigh>).
+
+Any help and/or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Joris van der Hoeven [mailto:vdhoeven@texmacs.org]
+> Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 4:46 PM
+> To: texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+> 
+> > > OK, I will try that soon.
+> >
+> > Tim reminded me that this build may not work on any kind of 
+> > linux. Mine is debian 3.0 i686.
+> >
+> > In any case, we will try to upload several builds on different
+> > system. What is your linux system (distribution, version)?
+> 
+> I will ask tomorrow; I am abroad...
+> 
+
+\start
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 13:57:20 -0400 
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'root'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Axiom book (partially) available?
+
+Tim,
+
+I have the resources to produce a scanned PDF format
+copy of the AXIOM book. The result will be a rather
+large file (approx. 10 - 20 Mbytes, I guess). In scanned
+PDF format, each page is represented as an image. The
+system I use normally uses Group IV tiff encoding for
+black and white pages, so the result is about 20 Kbytes
+per page x 750 pages. Maybe I could set it up for download
+as one file per chapter (15 chapters) - about 1 Mbyte
+per chapter.
+
+I think that inspite of it's "age" the quality of this
+book is very high and would go a long way to satisfying
+the demand! for Axiom documentation that releasing the
+alpha version has created. Of course this doesn't negate
+the desirability of creating (and publishing!) a newer
+up to date version. But maybe it would take some of the
+pressure off ...
+
+Let me know what you think. I could have it uploaded to
+the files section of the Axiom web site later tonight
+if you think that this would be ok.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr]
+> Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 3:17 PM
+> To: Tim Daly
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] Axiom book (partially) available?
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Tim,
+> 
+> Is the Axiom book available (even partially) on CVS? Maybe people can
+> start reading the first chapters while you finish it?
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+
+\start
+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 02:31:03 +0200
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>, <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+
+Tim,
+
+what's wrong with those algebra files? I could compile
+them with no changes.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Tim Daly [mailto:daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu] 
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 6:59 PM
+> To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+> 
+> 
+> David,
+> 
+> The missing algebra is not "fixed" yet. The problem is 
+> slightly more subtle. 
+> 
+> Tim
+> axiom@tenkan.org
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
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+To: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Fix for Macroexpansion bug
+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BA@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 19:34:16 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BA@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+	(Juergen Weiss's message of "Wed, 1 Oct 2003 19:00:34 +0200")
+Message-ID: <874qysg8vb.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+"Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+
+> I compiled all the algebra files a while ago. The problem
+> had been the out-of-date database files. It's not related
+> to the macroexpansion problem. I posted the
+> results to the list at that time 
+> (http://www.uni-mainz.de/~weiss/axiom.algebra.jw.20030810.tgz).
+
+Once again, thanks.
+
+I have updated [bug #5379] Missing algebra (was: package
+CombinatorialFunction (COMBF) is missing).
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=5379&group_id=2938
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
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+Subject: RE: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site 
+Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 20:08:53 +0200
+Message-ID: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BB@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+Thread-Topic: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site 
+Thread-Index: AcOH7q1wlkdIfPLoQdi1J+ELV4+ZCQAVPdQQ
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "Mark Murray" <mark@grondar.org>, <daly@idsi.net>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 18:09:03.0793 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[18E08A10:01C38847]
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, smustudent1@yahoo.com,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
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+
+I would also argue in favor of unbundling the lisp system
+(gcl). It's not a problem to load compiled C code (for 
+example socket extensions) into a lisp system (Camm already
+posted the code). It bloats the Axiom distribution
+unnecessarily. Eventually we had to add CMU distributions
+and others. For commercial lisps on the other hand we
+can't do it. The Debian and the FreeBSD package system
+take care of dependencies. So it was certainly necessary
+to add gcl in the beginning to get started on equal level.
+With the necessary fixes/patches applied to gcl it will
+not be necessary with the future.
+
+With respect to the build system: Generating the lisp
+part of Axiom is not very demanding with respect to
+the build system. But as soon as the graphics and
+dispatcher and other C code comes in, we will probably
+need autoconfig and/or configure on the long run. We 
+have to figure out, where X resides, if signal handling
+is BSD or SYSV etc. But that's not very pressing at 
+the moment.
+
+What we should change immediately is, that the make
+variables are not handed down from the toplevel make
+step by step. The variables (ENV) should be in a
+Makefile.inc, which will get included by every make
+file. This will allow to call make in src/interp
+or src/algebra selectively during development.
+
+Regards
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Mark Murray [mailto:mark@grondar.org] 
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 9:14 AM
+> To: daly@idsi.net
+> Cc: camm@enhanced.com; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; 
+> smustudent1@yahoo.com; gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for 
+> Axiom web site 
+> 
+> 
+> root writes:
+> > I don't understand why it is important to use an already installed
+> > lisp image.  It seems likely to be yet-another-source-of-trouble
+> > like the X library issues. What am I missing?
+> 
+> The already-installed lisp versions (may) have been hacked to
+> actually work, and they may be standard didtributions of the lisp
+> compiler distributed by the OS vendor (.rpm, .deb or FreeBSD "port"
+> files).
+> 
+> The Axiom copy of lisp is a fork, and an incompatible one to boot,
+> so us OS people (well, me anyway - I'm with FreeBSD) are trying to
+> use the one that we already have to get things to work.
+> 
+> After all, when you get (say) X, it doesn't come bundled with the
+> version of GCC that the XFree86 folks have certified that it will
+> compile with, right? Instead, over time #ifdef hell has developed,
+> and configuration stuff has been done to make sure that whatever
+> package it is has been put together to work with whatever you already
+> have, as far as practical. Sometimes, of course you have to bail out
+> and say things like "This needs an ANSI C compiler, K&R won't work,
+> ever!", but bolting every tool that is needed onto the side of the
+> package concerned is overkill IMO.
+> 
+> I hear what you say about the extensions, and I understand why you
+> need them; are Camm's proposals not suitable?
+> 
+> That's the way I'm thinking :-)
+> 
+> M
+> --
+> Mark Murray
+> iumop ap!sdn w,I idlaH
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 04:22:15 2003
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+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:21:09 +0200
+Message-ID: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BD@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+Thread-Topic: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+Thread-Index: AcOIf9MTmVQhL5kaTNq4Wl6neVE+hwAPcFBw
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Oct 2003 08:21:10.0041 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[227EE090:01C388BE]
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Sorry, I missunderstood your email. I thought, that there
+were still other problems.
+
+Regards
+
+Juergen
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net] 
+> Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 2:55 AM
+> To: Weiss, Juergen
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; david.mentre@wanadoo.fr; axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Missing algebra
+> 
+> 
+> Juergen,
+> 
+> Time, mostly. The algebra files reference interval. I got interval to
+> compile and now have to finish the cleanup task. I'm working on that
+> in my local build subtree but haven't completed or tested it. Other
+> tasks are being pushed ahead of it (I uploaded a fix for "algebra
+> sources in mnt" on monday, (tuesday was an anniversary so I slacked a
+> bit).  I'm currently cleaning up the "makes" in Makefiles and writing
+> a FAQ entry for the "installed lisp" issue.  Next I will apply the
+> Macro patch you sent and set up a build/test/release cycle overnight)
+> but progress is being made. It should happen RSN (real soon now), that
+> is, once I do the next cleanup of my subtree, test it, polish it for
+> upload, and upload it. I haven't forgotten it. Indeed, the main reason
+> I wanted David to leave it as a bug was that I wanted to have a record
+> that it is still an outstanding issue.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 05:14:41 2003
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:12:16 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: "Bill. Page1 E-mail\"" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on
+	stderr
+Message-ID: <20031002101216.B17384@nag.co.uk>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D18@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+In-Reply-To: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D18@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>;
+	from Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca on Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at 12:01:43PM -0400
+Cc: "'axiom-developer@nongnu.org'" <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>,
+	"'texmacs-dev@gnu.org'" <texmacs-dev@gnu.org>
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+
+Hi Bill,
+
+There seems to be a misconception that the NAG version of Axiom puts out
+two prompts on startup while the Open version puts out one.  This is not
+actually true: the Axiom interpreter (invoked via the command `AXIOMsys'
+in the NAG version, and presumably via `axiom' in your version) only
+puts out one prompt: the reason you can see two is that sman (the
+"Superman" process that manages communication between the interpreter,
+hyperdoc, browser, graphics etc.) causes the interpreter to start a new
+frame, which forces a new prompt (you can do the same by typing ")frame
+new foo").  Once Tim gets sman working the Open version will presumably
+work in the same way.  So your new tm_axiom ought to work the same way
+with both versions if they are invoked in the equivalent way.
+
+I haven't seen the TeXmacs interface to Axiom but we used to maintain a
+TeX-based interface under Windows (based on IBM's TechExplorer) and it
+had lots of nice features - a TeX version of the browser, the ability to
+execute worksheets etc.  Some of this code was embedded in the front-end
+but the browser code, for example, was all in boot.  The main file in
+question was br-saturn.boot ("saturn" was IBM's pre-release name for
+TechExplorer) and we also used the $saturn variable to test whether we
+were in TechExplorer or not in a few places (this was so we could use
+the same CCL image files for both the TechExplorer and shell interfaces
+of Axiom under Windows).  It might be worth somebody trying to resurrect
+this code - the only hitch I can foresee is that we added a grep command
+to CCL (coded in C) since Windows doesn't have a grep program, but you
+can always spawn off a system command under Unix (which is what the
+original IBM version of Axiom did) to get the same result.
+
+Mike.
+
+On Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at 12:01:43PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> TeXmacs Developers;
+> 
+> I have posted a new version of tm_axiom to the Axiom
+> web site. See Axiom_Texmacs 1.0.2 at
+> 
+>     http://savannah.nongnu.org/files/?group=axiom
+> 
+> This version is compatible with the recent alpha release
+> of Axiom/OS (i.e. Axiom / Open Source. We need an
+> appropriate name for this new version of Axiom. What do
+> you think?). It expects only one initial prompt from
+> Axiom, not two like the older version of Axiom. It also
+> incorporates the sophisticated LaTeX equation line breaking
+> algorithm that was developed specifically for use with
+> Axiom by Robert Sutor (a major contributor to Axiom).
+> 
+> I have two questions. First, I would like to be able to
+> pass some command line options to the tm_axiom program
+> when it is started by TeXmacs. Specifically, for compatiblity
+> with the older version of Axiom, it would be nice to be
+> able to adjust the number of intial prompts, for example
+> by setting it to 2 for the NAG commercial version. Another
+> option might be setting the line break length. Right now
+> the value of 4.5 inches is hard coded.
+> 
+> Assuming I can pass these options, the next issue is how
+> to conveniently set them inside of TeXmacs. The number
+> of initial prompts only needs to be set when the Axiom
+> interface is installed or changed. But the line break
+> length should be easily adjusted by the user and must
+> relate to a parameter already maintained automatically by
+> TeXmacs and stored with each document.
+> 
+> The second question I have is: What is the best approach
+> to implement a new Session menu option that would
+> re-execute all of the sessions contained in a document?
+> This is a very common operation when using TeXmacs as
+> a "worksheet" interface to computer algebra systems. It
+> needs to be able to re-execute all of the embedded
+> session commands (for Axiom and other external systems)
+> starting from the top of the document and working down
+> to the end. It must make only the minimum change to the
+> document to update all of the session outputs without
+> introducing any new session inputs.
+> 
+> Should I try to do this through a scheme script? (Oh no,
+> more stuff to learn ... <sigh>).
+> 
+> Any help and/or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
+> 
+> Regards,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> 
+> > -----Original Message-----
+> > From: Joris van der Hoeven [mailto:vdhoeven@texmacs.org]
+> > Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 4:46 PM
+> > To: texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+> > Subject: Re: [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+> > 
+> > > > OK, I will try that soon.
+> > >
+> > > Tim reminded me that this build may not work on any kind of 
+> > > linux. Mine is debian 3.0 i686.
+> > >
+> > > In any case, we will try to upload several builds on different
+> > > system. What is your linux system (distribution, version)?
+> > 
+> > I will ask tomorrow; I am abroad...
+> > 
+> > 
+> > 
+> > _______________________________________________
+> > Texmacs-dev mailing list
+> > Texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+> > http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/texmacs-dev
+> > 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> ________________________________________________________________________
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+
+
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:31:23 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: axiom@tenkan.org
+Message-ID: <20031002103123.C17384@nag.co.uk>
+References: <200310011744.h91Hiu419046@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+In-Reply-To: <200310011744.h91Hiu419046@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>;
+	from daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu on Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at
+	01:44:56PM -0400
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Scanned image of book
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+We own the copyright but there is also a question of Springer's rights
+to the printed version.  I'm no lawyer but it appears that the book is
+still in print in the US so you could be treading on thin ice by
+publishing a scanned version on the web.  My advice would be not to do
+it.
+
+In any case it seems crazy to go down this route when you could just
+make a pdf from the (more up-to-date than published) TeX sources that
+you have.  In principle all that you need to do is go to the
+development/src/doc/htex directory and run `latex book', however the
+version of LaTeX that you really need is a 12 year old IBM installation
+so you will have some font and style file issues I'm afraid. There are
+some fonts in the doc/dvips directory which may help.
+
+Cheers, Mike.
+
+
+On Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at 01:44:56PM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> Mike,
+> 
+> Does NAG own the copyright to the Axiom book?
+> I know the words were released under the Modified BSD.
+> Bill Page has offered to upload a scanned image of the book
+> for use while the new one is being written.
+> Will NAG allow that?
+> 
+> Tim
+> axiom@tenkan.org
+> 
+> ________________________________________________________________________
+> This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The
+> service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive
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+
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+
+
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:27:55 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: weiss@uni-mainz.de
+In-reply-to: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BB@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+	(weiss@uni-mainz.de)
+Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New design for Axiom web site
+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4BB@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, mark@grondar.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	smustudent1@yahoo.com, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org
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+
+Juergen,
+
+I'll look at this question later today.
+
+
+> What we should change immediately is, that the make
+> variables are not handed down from the toplevel make
+> step by step. The variables (ENV) should be in a
+> Makefile.inc, which will get included by every make
+> file. This will allow to call make in src/interp
+> or src/algebra selectively during development.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 09:58:53 2003
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:14:09 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021314.h92DE9h31219@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54he2tt1so.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 01 Oct 2003 11:28:39 -0400)
+References: <200310011242.h91CgjYJ082385@grimreaper.grondar.org>
+	<200310011305.h91D5Uf00904@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54he2tt1so.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Aurelian
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+7) Has Aurelian been in touch with you?
+
+Who is Aurelian?
+
+TIm
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 09:59:05 2003
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:08:44 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021308.h92D8iP30831@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: weiss@uni-mainz.de
+In-reply-to: <200310021128.h92BSoa18331@localhost.localdomain> (message from
+	root on Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:28:50 -0400)
+Subject: Re: [weiss@uni-mainz.de: RE: [Gcl-devel] Re: [Axiom-developer] New
+	design for Axiom web site]
+References: <200310021128.h92BSoa18331@localhost.localdomain>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Juergen,
+
+I looked at the idea of including the ENV information directly into
+the lower level Makefiles rather than passing it down the make chain.
+The problem is that the make chain sets up more than just the shell
+variable environment. The parent makefile ensures that the required
+target directories exist and that all other subdirectories are up 
+to date. If you try to invoke make in a subdirectory the results are
+uncertain.
+
+If you want to try this you could, though I don't recommend, put the
+ENV variables in your shell and then invoke make. According to plan
+the use of {} around the variables allows them to be overridden by
+shell variables.
+
+I have a scheme with will allow you to type:
+make PART=algebra
+(where algebra is any one of the subdirectories).
+This will force the make chain to walk the direct
+path to the named subdirectory. This should achieve what you want.
+I'll put it on the TODO list.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 12:48:39 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Aurelian
+References: <200310011242.h91CgjYJ082385@grimreaper.grondar.org>
+	<200310011305.h91D5Uf00904@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54he2tt1so.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310021314.h92DE9h31219@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 18:46:33 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310021314.h92DE9h31219@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:14:09 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87y8w3fuza.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
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+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 16:48:37 -0000
+
+Hello Tim,
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> 7) Has Aurelian been in touch with you?
+>
+> Who is Aurelian?
+
+Aurelien Chanudet <ralubrik@yahoo.fr>, the guy who is porting GCL to
+MacOS X.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 13:23:43 2003
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+	id D712D12ADAA; Thu,  2 Oct 2003 19:20:57 +0200 (CEST)
+From: michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:23:24 +0200
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
+Content-transfer-encoding: Quoted-printable
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Axiom short term roadmap
+Message-ID: <3F7C7B2C.31043.6CA966@localhost>
+Priority: normal
+In-reply-to: <87isn8ek31.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 17:23:40 -0000
+
+Hello,
+ 
+> I have started to list tasks that need to be done for a first stable
+> release of Axiom. You'll find them at:
+> Some remaining tasks I'm hesitating to put as target for this initial
+> release:
+>  
+>  - external gcl
+> 
+>  - various ports (MacOS X, FreeBSD, Windows, ...)
+
+To extend the basis of users, I think Windows port would be urgent. I 
+probably misunderstood some messages, I thought it was almost done? What 
+is the present state of the port, and what are the remaining problems?
+
+Best wishes,
+
+Michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+http://www.univ-orleans.fr/EXT/ASTEX
+ftp://ftp.univ-orleans.fr/pub/tex/PC/AsTeX
+liste de discussion: astex@univ-orleans.fr
+Abonnement =E0 la liste: envoyer un message de contenu
+"sub astex Nom Prenom Etablissement" =E0 sympa@univ-orleans.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 13:32:36 2003
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 12:54:14 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021654.h92GsEt12920@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] kudos
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 17:32:35 -0000
+
+Please add Mark Murray to the website kudos list.
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 13:33:14 2003
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+	Thu, 2 Oct 2003 12:54:52 -0400
+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 12:54:52 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Cc: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] kudos
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 17:33:12 -0000
+
+Could someone volunteer to tar up the latest CVS as a source tarball
+and post it on the download page?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 13:43:29 2003
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:04:57 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021704.h92H4v714241@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] windows
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+
+On my desk, at least, the windows port is stalled waiting a running GCL
+under mingw. This probably exists but I don't have it yet.
+
+A similar pipeline burble exists with the iMac port. Camm has suggested
+downloading Version_2_6_1 which I plan to do later this afternoon.
+
+The Mandrake port is hanging on a missing shared library.
+
+The SuSE port is hanging on an installation hitch. Plus my SuSE version
+is 6.4 due to the fact that I can't find iso images online and I can't
+connect the machine to the net for a network install.
+
+The BSD port is awaiting the result of Mark Murray's work as I'm
+letting him do the heavy lifting there.
+
+And the SCO Unixware port is waiting until the weather in hell
+rivals that in heaven.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 14:03:43 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310021803.h92I3hu18521@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] GCL for iMac
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+
+Ok, I did a co -r Version_2_6_1
+What machine is the iMac OS X supposed to be?
+The configure script didn't figure it out.
+
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310021803.h92I3hu18521@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 02 Oct 2003 16:08:09 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310021803.h92I3hu18521@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <543cebo11y.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 191
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, Aurelien Chanudet <ralubrik@yahoo.fr>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] GCL for iMac
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hi Tim!
+
+First I'm told you need to configure with
+
+./configure --enable-debug --enable-machine=powerpc-macosx
+--disable-statsysbfd --enable-custreloc
+
+I haven't yet merged in a few of Aurelian's proposed patches, hope too
+soon -- here is his last email on the subject.  Please let me know how
+it goes.  I'll add configure defaults for this platform if it works
+for you.  Over the long run, we'd rather link with statsysbfd.
+
+=============================================================================
+Hi,
+
+You might want to try the following steps to build GCL on Mac OS
+X. Note that this port is premature and that I haven't tested it with
+Axiom. Stratified garbage collection is not yet fully supported (need
+to retrieve the page fault address).
+
+Please, keep me posted on how this goes !
+
+Aurelien
+
+---
+
+1- Get the latest CVS release (2.7.0).
+
+2- Assuming bash, configure your shell as follows :
+
+ulimit -n 512
+
+if [ -z "$LIBRARY_PATH" ]; then
+    export LIBRARY_PATH=/sw/lib
+else
+    export LIBRARY_PATH=/sw/lib:$LIBRARY_PATH
+fi
+export LIBRARY_PATH
+
+if [ -z "$C_INCLUDE_PATH" ]; then
+     C_INCLUDE_PATH=/sw/include
+else
+     C_INCLUDE_PATH=/sw/include:$C_INCLUDE_PATH
+fi
+export C_INCLUDE_PATH
+
+export CPPFLAGS="-no-cpp-precomp"
+
+The /sw tricks are used to enable readline support (/sw is Fink's root).
+
+3- Apply the following patches :
+
+--- o/main.c      4 Sep 2003 03:09:39 -0000       1.30
++++ o/main.c      4 Sep 2003 21:52:28 -0000
+@@ -111,6 +111,11 @@
+      struct rlimit rl;
+  #endif
+
++#if defined(DARWIN)
++        extern void init_darwin_zone_compat ();
++        init_darwin_zone_compat ();
++#endif
++
+  #ifdef RECREATE_HEAP
+      RECREATE_HEAP
+  #endif
+
+--- o/unixfasl.c  15 Feb 2003 00:38:28 -0000      1.4
++++ o/unixfasl.c  4 Sep 2003 21:53:16 -0000
+@@ -282,7 +282,7 @@
+  static int
+  faslink(object faslfile, object ldargstring)
+  {
+-#if defined(__linux__) && defined(__ELF__)
++#if (defined(__linux__) && defined(__ELF__)) || defined(DARWIN)
+    FEerror("faslink() not supported for ELF yet",0);
+    return 0;
+  #else
+
+--- unixport/makefile    4 Sep 2003 03:09:39 -0000       1.45
++++ unixport/makefile    4 Sep 2003 21:54:00 -0000
+@@ -17,6 +17,7 @@
+
+  libgclp.a: $(ODIR)/gcllib.a
+         cp $< $@
++       ranlib $@
+
+  gmpfiles: $(shell find ../$(GMPDIR) -name "*.o" |grep -v '\.lib')
+         rm -rf gmp
+@@ -80,15 +81,15 @@
+  init_%.lsp: init_%.lsp.tmp
+
+         cat $< | sed \
+-               -e "s,@LI-VERS@,(`cat ../majvers`.`cat ../minvers`)
+`date`,1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-MINVERS@,`cat ../minvers`,1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-MAJVERS@,`cat ../majvers`,1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-CC@,\"$(CC) -c $(FINAL_CFLAGS)\",1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-LD@,\"$(CC) -o \",1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-LD-LIBS@,\"$(LD_LIBS_PRE) -l$*
+$(LD_LIBS_POST)\",1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-OPT-THREE@,\"$(O3FLAGS)\",1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-OPT-TWO@,\"$(O2FLAGS)\",1" \
+-               -e "s,@LI-INIT-LSP@,\"$@\",1" >$@
++               -e "s,@LI-VERS@,(`cat ../majvers`.`cat ../minvers`)
+`date`," \
++               -e "s,@LI-MINVERS@,`cat ../minvers`," \
++               -e "s,@LI-MAJVERS@,`cat ../majvers`," \
++               -e "s,@LI-CC@,\"$(CC) -c $(FINAL_CFLAGS)\"," \
++               -e "s,@LI-LD@,\"$(CC) -o \"," \
++               -e "s,@LI-LD-LIBS@,\"$(LD_LIBS_PRE) -l$*
+$(LD_LIBS_POST)\"," \
++               -e "s,@LI-OPT-THREE@,\"$(O3FLAGS)\"," \
++               -e "s,@LI-OPT-TWO@,\"$(O2FLAGS)\"," \
++               -e "s,@LI-INIT-LSP@,\"$@\"," >$@
+
+  saved_%:raw_% $(RSYM) init_%.lsp \
+                 $(CMPDIR)/cmpmain.lsp \
+@@ -108,21 +109,21 @@
+
+  libgcl.a: $(FIRST_FILE) $(OBJS) sys_gcl.o $(LAST_FILE) gmpfiles
+bfdfiles
+         rm -rf $@
+-       ar rs $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd -name "*.o")
++       libtool -static -o $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd
+-name "*.o")
+
+  libxgcl.a: libgcl.a
+         ln -snf $< $@
+
+  libansi_gcl.a: $(FIRST_FILE) $(OBJS) $(ANSIOBJS) sys_ansi_gcl.o
+$(LAST_FILE) gmpfiles bfdfiles
+         rm -rf $@
+-       ar rs $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd -name "*.o")
++       libtool -static -o $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd
+-name "*.o")
+
+  libpcl_gcl.a: $(FIRST_FILE) $(OBJS) $(PCLOBJS) sys_pcl_gcl.o
+$(LAST_FILE) gmpfiles bfdfiles
+         rm -rf $@
+-       ar rs $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd -name "*.o")
++       libtool -static -o $@ $(filter %.o,$^) $(shell find gmp bfd
+-name "*.o")
+
+  raw_%: lib%.a libgclp.a $(SYSTEM_OBJS) $(EXTRAS)
+-       $(CC) -o raw_$*$(EXE) $(filter %.o,$^) \
++       $(CC) -Wl,-headerpad,1f000 -o raw_$*$(EXE) $(filter %.o,$^) \
+                 -L. $(EXTRA_LD_LIBS) $(LD_LIBS_PRE) -l$* $(LD_LIBS_POST)
+
+  clean:
+
+4- Configure with :
+
+./configure --enable-debug --enable-machine=powerpc-macosx
+--disable-statsysbfd --enable-custreloc
+
+
+
+_______________________________________________
+Gcl-devel mailing list
+Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+
+
+=============================================================================
+
+
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Ok, I did a co -r Version_2_6_1
+> What machine is the iMac OS X supposed to be?
+> The configure script didn't figure it out.
+> 
+> Tim Daly
+> axiom@tenkan.org
+> daly@idsi.net
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 16:34:19 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Aurelian
+References: <200310011242.h91CgjYJ082385@grimreaper.grondar.org>
+	<200310011305.h91D5Uf00904@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54he2tt1so.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310021314.h92DE9h31219@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 02 Oct 2003 16:33:28 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310021314.h92DE9h31219@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <54d6dfbcrr.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 27
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+
+Hi Tim!  The Mac OS X GCL developer.  I think you wrote to him
+earlier?  I cc'ed him on the imac email I sent you earlier today.
+Please let me know if you need/want his address.
+
+Take care,
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> 7) Has Aurelian been in touch with you?
+> 
+> Who is Aurelian?
+> 
+> TIm
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 16:41:05 2003
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+Thread-Topic: hypertex viewer
+Thread-Index: AcOJJWxqd6wE2UCETDaV8VtP/MNP+Q==
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Oct 2003 20:40:23.0995 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[678328B0:01C38925]
+Cc: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] hypertex viewer
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 20:41:03 -0000
+
+Would it be possible to use texmacs as an hypertexviewer?
+It supports math, links.. 
+
+Juergen
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Date: 02 Oct 2003 23:45:41 +0200
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Fix for case in filenames
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+
+
+The following patch preserves case in filenames during
+the build process.
+
+Index: util.lisp.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/interp/util.lisp.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.1
+diff -c -r1.1 util.lisp.pamphlet
+*** util.lisp.pamphlet	28 Aug 2003 14:23:40 -0000	1.1
+--- util.lisp.pamphlet	2 Oct 2003 21:39:10 -0000
+***************
+*** 44,50 ****
+  #+:AKCL
+    (in-package "BOOT")
+    (push :oldboot *features*)
+!   (mapcar #'load-a-file load-files)
+    (make-depsys lsp src int obj mnt sys)
+    (initroot spad)
+    #+:AKCL
+--- 44,50 ----
+  #+:AKCL
+    (in-package "BOOT")
+    (push :oldboot *features*)
+!   (mapcar #'load load-files)
+    (make-depsys lsp src int obj mnt sys)
+    (initroot spad)
+    #+:AKCL
+***************
+*** 131,137 ****
+  		      :array 400 :string 500 :cfun 100 :cpages 1000
+  		      :rpages 1000 :hole 2000)
+    <<compiler-notes>>
+!   (mapcar #'load-a-file load-files)
+    (|resetWorkspaceVariables|)
+    (|initHist|)
+    (|initNewWorld|)
+--- 131,137 ----
+  		      :array 400 :string 500 :cfun 100 :cpages 1000
+  		      :rpages 1000 :hole 2000)
+    <<compiler-notes>>
+!   (mapcar #'load load-files)
+    (|resetWorkspaceVariables|)
+    (|initHist|)
+    (|initNewWorld|)
+***************
+*** 142,159 ****
+  #+:CCL
+    (resethashtables)
+    (setq *load-verbose* nil)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| comp-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						     comp-files))
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| parse-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						      parse-files))
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| browse-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						       browse-files))
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| translate-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						       translate-files))
+!   (|setNAGBootAutloadProperties| nagbr-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						       nagbr-files))
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| asauto-functions (mapcar #'filename-downcase
+! 						       asauto-files))
+    (setf (symbol-function 'boot::|addConsDB|) #'identity)
+    (resethashtables) ; the databases into core, then close the streams
+   )
+--- 142,153 ----
+  #+:CCL
+    (resethashtables)
+    (setq *load-verbose* nil)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| comp-functions comp-files)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| parse-functions parse-files)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| browse-functions browse-files)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| translate-functions translate-files)
+!   (|setNAGBootAutloadProperties| nagbr-functions nagbr-files)
+!   (|setBootAutloadProperties| asauto-functions asauto-files)
+    (setf (symbol-function 'boot::|addConsDB|) #'identity)
+    (resethashtables) ; the databases into core, then close the streams
+   )
+Index: Makefile.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.3
+diff -c -r1.3 Makefile.pamphlet
+*** Makefile.pamphlet	5 Sep 2003 22:14:19 -0000	1.3
+--- Makefile.pamphlet	2 Oct 2003 21:39:11 -0000
+***************
+*** 525,531 ****
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/nocompil")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/util")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(in-package "BOOT")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+! 	@ echo '(build-depsys (quote (${DEP})) "${SPAD}" "${GCLDIR}" "${SRC}" "${INT}" "${OBJ}" "${MNT}" "${SYS}")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(unless (probe-file "${OUT}/postpar.${O}") (compile-file "${OUT}/postpar.${LISP}" :output-file "${OUT}/postpar.${O}"))' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/postpar")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(unless (probe-file "${OUT}/parse.${O}") (compile-file "${OUT}/parse.${LISP}" :output-file "${OUT}/parse.${O}"))' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+--- 525,531 ----
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/nocompil")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/util")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(in-package "BOOT")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+! 	@ echo '(build-depsys (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${DEP}))) "${SPAD}" "${GCLDIR}" "${SRC}" "${INT}" "${OBJ}" "${MNT}" "${SYS}")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(unless (probe-file "${OUT}/postpar.${O}") (compile-file "${OUT}/postpar.${LISP}" :output-file "${OUT}/postpar.${O}"))' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(load "${OUT}/postpar")' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+  	@ echo '(unless (probe-file "${OUT}/parse.${O}") (compile-file "${OUT}/parse.${LISP}" :output-file "${OUT}/parse.${O}"))' >> ${OUT}/makedep.lisp
+***************
+*** 599,605 ****
+  	@ echo '(in-package "BOOT")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ touch ${TIMESTAMP}
+  	@ echo '${YEARWEEK}' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+! 	@ echo '(build-interpsys (append (quote (${OBJS})) (quote (${ASCOMP})) (quote (${INOBJS}))) (quote (${OPOBJS})) (quote (${OCOBJS})) (quote (${BROBJS})) (quote (${TRANOBJS})) (quote (${NAGBROBJS})) (quote (${ASAUTO}))  "${SPAD}"  "${LSP}" "${SRC}" "${INT}" "${OBJ}" "${MNT}" "${SYS}")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ echo '(in-package "SCRATCHPAD-COMPILER")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  #	@ echo '(|shoeInternFile| "${MNT}/${SYS}/doc/msgs/co-eng.msgs")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ echo '(boot::set-restart-hook)' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+--- 599,605 ----
+  	@ echo '(in-package "BOOT")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ touch ${TIMESTAMP}
+  	@ echo '${YEARWEEK}' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+! 	@ echo '(build-interpsys (append (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${OBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${ASCOMP}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${INOBJS})))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${OPOBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${OCOBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${BROBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${TRANOBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${NAGBROBJS}))) (quote ($(patsubst %, "%", ${ASAUTO})))  "${SPAD}"  "${LSP}" "${SRC}" "${INT}" "${OBJ}" "${MNT}" "${SYS}")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ echo '(in-package "SCRATCHPAD-COMPILER")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  #	@ echo '(|shoeInternFile| "${MNT}/${SYS}/doc/msgs/co-eng.msgs")' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+  	@ echo '(boot::set-restart-hook)' >> ${OUT}/makeint.lisp
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 17:59:43 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Weiss, Juergen'" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] hypertex viewer
+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 17:53:43 -0400
+Message-ID: <000001c3892f$a8b09980$6501a8c0@Asus>
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+
+Juergen,
+
+My answer would be "yes, in principle".
+
+TeXmacs is quite sophisticatd in the way it displays
+mathematics and it has a fairly good facility to import
+LaTeX files but it's internal file format is not based
+on LaTeX. We would have to convert the existing files
+to TeXmacs format and fix the links etc.
+
+With the ability of TeXmacs to actually execute Axiom
+commands and to serve as a "worksheet" interface to
+Axiom, I think it would be a natural thing to have it
+do the hypertex browsing as well.
+
+I would be willing to try to convert some of the
+existing files to TeXmacs format as an experiment.
+Where can I get the files?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Weiss, Juergen
+> Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 4:40 PM
+> To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] hypertex viewer
+> 
+> 
+> Would it be possible to use texmacs as an hypertexviewer?
+> It supports math, links.. 
+> 
+> Juergen
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+> weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
+> +49(6131)39-26407
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org 
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-> developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:07:57 -0700
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+From: Jaap Weel <weel@caltech.edu>
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Missing files in tarball
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Using =A0=A0axiom-debian-3.0-linux-i386-cvs-2003-09-28.tar.gz
+
+(1) -> )copyright
+cat: /home/weel/axiom/mnt/linux/lib/copyright: No such file or directory
+(1) -> )quit
+
+
+This seems like a very minor problem that's purely there because the 
+tarball had the lib/ directory removed entirely. Maybe the copyright 
+file should go somewhere else?
+
+	/jaap
+
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
+Jaap Weel                   Campus address:        | dorm (626) 795-9748
+Caltech, Blacker '05        Caltech MSC #874, Pasadena, CA 91126, U.S.A.
+www.its.caltech.edu/~weel   Permanent address:     | home +31-46-4337033
+E-mail: weel@caltech.edu    Kelderstraat 2-4, 6171 GB Stein, Netherlands
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 02 20:04:28 2003
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+From: "Mike Thomas" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 10:06:07 +1000
+Message-ID: <MFEIIPBIPCKFPICNGIJNIEMMDPAA.mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
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+
+Hi Tim.
+
+| On my desk, at least, the windows port is stalled waiting a running GCL
+| under mingw. This probably exists but I don't have it yet.
+
+A prebuilt 2.6.1 installer is at Camm's temp web site:
+
+         http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/
+
+Cheers
+
+Mike Thomas.
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 01:03:56 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	(InterMail vM.5.01.06.04 201-253-122-130-104-20030726) with ESMTP
+	id <20031003045944.TPKE23449.tomts11-srv.bellnexxia.net@Asus>;
+	Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:59:44 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Mike Thomas'" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>,
+	<daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 00:59:40 -0400
+Message-ID: <000001c3896b$2be379e0$6501a8c0@Asus>
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain;
+	charset="us-ascii"
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
+X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
+X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
+X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024
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+In-Reply-To: <MFEIIPBIPCKFPICNGIJNIEMMDPAA.mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 05:03:53 -0000
+
+Mike,
+
+When I tried the install of prebuild GCL 2.6.1 on my
+Windows XP system I got the following DOS window and
+error message:
+
+-----------
+
+GCL (GNU Common Lisp)  (2.6.1) Fri Sep 19 10:41:07 EAST 2003
+Licensed under GNU Library General Public License
+Dedicated to the memory of W. Schelter
+
+Use (help) to get some basic information on how to use GCL.
+
+Error: Cannot create the file c:/lang/gcl261/bin/gcl.
+Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+Error signalled by LET.
+Broken at OPEN.  Type :H for Help.
+>>
+
+------------
+
+This didn't happen in previous builds. Can I get
+around this somehow?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Mike Thomas
+> Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:06 PM
+> To: daly@idsi.net
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+> 
+> 
+> Hi Tim.
+> 
+> | On my desk, at least, the windows port is stalled waiting a running 
+> | GCL under mingw. This probably exists but I don't have it yet.
+> 
+> A prebuilt 2.6.1 installer is at Camm's temp web site:
+> 
+         http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/
+
+Cheers
+
+Mike Thomas.
+
+
+
+
+_______________________________________________
+Axiom-developer mailing list
+Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 01:19:06 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	for axiom-developer@nongnu.org; Fri, 03 Oct 2003 01:18:30 -0400
+Received: from water ([192.168.180.42])
+	by br-dmz.paradigmgeo.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id h9357ANC001826; 
+	Fri, 3 Oct 2003 15:07:11 +1000
+From: "Mike Thomas" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>, <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 15:20:43 +1000
+Message-ID: <MFEIIPBIPCKFPICNGIJNCENDDPAA.mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 05:19:04 -0000
+
+Hi Bill.
+
+This is a classic example of why I shouldn't test an installer on my build
+machine - there is a hard-wired path problem which I thought I had fixed,
+but...
+
+The workaround seems to be to set the install directory to
+
+  c:/lang/gcl261/
+
+at the start of the installer run, rather than accepting the default.
+
+Sorry for the trouble,
+
+Mike Thomas.
+
+
+| -----Original Message-----
+| From: Bill Page [mailto:bill.page1@sympatico.ca]
+| Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 3:00 PM
+| To: 'Mike Thomas'; daly@idsi.net
+| Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+|
+|
+| Mike,
+|
+| When I tried the install of prebuild GCL 2.6.1 on my
+| Windows XP system I got the following DOS window and
+| error message:
+|
+| -----------
+|
+| GCL (GNU Common Lisp)  (2.6.1) Fri Sep 19 10:41:07 EAST 2003
+| Licensed under GNU Library General Public License
+| Dedicated to the memory of W. Schelter
+|
+| Use (help) to get some basic information on how to use GCL.
+|
+| Error: Cannot create the file c:/lang/gcl261/bin/gcl.
+| Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+| Error signalled by LET.
+| Broken at OPEN.  Type :H for Help.
+| >>
+|
+| ------------
+|
+| This didn't happen in previous builds. Can I get
+| around this somehow?
+|
+| Cheers,
+| Bill Page.
+|
+|
+| > -----Original Message-----
+| > From:
+| > axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org
+| > [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+| > .org] On Behalf Of Mike Thomas
+| > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:06 PM
+| > To: daly@idsi.net
+| > Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| > Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+| >
+| >
+| > Hi Tim.
+| >
+| > | On my desk, at least, the windows port is stalled waiting a running
+| > | GCL under mingw. This probably exists but I don't have it yet.
+| >
+| > A prebuilt 2.6.1 installer is at Camm's temp web site:
+| >
+|          http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/
+|
+| Cheers
+|
+| Mike Thomas.
+|
+|
+|
+|
+| _______________________________________________
+| Axiom-developer mailing list
+| Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+|
+|
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 01:25:15 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1A5IRG-0003nI-UZ
+	for mharc-axiom-developer@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Oct 2003 01:25:14 -0400
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+	id <20031003052435.VZGE23449.tomts11-srv.bellnexxia.net@Asus>;
+	Fri, 3 Oct 2003 01:24:35 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Mike Thomas'" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>,
+	<daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 01:24:32 -0400
+Message-ID: <000101c3896e$a4934a70$6501a8c0@Asus>
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain;
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+X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 05:25:13 -0000
+
+Yes, that did it. Thanks!
+
+> 
+> The workaround seems to be to set the install directory to
+> 
+>   c:/lang/gcl261/
+> 
+> at the start of the installer run, rather than accepting the default.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 01:30:54 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1A5IWk-0006RI-BE
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+	by br-dmz.paradigmgeo.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id h935InNC001909; 
+	Fri, 3 Oct 2003 15:18:51 +1000
+From: "Mike Thomas" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>, <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows - newer package on it's way
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 15:32:21 +1000
+Message-ID: <MFEIIPBIPCKFPICNGIJNOENDDPAA.mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
+Importance: Normal
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 05:30:40 -0000
+
+Hi again.
+
+| This is a classic example of why I shouldn't test an installer on my build
+| machine - there is a hard-wired path problem which I thought I had fixed,
+| but...
+
+In fact I had fixed it, I just realised that I accidentally uploaded an
+older archive.  The new one will hopefully make it onto Camm's site within a
+day.  It will have the date stamp 20030929.
+
+Until then, use that workaround anyway.
+
+Cheers
+
+Mike Thomas.
+
+
+|
+| The workaround seems to be to set the install directory to
+|
+|   c:/lang/gcl261/
+|
+| at the start of the installer run, rather than accepting the default.
+|
+| Sorry for the trouble,
+|
+| Mike Thomas.
+|
+|
+| | -----Original Message-----
+| | From: Bill Page [mailto:bill.page1@sympatico.ca]
+| | Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 3:00 PM
+| | To: 'Mike Thomas'; daly@idsi.net
+| | Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| | Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+| |
+| |
+| | Mike,
+| |
+| | When I tried the install of prebuild GCL 2.6.1 on my
+| | Windows XP system I got the following DOS window and
+| | error message:
+| |
+| | -----------
+| |
+| | GCL (GNU Common Lisp)  (2.6.1) Fri Sep 19 10:41:07 EAST 2003
+| | Licensed under GNU Library General Public License
+| | Dedicated to the memory of W. Schelter
+| |
+| | Use (help) to get some basic information on how to use GCL.
+| |
+| | Error: Cannot create the file c:/lang/gcl261/bin/gcl.
+| | Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+| | Error signalled by LET.
+| | Broken at OPEN.  Type :H for Help.
+| | >>
+| |
+| | ------------
+| |
+| | This didn't happen in previous builds. Can I get
+| | around this somehow?
+| |
+| | Cheers,
+| | Bill Page.
+| |
+| |
+| | > -----Original Message-----
+| | > From:
+| | > axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org
+| | > [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+| | > .org] On Behalf Of Mike Thomas
+| | > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:06 PM
+| | > To: daly@idsi.net
+| | > Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| | > Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] windows
+| | >
+| | >
+| | > Hi Tim.
+| | >
+| | > | On my desk, at least, the windows port is stalled waiting a running
+| | > | GCL under mingw. This probably exists but I don't have it yet.
+| | >
+| | > A prebuilt 2.6.1 installer is at Camm's temp web site:
+| | >
+| |          http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/
+| |
+| | Cheers
+| |
+| | Mike Thomas.
+| |
+| |
+| |
+| |
+| | _______________________________________________
+| | Axiom-developer mailing list
+| | Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| | http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+| |
+| |
+|
+|
+|
+|
+| _______________________________________________
+| Axiom-developer mailing list
+| Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+|
+|
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 12:58:30 2003
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+	id 1A5T7G-0000O1-00; Fri, 03 Oct 2003 18:49:18 +0200
+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310021654.h92GsEt12920@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 18:49:18 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310021654.h92GsEt12920@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 12:54:14 -0400")
+Message-ID: <878yo2clm9.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: kudos
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 16:58:27 -0000
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Please add Mark Murray to the website kudos list.
+
+done.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 13:07:30 2003
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+To: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Fix for case in filenames
+References: <xzdsmmbe2ka.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 19:06:49 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <xzdsmmbe2ka.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE> (Juergen Weiss's
+	message of "02 Oct 2003 23:45:41 +0200")
+Message-ID: <87zngib68m.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
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+
+Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+
+> The following patch preserves case in filenames during
+> the build process.
+
+I have added your patch to the bug database:
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=5059&group_id=2938
+[bug #5059] Axiom does not compile with upshifted characters in path
+
+Could you next time use 'diff -Naur' to produce your patch? Unified diff
+(-u option) is much easier to understand. Moreover, it is the prefered
+form requested by our benevolent dictator (aka Tim).
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 13:09:33 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net, Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] windows
+References: <200310021704.h92H4v714241@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 18:58:31 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310021704.h92H4v714241@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:04:57 -0400")
+Message-ID: <874qyqcl6w.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 17:09:28 -0000
+
+Hello Tim,
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> The Mandrake port is hanging on a missing shared library.
+
+Which library is missing?
+
+> The SuSE port is hanging on an installation hitch. Plus my SuSE version
+> is 6.4 due to the fact that I can't find iso images online and I can't
+> connect the machine to the net for a network install.
+
+SuSE doesn't play the free software game. I don't see why we should do
+free work for them (except of course for ATWD[1]).
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+[1] ATWD: Axiom Total Word Domination
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 13:12:35 2003
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+To: Jaap Weel <weel@caltech.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Missing files in tarball
+References: <E1372174-F524-11D7-ABE9-000A959B403C@caltech.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 19:11:20 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <E1372174-F524-11D7-ABE9-000A959B403C@caltech.edu> (Jaap Weel's
+	message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 15:07:57 -0700")
+Message-ID: <87vfr6b613.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+
+Jaap Weel <weel@caltech.edu> writes:
+
+> (1) -> )copyright
+> cat: /home/weel/axiom/mnt/linux/lib/copyright: No such file or directory
+> (1) -> )quit
+
+I have added the bug to the database:
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=4581&group_id=2938
+[bug #4581] )summary and )copyright does not work
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 13:18:12 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net, Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] kudos
+References: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 19:16:43 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Thu, 2 Oct 2003 12:54:52 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87r81ub5s4.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2003 17:18:03 -0000
+
+Hi Tim,
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Could someone volunteer to tar up the latest CVS as a source tarball
+> and post it on the download page?
+
+Done.
+
+I notice you uploaded an ungzipped (despite its .tgz suffix) source tree
+at the root of the download section.
+
+I have gzipped, renamed and moved it into
+axiom_cvs.pkg/cvs_2003-10-02/axiom-src-cvs-2003-10-02.tar.gz
+
+It is now in the Axiom_cvs section.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 14:54:34 2003
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+	Fri, 3 Oct 2003 14:52:18 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Mike Dewar'" <miked@nag.co.uk>
+Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2003 14:52:17 -0400
+Message-ID: <001501c389df$7ad222d0$6601a8c0@Asus>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
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+
+Mike,
+
+So if I understand you correctly, what TeXmacs really aught
+to do is to invoke just the interpreter via AXIOMsys - not
+the whole "Superman" thing. Right? This way, there will
+always only be one prompt. The fact that TeXmacs used to
+expect two prompts was an accident due to the fact that it
+(incorrectly) invoked more that what is really required for
+the TeXmacs-Axiom interface.
+
+So, both the old and new versions of Axiom should be compatible
+with the new version of the tm_axiom.c program *provided* we
+agree to call the new Axiom interpreter by the name AXIOMsys.
+We should reserve the name 'axiom' for the invoking Superman
+when/if it becomes available in the new open source version.
+
+So far I a very pleased with the combination of TeXmacs and
+Axiom. I am so used to working with a Maple/Matematica style
+"worksheet" interface, that play with the command line mode
+of Axiom (or even Maple for that matter) just seems too awkward.
+And of course TeXmacs has the advantage that it can simultaneously
+interface with a large number of open source computer algebra
+and related packages, include gnuplot, macsyma, R (statistics),
+etc. and *also* Maple - all from one worksheet environment!
+
+The Axiom tutorial tex files that you sent look promising
+for conversion to TeXmacs format. I will spend a bit of time
+on that over the next few days.
+
+Thanks.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Mike Dewar [mailto:miked@nag.co.uk] 
+> Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 5:12 AM
+> To: Bill. Page1 E-mail"
+> Cc: 'texmacs-dev@gnu.org'; 'axiom-developer@nongnu.org'
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] New 
+> tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+> 
+> 
+> Hi Bill,
+> 
+> There seems to be a misconception that the NAG version of 
+> Axiom puts out two prompts on startup while the Open version 
+> puts out one.  This is not actually true: the Axiom 
+> interpreter (invoked via the command `AXIOMsys' in the NAG 
+> version, and presumably via `axiom' in your version) only 
+> puts out one prompt: the reason you can see two is that sman 
+> (the "Superman" process that manages communication between 
+> the interpreter, hyperdoc, browser, graphics etc.) causes the 
+> interpreter to start a new frame, which forces a new prompt 
+> (you can do the same by typing ")frame new foo").  Once Tim 
+> gets sman working the Open version will presumably work in 
+> the same way.  So your new tm_axiom ought to work the same 
+> way with both versions if they are invoked in the equivalent
+> way.
+> 
+> I haven't seen the TeXmacs interface to Axiom but we used to 
+> maintain a TeX-based interface under Windows (based on IBM's 
+> TechExplorer) and it had lots of nice features - a TeX 
+> version of the browser, the ability to execute worksheets 
+> etc.  Some of this code was embedded in the front-end but the 
+> browser code, for example, was all in boot.  The main file in 
+> question was br-saturn.boot ("saturn" was IBM's pre-release name
+> for TechExplorer) and we also used the $saturn variable to test 
+> whether we were in TechExplorer or not in a few places (this 
+> was so we could use the same CCL image files for both the 
+> TechExplorer and shell interfaces of Axiom under Windows).  
+> It might be worth somebody trying to resurrect this code - 
+> the only hitch I can foresee is that we added a grep command 
+> to CCL (coded in C) since Windows doesn't have a grep 
+> program, but you can always spawn off a system command under 
+> Unix (which is what the original IBM version of Axiom did) to 
+> get the same result.
+> 
+> Mike.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 03 14:59:54 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: miked@nag.co.uk
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] tutorial
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+
+Mike,
+
+A minor nit... is the tutorial being released under the Axiom modified BSD?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 06:22:51 2003
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+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:21:44 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: root <daly@idsi.net>
+Message-ID: <20031004112144.A27894@nag.co.uk>
+References: <200310031859.h93Ix5c19935@localhost.localdomain>
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+In-Reply-To: <200310031859.h93Ix5c19935@localhost.localdomain>;
+	from daly@idsi.net on Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 02:59:05PM -0400
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tutorial
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Yes, there should be a copyright notice in each file.
+Mike.
+
+On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 02:59:05PM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> Mike,
+> 
+> A minor nit... is the tutorial being released under the Axiom modified BSD?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> ________________________________________________________________________
+> This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 06:48:14 2003
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+	id 1A5juC-0000OS-00; Sat, 04 Oct 2003 12:44:56 +0200
+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: TeX output bug (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: kudos)
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D15@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2003 12:44:56 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D15@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill Page's message of "Tue, 30 Sep 2003 08:54:58 -0400")
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca
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+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> Yes, something as simple as
+>
+>   )set output tex on
+>   elt("A",1)
+>
+> shows the problem. 
+
+Bill, I obtain:
+
+$$
+#\A 
+\leqno(1)
+$$
+
+What should be the right output (for the bug database)?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 06:53:01 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Axiom source distribution (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] kudos)
+References: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87r81ub5s4.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2003 12:42:48 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <87r81ub5s4.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (David MENTRE's message of "Fri, 03
+	Oct 2003 19:16:43 +0200")
+Message-ID: <871xttwafr.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr>
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> I have gzipped, renamed and moved it into
+> axiom_cvs.pkg/cvs_2003-10-02/axiom-src-cvs-2003-10-02.tar.gz
+
+The uploaded file is about 59 MB.
+
+I just realized that several releases of GCL are included in this
+directory:
+
+-rwxr-xr-x axiom/axiom  2468549 2002-11-04 21:12:41 axiom/zips/gcl-2.4.1.tgz
+-rwxr-xr-x axiom/axiom  2901224 2002-11-21 01:41:45 axiom/zips/gcl-2.4.3.tgz
+-rwxr-xr-x axiom/axiom  9759328 2003-03-20 16:32:01 axiom/zips/gcl-2.5.2.tgz
+-rwxr-xr-x axiom/axiom  9846811 2003-06-25 05:38:17 axiom/zips/gcl-2.5.3.tar.gz
+-rwxr-xr-x axiom/axiom 10017819 2002-11-21 03:52:12 axiom/zips/gcl-2.5.tgz
+
+I'll repack the source tree with only one GCL release.
+
+In my own compilation of Axiom, gcl-2.5.2 is used. Is it right?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 07:02:54 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87r81ub5s4.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <871xttwafr.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2003 13:02:14 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <871xttwafr.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr> (David MENTRE's message of "Sat,
+	04 Oct 2003 12:42:48 +0200")
+Message-ID: <87smm9uuyx.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom source distribution
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> The uploaded file is about 59 MB.
+>
+> I just realized that several releases of GCL are included in this
+> directory:
+
+In the same way, ADVI is not currently used. It will free about 4 MB of
+download time.
+
+Yours,
+d. 
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 11:15:43 2003
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+	id <20031004151457.WVUN9531.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@Asus>;
+	Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:14:57 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?'David_Mentr=E9'?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>,
+	"'Page, Bill'" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: RE: TeX output bug (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: kudos)
+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:14:55 -0400
+Message-ID: <001501c38a8a$48206b70$6501a8c0@Asus>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+David,
+
+The LaTeX output of
+
+  elt("A",1)
+
+should just be
+
+$$
+A
+\leqno(1)
+$$
+
+Note that this is directly related to the bug that
+I posted earlier
+
+ 
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=3Ddetailbug&bug_id=3D5614&group_id=3D=
+293
+8
+
+BTW, I really like what you have done with the Axiom
+home page!
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David Mentr=E9 [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2003 6:45 AM
+> To: Page, Bill
+> Cc: 'daly@idsi.net'; bill.page1@sympatico.ca; 
+> axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: TeX output bug (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: kudos)
+> 
+> 
+> "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+> 
+> > Yes, something as simple as
+> >
+> >   )set output tex on
+> >   elt("A",1)
+> >
+> > shows the problem.
+> 
+> Bill, I obtain:
+> 
+> $$
+> #\A 
+> \leqno(1)
+> $$
+> 
+> What should be the right output (for the bug database)?
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+>  david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 11:19:28 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Mike Dewar'" <miked@nag.co.uk>,
+	"'root'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Re: tutorial
+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:18:39 -0400
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+
+Mike, Tim;
+
+My experiment with TeXmacs with the tutorial files is
+turning out to be very promising. The conversion is
+quite straight-forward. TeXmacs style customization
+ability seems to be able to accommodate most of the
+embedded non-standard LaTeX. I should have a draft for
+review later this weekend.
+
+How should I handle the copyright notice in these
+files? Perhaps there should be a link on each page
+to a separate copyright notice?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Mike Dewar
+> Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2003 6:22 AM
+> To: root
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tutorial
+> 
+> 
+> Yes, there should be a copyright notice in each file.
+> Mike.
+> 
+> On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 02:59:05PM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> > Mike,
+> > 
+> > A minor nit... is the tutorial being released under the 
+> Axiom modified 
+> > BSD?
+> > 
+> > Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 11:26:06 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?'David_Mentr=E9'?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:25:28 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] bug list
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David,
+
+I think the following bug is "fixed"
+
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=4584&group_id=293
+8
+
+it was apparently due to a problem with the use of
+incompatible database files. There "value stack overflows"
+no longer occur with the database files provided by
+Juergen and which have been incorporated into the CVS.
+
+Tim, is this correct? If so, I think we should close it.
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 11:27:16 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+In-reply-to: <001601c38a8a$ccac26e0$6501a8c0@Asus> (bill.page1@sympatico.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tutorial
+References: <001601c38a8a$ccac26e0$6501a8c0@Asus>
+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Bill,
+
+All copyright notices in source files now say:
+
+/* See LICENSE.AXIOM for Copyright */
+
+I had several dozen email discussions about this. Embedding the copyright
+text into the source files does NOT change the copyright to be "more
+effective" in any way and is complete overkill. The copyright notices
+were collected into the LICENSE directory so they could be consistently
+managed.
+
+Please replace all copyright text, no matter where it occurs, by the above text.
+Of course, if the copyright is not NAG's copyright you need to change it
+appropriately. If it is a new copyright notice that is not in the LICENSE
+subdirectory then let me handle it.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 12:37:17 2003
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+To: Aurelien Chanudet <ralubrik@yahoo.fr>
+References: <E562446A-F684-11D7-B4C2-00039345907E@yahoo.fr>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 04 Oct 2003 12:36:07 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, root <daly@idsi.net>, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] native relocation on Mac OS X
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Great work Aurelian!
+
+1) Do you have access to a publicly accesible ftp directory which I
+   may poll in the webpage autoupdate script?  If you upload files
+   with, say, the name gcl_.*_macosx.tar.gz there, where .* is a
+   version string, the script will install the latest built binary
+   tarball on the website.
+
+Aurelien Chanudet <ralubrik@yahoo.fr> writes:
+
+> Hi all,
+> 
+> As a first step towards using BFD to perform native relocation on Mac
+> OS X, I've written some code to load, link and natively relocate
+> object files on Mac OS X. As a result, fasloading can now be achieved
+> without using the external ld linker.
+> 
+
+I think there is a small confusion -- you've been using cust-reloc
+thus far, and this method, as well as the bfd method, do not use the
+external ld (or ld.so).  Only images using dlopen *must* build maxima,
+acl2, and axiom via the external ld (e.g. the alternate maxima gcl
+link, the compiler::link patches I've posted to the axiom list
+recently under the section labeled '2)').  Other images *can* use the
+external ld linking method if they prefer, but *native* relocation and
+image saving with a simple call to save-system works as well and is
+generally preferred.  You might want to look at the longish post I
+submitted recently to the axiom list.
+
+
+> This took me longer than expected, because I had to manually address
+> relocation overflows that might occur when the branch displacement
+> does not fit in 24 bits. I know gcc 3.3 has a "-mlongcall" flag but
+> I'm still using gcc 3.1 for some other reason. (Apple's gcc has its
+> own "-mlongbranch" flag, but this didn't help, though.)
+> 
+
+I've found that some of the acl2 tests on powerpc-linux fail unless I
+use -mlongcall for the same reason.  configure puts in this switch
+automatically for ppc linux.
+
+2) At some point, we need to setup configure defaults for your macosx
+   build.
+
+> The first good news is that Maxima 5.9.0 now successfully compiles
+> without the alternate linking mechanism. "make check" chokes on
+> "Problem 43". I suspect this corresponds to the 3rd issue listed under
+> the "Know issues" section of the "NEWS" file included in the source
+> directory.
+> 
+
+Should be one known failure in maxima's 'make check'.
+
+> The second good news is that acl2 also compiles fine. I've run "make
+> check" yet for acl2, as this took me over one night the last time I
+> did it, but I'm planning to.
+> 
+
+Great!
+
+3) Are you in touch with Tim Daly regarding GCL/Mac/axiom?
+
+4) Is your latest posted patch list the latest?  I'd like to merge in
+   any changes you've needed.
+
+5) Is your bfd linking working though a patch to the GCL bfd tree,
+   i.e. you use locbfd?  If so, perhaps we could convince BFD upstream
+   to apply it?
+
+> Aurelien
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 13:54:06 2003
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+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+References: <001501c38a8a$48206b70$6501a8c0@Asus>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 04 Oct 2003 19:53:19 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <001501c38a8a$48206b70$6501a8c0@Asus> (Bill Page's message of
+	"Sat, 4 Oct 2003 11:14:55 -0400")
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+Cc: Antoine Hersen <antoine.hersen@aiesec.net>, "'Page,
+	Bill'" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: TeX output bug
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+"Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca> writes:
+
+> Note that this is directly related to the bug that
+> I posted earlier
+>
+>  
+> http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=5614&group_id=2938
+
+Oops, you're right. I had forgotten.
+
+> BTW, I really like what you have done with the Axiom
+> home page!
+
+I'm not alone. Antoine has done most if not all of the design. Many
+thanks for both of us.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Patches and Fixes to some Makefiles
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+
+
+INTERP.EXPOSED is remade every time make is run
+
+Index: Makefile.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.3
+diff -u -a -r1.3 Makefile.pamphlet
+--- Makefile.pamphlet   5 Sep 2003 22:14:19 -0000       1.3
++++ Makefile.pamphlet   4 Oct 2003 18:46:27 -0000
+@@ -6274,12 +6274,12 @@
+ 
+ \end{verbatim}
+ <<databases>>=
+-${MNT}/${SYS}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED: ${MID}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED
+-       @ echo 614 making ${MNT}/${SYS}/algebra from ${MID}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED 
++${MNT}/${SYS}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED: ${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED
++       @ echo 614 making ${MNT}/${SYS}/algebra from ${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED 
+        @ cp ${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED ${MNT}/${SYS}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED
+ 
+-${MID}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED: ${SRC}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet
+-       @ echo 614a making ${MID}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED from ${SRC}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet
++${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED: ${SRC}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet
++       @ echo 614a making ${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED from ${SRC}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet
+        @ ${SPADBIN}/notangle ${SRC}/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet >${MID}/../algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED
+ 
+ ${MID}/exposed.lsp: ${SRC}/algebra/exposed.lsp.pamphlet
+
+
+
+
+There are some typos in the algebra/Makefile 
+
+Index: Makefile.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.2
+diff -u -a -r1.2 Makefile.pamphlet
+--- Makefile.pamphlet   29 Sep 2003 03:16:22 -0000      1.2
++++ Makefile.pamphlet   4 Oct 2003 18:54:15 -0000
+@@ -8518,7 +8548,7 @@
+        @ echo 0 making ${MID}/D01AGNT.spad from ${IN}/d01agents.spad.pamphlet
+        @(cd ${MID} ; \
+        rm -rf D01AGNT.NRLIB ; \
+-       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"package D01AGNT D01AgentsPackage" ${IN}/d01agents.spad.pamphlet >D01AGNT.spad )
++       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"package D01AGNT d01AgentsPackage" ${IN}/d01agents.spad.pamphlet >D01AGNT.spad )
+ 
+ @
+ <<INTFTBL.o (O from NRLIB)>>=
+@@ -11357,7 +11387,7 @@
+ <<expr2ups.spad (SPAD from IN)>>=
+ ${OUTSRC}/expr2ups.spad: ${IN}/expr2ups.spad.pamphlet
+        @ echo 0 making ${OUTSRC}/expr2ups.spad from ${IN}/expr2ups.spad.pamphlet
+-       @(cd ${MID} ; \
++       @(cd ${OUTSRC} ; \
+        ${SPADBIN}/notangle ${IN}/expr2ups.spad.pamphlet >expr2ups.spad )
+ 
+ @
+@@ -28649,7 +28679,7 @@
+        @ echo 0 making ${MID}/SRDCMPK.spad from ${IN}/sregset.spad.pamphlet
+        @(cd ${MID} ; \
+        rm -rf SRDCMPK.NRLIB ; \
+-       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"package SRDCMPK SquareFreeRegularSetDecompositionPackge" ${IN}/sregset.spad.pamphlet >SRDCMPK.spad )
++       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"package SRDCMPK SquareFreeRegularSetDecompositionPackage" ${IN}/sregset.spad.pamphlet >SRDCMPK.spad )
+ 
+ @
+ <<SREGSET.o (O from NRLIB)>>=
+@@ -32199,7 +32229,7 @@
+        @ echo 0 making ${MID}/RGCHAIN.spad from ${IN}/zerodim.spad.pamphlet
+        @(cd ${MID} ; \
+        rm -rf RGCHAIN.NRLIB ; \
+-       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"package RGCHAIN LexTriangularPackage" ${IN}/zerodim.spad.pamphlet >RGCHAIN.spad )
++       ${SPADBIN}/notangle -R"domain RGCHAIN RegularChain" ${IN}/zerodim.spad.pamphlet >RGCHAIN.spad )
+ 
+ @
+ <<RURPK.o (O from NRLIB)>>=
+
+
+
+This is a patch adds the missing algebra files. It's an
+preliminary hotfix only.
+
+Index: Makefile.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.2
+diff -u -a -r1.2 Makefile.pamphlet
+--- Makefile.pamphlet   29 Sep 2003 03:16:22 -0000      1.2
++++ Makefile.pamphlet   4 Oct 2003 18:54:15 -0000
+@@ -1011,7 +1011,37 @@
+   ${OUT}/IRRF2F.o   ${OUT}/LAPLACE.o  ${OUT}/LIMITPS.o  ${OUT}/LODEEF.o   \
+   ${OUT}/NODE1.o    ${OUT}/ODECONST.o ${OUT}/ODEINT.o   ${OUT}/REP.o      \
+   ${OUT}/SOLVERAD.o ${OUT}/SULS.o     ${OUT}/SUPXS.o    ${OUT}/ULS.o      \
+-  ${OUT}/ULSCONS.o  ${OUT}/UPXS.o     ${OUT}/UPXSCONS.o ${OUT}/UTS.o 
++  ${OUT}/ULSCONS.o  ${OUT}/UPXS.o     ${OUT}/UPXSCONS.o ${OUT}/UTS.o      \
++  ${OUT}/SIGNEF.o \
++  ${OUT}/FSPRMELT.o \
++  ${OUT}/REGSET.o \
++  ${OUT}/RSETGCD.o \
++  ${OUT}/SFRTCAT.o \
++  ${OUT}/SFRGCD.o \
++  ${OUT}/SFQCMPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/SREGSET.o \
++  ${OUT}/LAZM3PK.o \
++  ${OUT}/NORMPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/QCMPACK.o \
++  ${OUT}/SRDCMPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/SOLVETRA.o \
++  ${OUT}/ASP29.o \
++  ${OUT}/D01AGNT.o \
++  ${OUT}/NTSCAT.o \
++  ${OUT}/SNTSCAT.o \
++  ${OUT}/CPIMA.o \
++  ${OUT}/COMBF.o \
++  ${OUT}/INBFF.o \
++  ${OUT}/LODO.o \
++  ${OUT}/LODO1.o \
++  ${OUT}/LODO2.o \
++  ${OUT}/SUBSPACE.o \
++  ${OUT}/STTF.o \
++  ${OUT}/LEXTRIPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/IRURPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/RGCHAIN.o \
++  ${OUT}/RURPK.o \
++  ${OUT}/ZDSOLVE.o 
+ 
+ @
+ 
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 23:02:36 +0200
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+Thread-Topic: function MANEXP missing in sf.spad
+Thread-Index: AcOKutbnELdSXoTQQn6aJgVwxgiXpA==
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Oct 2003 21:02:37.0198 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[D6FD4AE0:01C38ABA]
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] function MANEXP missing in sf.spad
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Seems that the lisp function MANEXP is missing
+in gcl and cmu lisp. The function is called 
+from sf.spad function manexp. It seems that
+integer-decode-float is almost a replacement
+for manexp. Is there any documentation what
+manexp or MANEXP is supposed to do?
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 04 18:22:39 2003
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+	Sat, 4 Oct 2003 23:21:54 +0100
+Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 23:21:53 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time)
+From: Arthur Norman <acn1@cam.ac.uk>
+To: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] function MANEXP missing in sf.spad
+In-Reply-To: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4C2@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+
+On Sat, 4 Oct 2003, Weiss, Juergen wrote:
+> Seems that the lisp function MANEXP is missing
+> in gcl and cmu lisp. The function is called
+> from sf.spad function manexp. It seems that
+> integer-decode-float is almost a replacement
+> for manexp. Is there any documentation what
+> manexp or MANEXP is supposed to do?
+>
+> Juergen Weiss
+>
+The code I ended up with was
+
+
+static Lisp_Object Lmanexp(Lisp_Object nil, Lisp_Object a)
+{
+    int x;
+    double f;
+    if (! is_float(a))  aerror1("arg is not a floating-point number", a);
+    f = float_of_number(a);
+    f = frexp(f, &x);
+    errexit();
+    return onevalue(cons(make_boxfloat(f,TYPE_DOUBLE_FLOAT),
+                         fixnum_of_int(x)));
+}
+
+Ie it expects a float, splits into integer and fraction part and returns a
+cons of the fraction as a double-precision number and the integer part as
+an integer. My implementation only supports values wheer the integer part
+is small enough to be a fixnum, and does what C does wrt "fractional
+part". Right now I do not recall exactly where the spec came from but that
+was what went into CSL to support the NAG effort on Axiom.
+
+  Arthur
+
+
+
+
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+To: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Patches and Fixes to some Makefiles
+References: <xzdisn4u8tx.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2003 10:33:14 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <xzdisn4u8tx.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE> (Juergen Weiss's
+	message of "04 Oct 2003 21:00:26 +0200")
+Message-ID: <87vfr4w0c5.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+Hello Juergen,
+
+Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+
+> INTERP.EXPOSED is remade every time make is run
+
+> There are some typos in the algebra/Makefile 
+
+I have added both patches as a new bug:
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=5743&group_id=2938
+[bug #5743] Makefile issues: INTERP.EXPOSED is remade every time & typos
+in the algebra/Makefile 
+
+> This is a patch adds the missing algebra files. It's an
+> preliminary hotfix only.
+
+I left this one out because I was not sure about this status. What do
+you mean by "preliminary hotfix only"? Or should I add it to [bug #5379]
+"Missing algebra (was: package CombinatorialFunction (COMBF) is
+missing)" that's containing your comment on the out-of-date database
+issue? 
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 04:37:58 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom source distribution
+References: <200310021654.h92Gsqj12925@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87r81ub5s4.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <871xttwafr.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr>
+	<87smm9uuyx.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2003 10:37:20 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <87smm9uuyx.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (David MENTRE's message of "Sat, 04
+	Oct 2003 13:02:14 +0200")
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+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+>
+>> The uploaded file is about 59 MB.
+>>
+>> I just realized that several releases of GCL are included in this
+>> directory:
+>
+> In the same way, ADVI is not currently used. It will free about 4 MB of
+> download time.
+
+Ok, I have uploaded a source tree without the unused gcl and advi. It's
+new size is 21.35MB instead of 49 MB. Much more reasonable. :)
+
+If somebody has some spare CPU time, it would be nice to give it a try,
+to check I have not left out required parts.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 04:43:55 2003
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+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>,
+	Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+References: <001701c38a8b$c0724f70$6501a8c0@Asus>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2003 10:43:13 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <001701c38a8b$c0724f70$6501a8c0@Asus> (Bill Page's message of
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: bug list
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+
+"Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca> writes:
+
+> I think the following bug is "fixed"
+>
+> http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=4584&group_id=293
+> 8
+>
+> it was apparently due to a problem with the use of
+> incompatible database files. There "value stack overflows"
+> no longer occur with the database files provided by
+> Juergen and which have been incorporated into the CVS.
+>
+> Tim, is this correct? If so, I think we should close it.
+
+You're right Bill. The proposed patch in bug #4584 is included in the
+source tree as patch zips/gcl-2.5.2.o.main.c.patch and applied during
+build process.
+
+I close the bug.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 05:19:43 2003
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+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Patches and Fixes to some Makefiles
+Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2003 11:19:05 +0200
+Message-ID: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC046C6422@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+Thread-Topic: [Axiom-developer] Patches and Fixes to some Makefiles
+Thread-Index: AcOLG2Yca9jj5KgUR1ybF+uAV1LvgwABcwpA
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "David MENTRE" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Oct 2003 09:19:06.0038 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[B9972D60:01C38B21]
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+I'm not exactly sure which mechanism Tim 
+uses to order the files. So I labeled the
+patch as preliminary.
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2003 10:33 AM
+> To: Weiss, Juergen
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Patches and Fixes to some Makefiles
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Juergen,
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de> writes:
+> 
+> > INTERP.EXPOSED is remade every time make is run
+> 
+> > There are some typos in the algebra/Makefile 
+> 
+> I have added both patches as a new bug:
+> http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=3Ddetailbug&bug_id=3D5743&gr
+oup_id=3D2938
+[bug #5743] Makefile issues: INTERP.EXPOSED is remade every time & typos
+in the algebra/Makefile 
+
+> This is a patch adds the missing algebra files. It's an
+> preliminary hotfix only.
+
+I left this one out because I was not sure about this status. What do
+you mean by "preliminary hotfix only"? Or should I add it to [bug #5379]
+"Missing algebra (was: package CombinatorialFunction (COMBF) is
+missing)" that's containing your comment on the out-of-date database
+issue? 
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 11:21:04 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] recent changes
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+INTERP.EXPOSED is gone from everywhere
+Duplicate macros no longer cause stack overflows
+Makefiles now use ${MAKE} everywhere
+All .input files are lowercased
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 12:05:30 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net, Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] recent changes
+References: <200310051520.h95FKS030146@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2003 18:04:39 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310051520.h95FKS030146@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Sun, 5 Oct 2003 11:20:28 -0400")
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+
+Hello Tim,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> INTERP.EXPOSED is gone from everywhere
+
+Ok, I have added a comment to bug #5743.
+
+
+> Duplicate macros no longer cause stack overflows
+
+This closes [bug #4871] "left hand side macro expansion issue (was:
+Compiling spad file causes value stack overflow) "
+
+> Makefiles now use ${MAKE} everywhere
+
+Oops, the bug was already closed.
+
+> All .input files are lowercased
+
+Not related to any bug that I know of.
+
+
+We have 22 bugs remaining, of which 16 have a Severity of "5-Major" or
+above (i.e. they are release critical).
+
+
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 05 14:27:24 2003
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+Message-Id: <200310051826.h95IQjK30273@localhost.localdomain>
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] *yearweek*
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+"Bug 4587 )lisp *yearweek* is broken" can now be closed.
+I've updated the explanation in src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 06 04:48:56 2003
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+Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 09:43:09 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: Bill Page <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] [Texmacs-dev] New tm_axiom.c & question on
+	stderr
+Message-ID: <20031006094309.B2110@nag.co.uk>
+References: <20031002101216.B17384@nag.co.uk>
+	<001501c389df$7ad222d0$6601a8c0@Asus>
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+In-Reply-To: <001501c389df$7ad222d0$6601a8c0@Asus>;
+	from bill.page1@sympatico.ca on Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 02:52:17PM
+	-0400
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hi Bill,
+
+Thats absolutely right.  In the NAG version of the software `axiom' was
+just a shell script which started sman with various options.
+
+The only problem I can envisage is that without sman you cannot use
+the unix graphics or browser (hyperdoc will work on its own provided it
+doesn't need to communicate with the running Axiom interpreter).  For
+our own TeX-based interface on Windows we dispensed with sman completely
+and had everything running smoothly through TechExplorer except for the
+graphics which needed an external program to display (SceneViewer, an
+OpenGL renderer which we licensed from Template Graphics Software).
+
+Mike.
+
+On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 02:52:17PM -0400, Bill Page wrote:
+> Mike,
+> 
+> So if I understand you correctly, what TeXmacs really aught
+> to do is to invoke just the interpreter via AXIOMsys - not
+> the whole "Superman" thing. Right? This way, there will
+> always only be one prompt. The fact that TeXmacs used to
+> expect two prompts was an accident due to the fact that it
+> (incorrectly) invoked more that what is really required for
+> the TeXmacs-Axiom interface.
+> 
+> So, both the old and new versions of Axiom should be compatible
+> with the new version of the tm_axiom.c program *provided* we
+> agree to call the new Axiom interpreter by the name AXIOMsys.
+> We should reserve the name 'axiom' for the invoking Superman
+> when/if it becomes available in the new open source version.
+> 
+> So far I a very pleased with the combination of TeXmacs and
+> Axiom. I am so used to working with a Maple/Matematica style
+> "worksheet" interface, that play with the command line mode
+> of Axiom (or even Maple for that matter) just seems too awkward.
+> And of course TeXmacs has the advantage that it can simultaneously
+> interface with a large number of open source computer algebra
+> and related packages, include gnuplot, macsyma, R (statistics),
+> etc. and *also* Maple - all from one worksheet environment!
+> 
+> The Axiom tutorial tex files that you sent look promising
+> for conversion to TeXmacs format. I will spend a bit of time
+> on that over the next few days.
+> 
+> Thanks.
+> 
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> > -----Original Message-----
+> > From: Mike Dewar [mailto:miked@nag.co.uk] 
+> > Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 5:12 AM
+> > To: Bill. Page1 E-mail"
+> > Cc: 'texmacs-dev@gnu.org'; 'axiom-developer@nongnu.org'
+> > Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] New 
+> > tm_axiom.c & question on stderr
+> > 
+> > 
+> > Hi Bill,
+> > 
+> > There seems to be a misconception that the NAG version of 
+> > Axiom puts out two prompts on startup while the Open version 
+> > puts out one.  This is not actually true: the Axiom 
+> > interpreter (invoked via the command `AXIOMsys' in the NAG 
+> > version, and presumably via `axiom' in your version) only 
+> > puts out one prompt: the reason you can see two is that sman 
+> > (the "Superman" process that manages communication between 
+> > the interpreter, hyperdoc, browser, graphics etc.) causes the 
+> > interpreter to start a new frame, which forces a new prompt 
+> > (you can do the same by typing ")frame new foo").  Once Tim 
+> > gets sman working the Open version will presumably work in 
+> > the same way.  So your new tm_axiom ought to work the same 
+> > way with both versions if they are invoked in the equivalent
+> > way.
+> > 
+> > I haven't seen the TeXmacs interface to Axiom but we used to 
+> > maintain a TeX-based interface under Windows (based on IBM's 
+> > TechExplorer) and it had lots of nice features - a TeX 
+> > version of the browser, the ability to execute worksheets 
+> > etc.  Some of this code was embedded in the front-end but the 
+> > browser code, for example, was all in boot.  The main file in 
+> > question was br-saturn.boot ("saturn" was IBM's pre-release name
+> > for TechExplorer) and we also used the $saturn variable to test 
+> > whether we were in TechExplorer or not in a few places (this 
+> > was so we could use the same CCL image files for both the 
+> > TechExplorer and shell interfaces of Axiom under Windows).  
+> > It might be worth somebody trying to resurrect this code - 
+> > the only hitch I can foresee is that we added a grep command 
+> > to CCL (coded in C) since Windows doesn't have a grep 
+> > program, but you can always spawn off a system command under 
+> > Unix (which is what the original IBM version of Axiom did) to 
+> > get the same result.
+> > 
+> > Mike.
+> > 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> ________________________________________________________________________
+> This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The
+> service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive
+> anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit:
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+
+________________________________________________________________________
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 06 12:29:33 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net, Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] *yearweek*
+References: <200310051826.h95IQjK30273@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2003 18:28:46 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310051826.h95IQjK30273@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Sun, 5 Oct 2003 14:26:45 -0400")
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> "Bug 4587 )lisp *yearweek* is broken" can now be closed.
+> I've updated the explanation in src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+Bug closed.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 01:48:41 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>
+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 01:48:25 -0400 
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, texmacs-dev@gnu.org, axiom-mail@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with axiom.
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Axiom Users;
+
+I have completed a first draft of the "Axiom with TeXmacs"
+tutorial. You can download it from Axiom_Tutorial at
+
+  http://savannah.nongnu.org/files/?group=axiom
+
+This draft includes information about graphics and the
+library browser although these functions have not yet been
+implemented in the current alpha release of Axiom. Some of
+this functionality may change depending how or if these
+functions are integrated with TeXmacs.
+
+The problem with inconsistent application of the
+axiom-tutorial.ts stylesheet should now be corrected.
+
+For reference and convenience, I have also included a single
+PDF file containing the entire tutorial. It is not necessary
+to install TeXmacs or Axiom in order to view this PDF file.
+
+As usual, I am very interested in your comments, suggestions,
+corrections and criticisms.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu
+> [mailto:dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu]
+> Sent: Monday, October 06, 2003 1:20 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with axiom.
+> 
+> 
+> On Mon, Oct 06, 2003 at 10:21:15AM -0400, Bill Page wrote:
+> > Are you still having this problem? It sounds like TeXmacs
+> > is not loading the 'axiom-tutorial.ts' stylesheet where
+> > these things are defined. Make sure that the file
+> > 'axiom-tutorial.ts' is in the same directory as
+> > 'tutorialTOC.tm'.
+> 
+> It's still happening.  It doesn't happen on the main table of 
+> contents,
+> but when I get to oneStep01.tm I get all those tags.  I tried copying
+> axiom-tutorial.ts into the oneStep directory, but it didn't help.
+> 
+> It also doesn't happen everywhere; there are some places where I see
+> AXIOM.
+> 
+> Peace,
+> 	Dylan
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 10:28:50 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 09:49:46 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071349.h97DnkV08144@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: wurmli@hispeed.ch
+In-reply-to: <200310071027.h97ARhF09740@localhost.localdomain> (message from
+	root on Tue, 7 Oct 2003 06:27:43 -0400)
+References: <200310071027.h97ARhF09740@localhost.localdomain>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Lost mail? GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY bug
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 14:28:48 -0000
+
+Hans Peter (wurmli@hispeed.ch) wrote:
+
+> I tried to post a question to the mail-list, but it didn't seem to arrive. 
+> The mailing address I chose was "axiom-mail@nongnu.org" and the subject: 
+> ")library XY => System errror".
+> 
+> Do I have to subscribe to the mailing lists, before I can post?
+> 
+> Kind regards
+> 
+> Hans Peter
+
+Yes, I believe the mailing lists are set up so that you have to
+subscribe although I can't find an option that states that fact.
+Otherwise we'd all get rich, have cheap medicine, and be as handsome
+as I am naturally. :-) I checked the archives and, indeed, your mail
+was never archived.
+
+> 
+> P.S. This was the message:
+> 
+> Quote
+> I am using axiom compiled from CVS of 2003-10-3 (on a Debian machine) and 
+> trying to run library code found on the Internet (itovsn3). The library 
+> command causes an error:
+> 
+> (1) -> )library BSD
+>  
+>    >> System error:
+>    GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY is invalid as a function.
+> 
+> protected-symbol-warn called with (NIL)
+> 
+> Could someone maybe give me a hint what's going wrong? 
+
+The lousy, untalented, worthless, good-for-nothing lead developer
+let the code get out the door without extensive testing? Well,
+that's the most likely reason. It's a bug. We'll record it and
+get it fixed.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 10:36:46 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 09:56:00 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071356.h97Du0p08168@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: fmaltey@nerim.fr
+In-reply-to: <200310071026.h97AQvF09736@localhost.localdomain> (message from
+	root on Tue, 7 Oct 2003 06:26:57 -0400)
+References: <200310071026.h97AQvF09736@localhost.localdomain>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: several lines in a xterm
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 14:36:41 -0000
+
+
+François Maltey wrote:
+
+> axiom inside texmacs is fine and I can type several lines with 
+> [shift-return]. But I prefer use my old emacs or an xterm and I can't do so.
+> 
+> How can I input one command in several lines.
+> Must I do a file and type after )read file.input ?
+> Is there another possibility with pipe ?
+> 
+> Must my emacs add a _ at the end of every line, and then how can I 
+> input an if...then...else ? 
+> 
+> Thanks a lot if you have an idea.
+> 
+> François
+
+if you type:
+
+if (1 = 1) _
+then output 2 _
+else output 3
+
+to an axiom prompt inside an emacs buffer the IF statement is recognized.
+The trailing _ is the line continuation character for the axiom read function.
+I always work in emacs and generally use Ctrl-x 2 to split the screen,
+run axiom in one buffer and edit code in the other. 
+(Ctrl-x o jumps to the other buffer).
+(Ctrl-x 1 will return to single-buffer mode).
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 11:01:43 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 10:19:14 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: fmaltey@nerim.fr
+In-reply-to: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain> (message from
+	root on Tue, 7 Oct 2003 06:26:18 -0400)
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, axiom-math@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: partfrac, expand, combine,
+	rewrite and simplify.
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 15:01:42 -0000
+
+
+> // 1 //
+> I use mupad and I find very pretty the only 4 commands :
+>   expand, combine, rewrite and simplify (with or without an option)
+> 
+> expand (binomial (n, 3))                          -> n(n-1)(n-2)/6
+> expand (sin (2*x))                                -> 2 sin(x) cos(x)
+> 
+> combine (sin(x)^2, sincos)                        ->(1-cos(2x))/2
+> 
+> rewrite (..., opt) with opt=exp, sincos, sinhcosh, etc.
+>   for rewriting
+> 
+> simplify tries to simplify, but it's not so sure.
+> 
+> In axiom I find a lot of functions as factorials, htrigs, expandTrigProducts
+> but no pretty front-end function. Is there ?
+> What tells axiom about such general functions ?
+> 
+
+Unfortunately your question doesn't seem to have a simple answer.
+I've never used mupad but it appears that the functions you mention
+are using a tree-like representation of the expression and allow you
+to manipulate the tree.
+
+Axiom produces answers whose appearance depends on the type. For example:
+
+-> (x+1)/17
+
+  1      1
+ -- x + --
+ 17     17
+               Type: Polynomial Fraction Integer
+
+so the first input gets output as a polynomial of the form A*x+B
+where A=1/17 and B=1/17.
+
+-> %::Fraction(Polynomial(Integer))
+
+ x + 1
+ -----
+   17
+               Type: Fraction Polynomial Integer
+
+(% is the last result. "::" does type conversion)
+
+We then asked for a fraction whose numerator and denominator are 
+polynomials over the integers. So we wanted a fraction of the form:
+(A*x+B)/(C*x+D) and got one with A=1, B=1, C=0, D=17
+
+The output you get depends on the type you request.
+
+
+> // 2 //
+> I call partfrac the transform as 2x^3 / (1-x^2) = 1/(1-x) - 1/(1+x) - 2x
+> 
+> What is its name in axiom ?
+
+The partialFraction function will create a partial fraction thus:
+
+-> partialFraction(7,12)
+
+       3   1
+  1 - -- + -
+       2   3
+      2
+                  Type: PartialFraction Integer
+
+If you need more help let me know and I'll try to resolve the problem.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 12:25:39 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 12:24:48 -0400
+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: partfrac, expand, combine,
+	rewrite and simplify.
+Message-ID: <20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, fmaltey@nerim.fr, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom-math@nongnu.org
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+
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+
+On Tue, Oct 07, 2003 at 10:19:14AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> > // 2 //
+> > I call partfrac the transform as 2x^3 / (1-x^2) =3D 1/(1-x) - 1/(1+x) -=
+ 2x
+> > 
+> > What is its name in axiom ?
+> 
+> The partialFraction function will create a partial fraction thus:
+> 
+> -> partialFraction(7,12)
+> 
+>        3   1
+>   1 - -- + -
+>        2   3
+>       2
+>                   Type: PartialFraction Integer
+
+Right, but this doesn't help with the actual problem!  Apparently to
+convince partialFraction to work on polynomials you need to provide some
+type information.
+
+Furthermore, I think there's a bug here:
+
+------
+(8) -> partialFraction((2*x^3), (1-x^2))
+   There are 1 exposed and 1 unexposed library operations named 
+      partialFraction having 2 argument(s) but none was determined to 
+      be applicable. [snippage]
+(8) -> partialFraction((2*x^3)::UP(x, FRAC INT), (1-x^2))
+
+                 2x
+   (8)  - 2x - ------
+                2
+               x  - 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+(9) -> partialFraction((2*x^3), (1-x^2)::UP(x, FRAC INT))
+
+                 1       1
+   (9)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+------
+
+Why didn't input (8) above actually do the partial fraction expansion?
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--ReaqsoxgOBHFXBhH
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+=uZdg
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+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 13:17:35 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:16:51 -0400
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Display bug for Factored Integer's
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
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+
+I think this behaviour is broken:
+
+----
+(10) -> factor(15)
+
+   (10)  3 5
+                                                       Type: Factored Integ=
+er
+(11) -> )set output tex on
+(11) -> factor(15)
+
+   (11)  3 5
+$$
+3 \  5 
+\leqno(11)
+$$
+
+                                                       Type: Factored Integ=
+er
+----
+
+This is made worse by the TeXmacs interface, which strips out the '\ 's, so=
+ the
+answer comes out as '35'.  (Personally, I think the extra space is very ugl=
+y,
+and should not be put in by Axiom in the first place.)
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 13:37:23 2003
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+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D2D@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 19:36:33 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D2D@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill Page's message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 01:48:25 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87r81puezi.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with axiom.
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello Bill,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> I have completed a first draft of the "Axiom with TeXmacs"
+> tutorial. You can download it from Axiom_Tutorial at
+
+A lot of work! I've just browsed quickly through the tutorial but it
+seems very complete. Many thanks Bill.
+
+> For reference and convenience, I have also included a single
+> PDF file containing the entire tutorial. It is not necessary
+> to install TeXmacs or Axiom in order to view this PDF file.
+
+Good idea. A minor glitch: the produced PDF file is of poor visual
+quality on a computer screen. The embedded fonts are bitmap and thus
+cannot be anti-aliased on screen (as I have seen on Acrobat Reader on
+Windows platform).
+
+How have you produced the PDF? Through LaTeX? I have tried the latex
+export on the tutorialTOC.tm document but it does not include the other
+chapters. I also tried tutorialFULL.tm but the produced latex document
+is empty.
+
+If you can produce a latex file corresponding to the tutorial, pdflatex
+shall produce a better PDF. And using the hyperref package, you might
+also have links inside the PDF document. 
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 12:56:51 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071656.h97GupT20964@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+In-reply-to: <20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	(dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu)
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, fmaltey@nerim.fr, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom-math@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: partfrac, expand, combine,
+	rewrite and simplify.
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan Thurston wrote:
+
+>On Tue, Oct 07, 2003 at 10:19:14AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+>> > // 2 //
+>> > I call partfrac the transform as 2x^3 / (1-x^2) =3D 1/(1-x) - 1/(1+x) -=
+> 2x
+>> > 
+>> > What is its name in axiom ?
+>> 
+>> The partialFraction function will create a partial fraction thus:
+>> 
+>> -> partialFraction(7,12)
+>> 
+>>        3   1
+>>   1 - -- + -
+>>        2   3
+>>       2
+>>                   Type: PartialFraction Integer
+>
+>Right, but this doesn't help with the actual problem!  Apparently to
+>convince partialFraction to work on polynomials you need to provide some
+>type information.
+>
+>Furthermore, I think there's a bug here:
+>
+>------
+>(8) -> partialFraction((2*x^3), (1-x^2))
+>   There are 1 exposed and 1 unexposed library operations named 
+>      partialFraction having 2 argument(s) but none was determined to 
+>      be applicable. [snippage]
+>(8) -> partialFraction((2*x^3)::UP(x, FRAC INT), (1-x^2))
+>
+>                 2x
+>   (8)  - 2x - ------
+>                2
+>               x  - 1
+>               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+>r)
+>(9) -> partialFraction((2*x^3), (1-x^2)::UP(x, FRAC INT))
+>
+>                 1       1
+>   (9)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+>               x - 1   x + 1
+>               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+>r)
+>------
+>
+>Why didn't input (8) above actually do the partial fraction expansion?
+
+Dylan,
+
+(1) -> )d op partialFraction
+
+There is one exposed function called partialFraction :
+   [1] (D1,Factored D1) -> PartialFraction D1 from PartialFraction D1
+            if D1 has EUCDOM
+
+There are 2 unexposed functions called partialFraction :
+   [1] (Fraction Polynomial D4,Symbol) -> Any from 
+            PartialFractionPackage D4
+            if D4 has Join(EuclideanDomain,CharacteristicZero)
+   [2] (Polynomial D5,Factored Polynomial D5,Symbol) -> Any
+            from PartialFractionPackage D5
+            if D5 has Join(EuclideanDomain,CharacteristicZero)
+
+First, I make a couple variables to hold the expressions.
+This lets me figure out what the interpreter type is by default:
+
+(1) -> a:=2*x^3
+
+          3
+   (1)  2x
+                                                     Type: Polynomial Integer
+(2) -> b:=1-x^2
+
+           2
+   (2)  - x  + 1
+                                                     Type: Polynomial Integer
+
+The signature listed above requires that the first argument type 
+must be a EuclideanDomain (EUCDOM):
+
+(3) -> Polynomial(Integer) has EUCDOM
+
+   (3)  false
+                                                                Type: Boolean
+POLY(INT) is not a EUCDOM.
+However, the type you provided is a EUCDOM.
+
+(4) -> UP(x,FRAC INT) has EUCDOM
+
+   (4)  true
+
+                                                                Type: Boolean
+So we can make variables that are the correct type:
+
+(5) -> aa:UP(x,FRAC INT):=2*x^3
+
+          3
+   (5)  2x
+                               Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+(6) -> bb:UP(x,FRAC INT):=1-x^2
+
+           2
+   (6)  - x  + 1
+                               Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+
+And the call succeeds:
+
+(7) -> partialFraction(aa,bb)
+
+                 1       1
+   (7)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+
+So partialFraction can create the correct call signature. I suspect the
+interpreter created some intermediate type that it couldn't coerce to
+the required target type. I agree that it should have been able to 
+give the factored output but did not.
+
+If you really want to see the struggles the interpreter is going thru try:
+
+)lisp (setq |$monitorNewWorld| t)
+
+and you can see the interpreter trying to find the correct signature
+using various coercions. 
+
+I'll put this problem on the list of things to look at but it won't be
+in the near future as I'm trying to correct a major distribution problem
+and get some documentation available. If you get any insight I'd like
+to know.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
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+Received: from david by oops with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian))
+	id 1A6vr4-0000d3-00; Tue, 07 Oct 2003 19:42:38 +0200
+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Lost mail? GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY bug
+References: <200310071027.h97ARhF09740@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071349.h97DnkV08144@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 19:42:38 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310071349.h97DnkV08144@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 09:49:46 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87n0cduepd.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, wurmli@hispeed.ch
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 17:43:25 -0000
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+>> (1) -> )library BSD
+>>  
+>>    >> System error:
+>>    GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY is invalid as a function.
+>> 
+
+>  It's a bug. We'll record it and get it fixed.
+
+Recorded as bug #5784.
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?func=detailbug&bug_id=5784&group_id=2938
+
+I have the same behavior.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 13:45:36 2003
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+	Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:06:10 -0400
+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:06:10 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071706.h97H6AC22352@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu, david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	(dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu)
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] factor bug (actually a tex bug)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Dylan,
+
+Yes, tex output is broken. The bug appears to be that elt of a string
+in common lisp generates escaped characters. I have it "in process"
+on one of my development trees but I'm working to fix an important problem 
+raised by NAG at the moment so the debugging of this is stalled. Because
+I'm changing almost every file and I have to "push" these changes into my
+several parallel development trees I'll be busy for most of this week.
+
+David, could you list this as a separate bug just in case it is not related
+to the previous tex output bug?
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 14:06:02 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	[193.252.110.163]) by mwinf0503.wanadoo.fr (SMTP Server) with ESMTP
+	id CED426800D94; Tue,  7 Oct 2003 20:05:19 +0200 (CEST)
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+	id 1A6wD0-0000eD-00; Tue, 07 Oct 2003 20:05:18 +0200
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Display bug for Factored Integer's
+References: <20031007171651.GA4224@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 20:05:18 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <20031007171651.GA4224@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu> (Dylan
+	Thurston's message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:16:51 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87ekxovs81.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 18:05:59 -0000
+
+dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston) writes:
+
+> (10) -> factor(15)
+>
+>    (10)  3 5
+>                                                        Type: Factored Integer
+> (11) -> )set output tex on
+> (11) -> factor(15)
+>
+>    (11)  3 5
+> $$
+> 3 \  5 
+> \leqno(11)
+> $$
+>
+>                                                        Type: Factored Integer
+
+Bug recorded as bug #5786.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 14:07:30 2003
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+	id 1A6wEP-0000eI-00; Tue, 07 Oct 2003 20:06:45 +0200
+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031007162448.GA3617@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310071706.h97H6AC22352@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 20:06:45 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310071706.h97H6AC22352@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 13:06:10 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87ad8cvs5m.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: factor bug (actually a tex bug)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 18:07:27 -0000
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> David, could you list this as a separate bug just in case it is not related
+> to the previous tex output bug?
+
+You want me to record in a separate bug that: "tex output is broken. The
+bug appears to be that elt of a string in common lisp generates escaped
+characters"?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 14:53:15 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	by ka.univ-orleans.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1715B12AD4D
+	for <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>; Tue,  7 Oct 2003 20:47:52 +0200 (CEST)
+From: michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 20:50:19 +0200
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
+Content-transfer-encoding: Quoted-printable
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with
+	axiom.
+Message-ID: <3F83270B.20453.14EBB4F@localhost>
+Priority: normal
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D2D@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>	(Bill
+	Page's message of "Tue, 7 Oct 2003 01:48:25 -0400")
+In-reply-to: <87r81puezi.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 18:53:13 -0000
+
+Hello,
+
+> Good idea. A minor glitch: the produced PDF file is of poor visual
+> quality on a computer screen. The embedded fonts are bitmap and thus
+> cannot be anti-aliased on screen (as I have seen on Acrobat Reader on
+> Windows platform).
+
+Yes, this is a defect of Acrobat Reader. It can be avoided by viewing the 
+pdf with Ghostscript+GSview/ghostview instead (Ghostscript can do 
+antialising).
+
+Best wishes
+
+Michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+http://www.univ-orleans.fr/EXT/ASTEX
+ftp://ftp.univ-orleans.fr/pub/tex/PC/AsTeX
+liste de discussion: astex@univ-orleans.fr
+Abonnement =E0 la liste: envoyer un message de contenu
+"sub astex Nom Prenom Etablissement" =E0 sympa@univ-orleans.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 15:02:32 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	Tue, 7 Oct 2003 15:00:48 -0400
+Received: (from daly@localhost)
+	by rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id h97INA627817;
+	Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:23:10 -0400
+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:23:10 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071823.h97INA627817@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: fmaltey@nerim.fr
+In-reply-to: <87ad8df1n5.fsf@ecritoire.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-shoot-me>
+	(fmaltey@nerim.fr)
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87ad8df1n5.fsf@ecritoire.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-shoot-me>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, axiom-math@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: partfrac, expand, combine,
+	rewrite and simplify.
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 19:02:30 -0000
+
+Francois wrote:
+>Daly wrote :
+>
+>> Unfortunately your question doesn't seem to have a simple answer.
+>> I've never used mupad but it appears that the functions you mention
+>> are using a tree-like representation of the expression and allow you
+>> to manipulate the tree.
+>...
+>
+>Thanks a lot for theses details. 
+>May I explain why I ask theses questions ?
+>
+>I'm a mathematical teacher one year after baccalauréat in France.
+>In my classroom I must use maple, but for my students mupad is more easy.
+>mupad is less expensive and more open than maple, but not free. 
+
+We are talking to various Linux vendors (and will contact Microsoft
+and Apple once the ports are done) to try to get Axiom available as
+part of the standard distribution. This will ensure that students 
+have a free, general purpose computer algebra system already available
+on every computer.
+
+Axiom can be compiled and run on Debian and RedHat. Other ports are
+underway and will be announced on the 
+<A HREF="http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/axiom">Axiom website</A>.
+
+>So I'm looking for a CAS wich can do every student calculus as
+>integrate, differentiate, sum, solver, matrix... and I'm looking
+>if the free axiom can do so in future.
+>
+>Axiom seems to have a lot of avantages.
+>Today I can't make any exercice in my classroom with axiom,
+>but my question is "Will it possible to do so in some times ?"
+
+I am the lead developer on another computer algebra system called Magnus
+which has a "zero learning curve" interface. That is, the interface is
+designed to be immediately useful to the student without classroom
+instruction. 
+
+I'm also a research professor at City College of New York. Our institute
+<A HREF="zerbra.sci.ccny.cuny.edu/web/caiss/main.htm">CAISS</A> is
+working to develop a series of front ends for a wide range of math
+and science courses. The focus is on the course material made available
+by MIT's <A HREF="ocw.mit.edu">Open Courseware</A> effort. Since MIT's
+material is free it gives teachers a good reference for their coursework.
+In particular, Gilbert Strang (MIT, math) has a Linear Algebra course
+that includes video lectures. These are essential to motivating the
+student to both learn on their own and use the software. Hopefully
+more of the math and science courses will include video in the future.
+(MIT's video lectures are probably not useful in France, however).
+
+We currently have a statistics course (CAISS-Stat) as our first 
+test example. The idea is to develop specialized menu-driven front
+ends for Axiom that make simplifying assumptions. This makes it
+easier to build specific functions, label them in menus as expand, 
+combine, etc. A whole series of these CAISS-math packages are expected. 
+
+Since the menus are trivial to change and trivial to associate with
+any function we expect that professors will be able to change the
+system to match their particular course.
+
+Until we have this available you have to consider types.  You can
+write programs in Axiom and it is possible to write the kinds of
+functions you want as long as you create the correct types. Axiom
+knows how to do the things you want but you have to work in the
+correct types.
+
+I'll look at the other items you mentioned in your email as soon as
+I get the chance.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 15:13:53 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <20031007191201.GA4306@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310071026.h97AQI009732@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310071419.h97EJEg10501@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, fmaltey@nerim.fr, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom-math@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: partfrac, expand, combine,
+	rewrite and simplify.
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+
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+
+On Tue, Oct 07, 2003 at 12:56:51PM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> (5) -> aa:UP(x,FRAC INT):=3D2*x^3
+> 
+>           3
+>    (5)  2x
+>                                Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Inte=
+ger)
+> (6) -> bb:UP(x,FRAC INT):=3D1-x^2
+> 
+>            2
+>    (6)  - x  + 1
+>                                Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Inte=
+ger)
+> 
+> And the call succeeds:
+> 
+> (7) -> partialFraction(aa,bb)
+> 
+>                  1       1
+>    (7)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+>                x - 1   x + 1
+>                Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Inte=
+ger)
+> 
+> So partialFraction can create the correct call signature. I suspect the
+> interpreter created some intermediate type that it couldn't coerce to
+> the required target type. I agree that it should have been able to 
+> give the factored output but did not.
+
+Note that there is some behaviour which seems to definitely be a bug.  To
+continue your example:
+
+(32) -> partialFraction(aa,bb)
+
+                  1       1
+   (32)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+                x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+(33) -> partialFraction(2*x^3,bb)
+
+                  1       1
+   (33)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+                x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+
+These are fine, but:
+
+(34) -> partialFraction(aa,1-x^2)
+
+                  2x
+   (34)  - 2x - ------
+                 2
+                x  - 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+
+This must be a bug, since the output is not actually a PartialFraction!
+(I'm curious if this happens with the NAG version.)
+
+The fact that partialFraction(2*x^3,1-x^2) doesn't work is more of a
+wishlist item, since it doesn't give a wrong answer.  Note that
+explicitly making the coefficients fractional works:
+
+(3) -> partialFraction(x^3/2, (x^2-1)/2)
+
+              1       1
+              -       -
+              2       2
+   (3)  x + ----- + -----
+            x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+
+But we can see the same bug I mentioned above if only the numerator has
+a fraction:
+
+(4) -> partialFraction(x^3/2, x^2-1)
+
+                1
+                - x
+        1       2
+   (4)  - x + ------
+        2      2
+              x  - 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+
+
+> If you really want to see the struggles the interpreter is going thru try:
+> 
+> )lisp (setq |$monitorNewWorld| t)
+> 
+> and you can see the interpreter trying to find the correct signature
+> using various coercions. 
+
+Thanks!  It looks pretty painful, though: I tried to follow it, but failed.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--7AUc2qLy4jB3hD7Z
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 15:30:49 2003
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+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 14:51:27 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310071851.h97IpR430191@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, fmaltey@nerim.fr, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom-math@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] partialFraction behavior in Axiom
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+
+Yes, 
+
+aa:UP(x,FRAC INT):=2*x^3
+partialFraction(aa,1-x^2)
+
+also fails in the NAG version. I'm almost certain it is an issue of 
+the interpreter walking itself into some corner of the type system
+and failing to find a good resolution. The usual answer is to give
+it more information as you did by declaring the types. I'll have to
+contemplate the "painful" output and see where it goes astray.
+
+However, this is related to the general issue of automatic coercions,
+types, and simplifications. Somebody needs to write a complete type
+graph independent of systems like Axiom (which would be a PhD thesis
+or two). Then we could code it up in a less adhoc form. We could
+answer questions like "under what conditions can you coerce from a 
+fraction of polynomials over integers to polynomials over fractions
+of integers?" for knarly things like multivariate polynomials. What
+is not apparent on the surface is that some of these coercions go thru
+intermediate types before reaching the final output (basically a walk
+of the type lattice). The problem is very hard.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+To: michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with
+	axiom.
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D2D@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<3F83270B.20453.14EBB4F@localhost>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2003 22:49:07 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <3F83270B.20453.14EBB4F@localhost> (michel lavaud's message of
+	"Tue, 7 Oct 2003 20:50:19 +0200")
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+
+Hello Michel,
+
+michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr writes:
+
+>> Good idea. A minor glitch: the produced PDF file is of poor visual
+>> quality on a computer screen. The embedded fonts are bitmap and thus
+>> cannot be anti-aliased on screen (as I have seen on Acrobat Reader on
+>> Windows platform).
+>
+> Yes, this is a defect of Acrobat Reader. It can be avoided by viewing the 
+> pdf with Ghostscript+GSview/ghostview instead
+
+I'm not sure it is entire Acrobat's fault. I have been able to produce,
+under linux, latex documents that can be seen very well under Acrobat. 
+
+But, as I said, it is just a minor point compared to the work that Bill
+has done. I just wondered how he has made the PDF.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 07 18:29:09 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'David MENTRE'" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2003 18:28:54 -0400 
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with axiom.
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+
+David,
+
+I used TeXmacs to create a master document into which
+all the sections of the tutorial are linked (included).
+TeXmacs treats this as a single document for producing
+the table of contents (I didn't use this) and the index
+(which I did use). The it can also be printed as a single
+large document, even though all of the pieces are edited
+individually. I produced the PDF file from the postscript
+output file generated by TeXmacs by passing it through
+the ghostscript ps2pdf filter.
+
+You are right that the quality of the PDF file when
+viewed using Acrobat under Windows looks rather "thin
+and spotty" on the screen. But if it is printed it looks
+fine. This is a known "problem with TeXmacs". But Michel
+is right that this is not really a TeXmacs problem per se
+but rather a limitation of older versions of Adobe Acrobat
+which could display standard LaTeX fonts very well. The
+new version Adobe Acrobat reader 6.0 is VERY MUCH better.
+And ghostview has been able to view these files properly
+in all the versions available over the last couple of
+years.
+
+It is also true what you said David, that it is possible
+to get around the limitations of the older version by
+using LaTeX and dvi2pdf. This results in substitutions of
+fonts for ones more compatible with Windows. But as far
+as I can see, this is no longer necessary with Acrobat
+Reader 6.0. And if you don't like Acrobat for some
+reason ... then you can install Ghostscript 8 and
+ghostview under Windows and get the essentially the
+same thing.
+
+I was quite disappointed with the limitations current
+version of TeXmacs when it came to producing LaTeX
+format files. The export from the master document did
+not work at all and the export from individual section
+files included many incorrect LaTeX codes. So I wasn't
+able to compile them at all.
+
+The HTML output from this version of TeXmacs however
+is much improved. Only some relatively minor editing
+would be required to make a fairly decent web compatible
+HTML document. But this includes correcting all the
+links in the document which were not converted at all
+and a few special symbols that are not available. So
+it is not entirely trivial and would involve some
+compromises.
+
+I would have liked to use either LaTeX or HTML in order
+to produce a combined document with navigation without
+TeXmacs but not in this version, I guess. Anyway, I think
+the main point of the tutorial is to specifically to use
+in *live* with TeXmacs and Axiom. And this seems to
+work pretty well, although I did run into the limitation
+of some of the "missing" algebra files part way through
+the tutorial. So I stopped converting the input to
+"live" format and depended in the rest of the tutorial
+on just the embedded LaTeX encoded examples (very
+similar to live since they were apparently captured
+in an online session). Of course readers are free to
+break in to using Axiom at any point in the tutorial
+just by clicking the Session/Axiom menu option (or the
+session button). The results of what they do will
+be inserted into the tutorial, although not saved
+unless specifically saved by the user in another file.
+
+In fact, I hope the tutorial will gradually be multiplied,
+improved, and adapted by people who find it useful. I
+think we should maintain some kind of "master copy" on
+the Axiom web site, but otherwise the generous copyright
+provisions of NAG (which apparently legally must be
+maintained) and the BSD licensing etc. would seem to
+encourage it's proliferation.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2003 4:49 PM
+> To: michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning
+> with axiom.
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Michel,
+> 
+> michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr writes:
+> 
+> >> Good idea. A minor glitch: the produced PDF file is of poor
+> >> visual quality on a computer screen. The embedded fonts are 
+> >> bitmap and thus cannot be anti-aliased on screen (as I have
+> >> seen on Acrobat Reader on Windows platform).
+> >
+> > Yes, this is a defect of Acrobat Reader. It can be avoided 
+> > by viewing the pdf with Ghostscript+GSview/ghostview instead
+> 
+> I'm not sure it is entire Acrobat's fault. I have been able 
+> to produce, under linux, latex documents that can be seen
+> very well under Acrobat. 
+> 
+> But, as I said, it is just a minor point compared to the work 
+> that Bill has done. I just wondered how he has made the PDF.
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+> David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning with
+	axiom.
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+
+Bill,
+
+At some future point we should discuss how much work it would be to
+put the book into a texmacs version. I'm a bit buried this week and
+likely next as well. I haven't had a chance to try your demo yet
+although I did download the pdf. It appears that line-breaking needs
+to be slightly smarter. The line breaker algorithm should probably
+be put into Axiom with a ")set linebreak on " command so it works
+with all tex output and not just under texmacs.
+
+I did like the pdf. Looks like good work. I'll try it as soon as I
+get the chance.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>, dpt@math.harvard.edu,
+	"'fmaltey@nerim.fr'" <fmaltey@nerim.fr>
+Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 00:07:36 -0400 
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, axiom-math@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] POLY INT =\\= UP(x,
+	INT) (was: [Axiom-math] partialFraction behavi or in Axiom)
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+
+Tim, Dylan and Fran=E7ois;
+
+This is an interesting discussion and I am glad that we
+have *finally* reached the stage of discussions about
+Axiom and not just scrambling to get something running
+and "out the door"... Yah!
+
+First, there were several emails back and forth that
+already covered some of this, but here's my view:
+
+I think a good definition of 'partfrac' for AXIOM is
+
+  partFrac(ex,x) =3D=3D
+    partialFraction(numer ex, (denom ex)::UP(x, FRAC INT))
+
+Yes, you do have to help AXIOM with some type conversion
+information.
+
+But no, I don't think that there is a bug. We have
+
+  POLY INT has EUCDOM  ----------> false
+  UP(x, FRAC INT) has EUCDOM ----> true
+
+Apparently POLY INT does not have enough structure.
+Specifying x and the FRAC INT domain adds the needed
+structure.
+
+I think that this should be/could be so is quite
+deeply routed in the design of Axiom and it's type
+system. The distinction between
+
+  x^2 - 1
+
+as something of type: POLY INT versus what appears
+as essentially the same thing
+
+  x^2 - 1
+
+as something of type: UP(x,FRAC INT) actually occurs
+very frequently in Axiom (e.g 1::Float, 1.0::Integer).
+Unfortunately it is something rather subtle and not
+easily explained (rationalized?) to the novice user,
+yet seems essential for new Axiom users to learn this as
+soon as possible - that's one reason why I was really
+quite impressed by the quality of the NAG Axiom for
+Windows tutorial, because it is the first Axiom tutorial
+I have seen that tries to address this.
+
+There is also the problem that Fran=E7ois brings up
+involving the presumptions of those users who have
+been previously exposed to one of the other popular
+computer algebra systems (e.g. Maple, MuPad, Mathematica,
+Maxima ... ) which do not share Axiom's strongly typed
+metaphor. (I am one of these people. <grin>) Such a users
+looks for general operations on expressions like "expand",
+"simplify", "combine" etc. and for the most part finds
+them missing from Axiom! To convince some of these users
+about the wisdom of Axiom's approach may require some
+specially written tutorials and comparisons. And I think
+our current discussion is a step toward this.
+
+But inspite of the apparently complexity of Axiom's
+current type system (which I agree is largely due it's
+poor state of documentation and more than a little ad
+hocracy) I think Axiom is still immature with respect to
+some of the common operations that beginning Axiom users
+(but with previous experience) will expect to see. For
+example involving the binomial(p,q) function discussed
+by Fran=E7ois. There seems to be a whole in Axiom's type
+system that does not allow it to deal conveniently with
+this case nor with factorials in general. We need to
+have clear documentation on the structure of the
+algebra and it's type system so that it will be more
+clear where this new functionality would be most
+efficiently and effacatiously added. As Tim frequently
+points out, Axiom is a "long term project"... <sigh>
+
+--------
+
+Let me mention a few simple things of this nature
+that surprized me. I have to admit that I really don't
+understand some of the Axiom ideas. It is hard to
+separate what I don't understand from what I think
+might be wrong. But none of these things are serious
+problems in the long run. Yet they are examples of the
+kind of thing that prevents people from becoming
+comfortable with Axiom quickly.
+
+Consider that we can write examples of Axiom types as
+follows (assumming no other previous information):
+
+  )clear all
+
+  1        Type: PositiveInteger
+  x        Type: Variable x
+  x+1      Type: Polynomial Integer
+  sin(x)   Type: Expression Integer
+
+Clearly Axiom is trying to choose types that are somehow
+"smallest" or most conservative. Surely UP(x,PI) is smaller
+than POLY INT. No? How about (sin x)::EXPR PI. Why is
+POLY PI an invalid type?
+
+And what about the type Axiom associates with something
+like:
+
+  sin(1)    Type: Expression Integer
+
+This "expression" contains no variables!
+
+We have
+
+  sqrt(-1)   Type: AlgebraicNumber
+
+Isn't sin(1) also a Number of of some kind? But I
+can not write:
+
+  sin(1)::Float
+
+while
+
+  sqrt(-1)::Complex Float
+
+is converted to (or at least represented) as i.
+But why not
+
+  sqrt(-1)::Complex Integer
+
+And while I'm complaining ... it seems very strange
+that I cannot by default use the name Real like
+
+  POLY Real
+
+although I can write
+
+  POLY Integer
+
+Ok, I know I should write Float instead of Real, but
+surely that must be rather irritating to the pure
+mathematicians, no?
+
+Now suppose I assign a type to a variable:
+
+  x:Integer
+
+Then I try to use it in:
+
+  x+1
+
+why does Axiom complain that "x is declared as an
+Integer but has not been given a value"? What is
+different from before? Why doesn't Axiom treat this
+as something with
+
+   x+1    Type: Expression Integer
+
+or even
+
+   x+1    Type: Integer Expression Integer
+
+since it "knows" that x is of Type: Integer and 1 is
+of Type: PositiveInteger ?
+
+This is exactly the kind of "type" information
+that would be useful if we were to try to perform
+correct manipulations of expressions like
+
+  binomial(x,y)
+
+I would like to write
+
+  (x,y,z):Matrix Float
+  (a,b):Float
+
+and then expect to be able to write
+
+  a*z*x*y*b
+
+to yield
+
+  a*b*z*x*y
+
+If I haven't said what x, y, and z stand for (i.e.
+their types), then why does Axiom simply
+
+  z*x*y
+
+to
+
+  x*y*z
+
+?
+
+In all this seem to be a lot of hidden assumptions
+and ad hoc behaviour at a fairly basic level. Yes,
+I know that Axiom has been used sucessfully for some
+fairly advanced mathematical research projects, but
+at this fundamental level things seem rather complex
+to the new user ...
+
+Systems like Maple and Mathematica have had a lot more
+resources in recent years to smooth out some of these
+rough edges. With Axiom's recent resurrection from the
+ashes, it seems like we have a good opportunity to
+address some of these issues.
+
+I am still rather uncertain whether the changes need
+to be towards an algebra system that is simpler and
+more rigorous but quite possibly less powerful (like
+the Aldor project) or whether there should be more
+emphasis on tools and techniques that allow one to deal
+with the complexity more efficiently and to thereby
+successfully build even larger and more complex algebraic
+structures (even loops!) in an ongoing manner. I think
+clearly that Tim has opted for the latter. Right Tim?
+
+-----
+
+Another subject.
+
+There are a few technical problems with the TeXmacs-
+Axiom interface. Most of these can be easily cleaned
+up, I think given a little available time. But I think
+I disagree with you Dylan about the case of
+
+> factor 15
+
+$$
+3 \  5 
+\leqno(11)
+$$
+
+It seems to me that the space inserted by Axiom is
+correct, although in some cases (such as in the case
+of single character symbols) it might be replaced with
+a "thin" or "medium" space \, \; instead of a "full"
+space \ . I think that it is not correct that it currently
+disappears in Axiom. (Do you agree?) There is currently
+some logic in Sutor's linebreak code (which I encorporated
+in the tm_axiom interface) to replace \ with \cdot in
+certain cases involving line-broken products. I think
+that there is a lot of room to improve and expand on
+these typographic issues in the next versions of
+tm_axiom.
+
+At first I thought that it might be good if we could get
+the TeXmacs folks (Joris) to agree to support the tm_axiom
+interface. But now I am thinking more in terms of
+recommending that we accept it as a new and more or less
+integral part of Axiom and that we should maintain it
+along with the other Axiom user interface code. I don't
+know if there is really a licensing issue as such, but we
+should note that TeXmacs is GPL (and therefore so is the
+ revised tm_axiom which was based on their version), not
+BSD. (Forget I mentioned this ... )
+
+Sorry for the long email. It's been a long day.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Tim Daly [mailto:daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2003 2:51 PM
+> To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; axiom-math@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-math] partialFraction behavior in Axiom
+> 
+> 
+> Yes, 
+> 
+> aa:UP(x,FRAC INT):=3D2*x^3
+> partialFraction(aa,1-x^2)
+> 
+> also fails in the NAG version. I'm almost certain it is an
+> issue of the interpreter walking itself into some corner of
+> the type system and failing to find a good resolution. The
+> usual answer is to give it more information as you did by
+> declaring the types. I'll have to contemplate the "painful"
+> output and see where it goes astray.
+> 
+> However, this is related to the general issue of automatic
+> coercions, types, and simplifications. Somebody needs to
+> write a complete type graph independent of systems like Axiom
+> (which would be a PhD thesis or two). Then we could code it
+> up in a less adhoc form. We could answer questions like
+> "under what conditions can you coerce from a fraction of
+> polynomials over integers to polynomials over fractions
+> of integers?" for knarly things like multivariate polynomials.
+> What is not apparent on the surface is that some of these
+> coercions go thru intermediate types before reaching the
+> final output (basically a walk of the type lattice). The
+> problem is very hard.
+> 
+> Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 08 01:40:10 2003
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+Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 01:39:19 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D33@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, fmaltey@nerim.fr, axiom-math@nongnu.org,
+	daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] opus 1, act 1
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+
+Well, that's a long email. I'll have to reply in smaller chunks as 
+it is after midnight and I've gotta get to work early tomorrow.
+
+>I think that this should be/could be so is quite
+>deeply routed in the design of Axiom and it's type
+>system. The distinction between
+>
+>  x^2 - 1
+>
+>as something of type: POLY INT versus what appears
+>as essentially the same thing
+>
+>  x^2 - 1
+>
+>as something of type: UP(x,FRAC INT) actually occurs
+>very frequently in Axiom (e.g 1::Float, 1.0::Integer).
+>Unfortunately it is something rather subtle and not
+>easily explained (rationalized?) to the novice user,
+
+Think of it in terms of Java code. You can have two classes
+(POLYINT and UPxFRACINT) that have the same print representation
+but different properties.
+
+I suppose that POLY(INT) is similar to UP(x,INT) since the coefficients
+are integers. There is a way to coere INTs to FRAC(INT)s (the
+denominator becomes 1). However notice that FRAC(INT) does not occur
+at the top level of the "type tower". That is, to coerce
+UP(x, INT) to UP(x,FRAC INT) you have to "reach into" the type tower
+and convert something below the top level type of UP. This is a hard
+problem in general and there is no good theory I'm aware of that says
+how to do this in a theoretically correct way.
+
+>yet seems essential for new Axiom users to learn this as
+>soon as possible - that's one reason why I was really
+>quite impressed by the quality of the NAG Axiom for
+>Windows tutorial, because it is the first Axiom tutorial
+>I have seen that tries to address this.
+
+The book talks about it. It is not easy to understand if you are
+not both a programmer and a mathematician. Programmers "get it" in the
+sense of Java types. Mathematicians "get it" in the sense of 
+categories. Neither is fully correct.
+
+I've been making the point as part of our 30 year planning horizon
+that we really need a new department that is a cross between the
+math and comp. sci. departments. Call it computational mathematics.
+There are a boatload of issues that only a computational mathematician
+cares about (program proof, correctness, complexity, type coercions,
+type lattices, algorithmic mathematics, lambda reductions, etc).
+We need to give the correct background to the next generation and
+we need research in these issues done by PhD students.
+
+>There is also the problem that François brings up
+>involving the presumptions of those users who have
+>been previously exposed to one of the other popular
+>computer algebra systems (e.g. Maple, MuPad, Mathematica,
+>Maxima ... ) which do not share Axiom's strongly typed
+>metaphor. (I am one of these people. <grin>) Such a users
+>looks for general operations on expressions like "expand",
+>"simplify", "combine" etc. and for the most part finds
+>them missing from Axiom! To convince some of these users
+>about the wisdom of Axiom's approach may require some
+>specially written tutorials and comparisons. And I think
+>our current discussion is a step toward this.
+
+I think it was Knuth that said "Teaching BASIC to beginning
+programmers causes brain damage and the student will never
+recover". The 4Ms have created the illusion that you can 
+freely compute results without worrying about the issues that
+Axiom struggles with. I believe that this illusion makes it
+very difficult to build ever-larger systems. If you can't 
+appeal to some theory then the complexity alone will overwhelm
+your efforts. Think of the benefits of a strongly typed language
+like Java vs a typeless language like BASIC. You can build 
+programs in BASIC but you eventually hit the wall when the 
+complexity gets high. Java lets you get further. By analogy
+I'm arguing that the 4Ms make simple things simple but complex
+things ever harder and that Axiom reverses that. I claim that
+Axiom scales and the more theory we develop the better it scales.
+
+Of course all of this theory does not help the beginner use Axiom.
+At my institute (CAISS at City College of New York) we are planning
+to build a series of simple menu-driven front ends for Axiom in a
+large variety of courses. The front end hides the complexity because
+it only works in a single type (e.g. Expression or POLY(INT)) that
+is sufficient for the beginner. Because the operations are all in
+one type the issue of type conversion is diminished.
+
+>But inspite of the apparently complexity of Axiom's
+>current type system (which I agree is largely due it's
+>poor state of documentation and more than a little adhocracy
+
+Yes, the interpreter uses some adhoc methods to try to guess 
+what type you might want. It selects functions based on the
+type of its arguments as well as the type of the result so it
+has to work very hard if you don't give it enough information.
+The problem is that YOU have underspecified the input. The
+interpreter has to guess and sometimes it does it badly. 
+
+There is no general theory that underpins all of Axiom's type lattice.
+We need to create one. The mathematics is pretty sound but there are
+a lot of "computational" issues with the mathematics that need work.
+
+>(but with previous experience) will expect to see. For
+>example involving the binomial(p,q) function discussed
+>by François. There seems to be a whole in Axiom's type
+>system that does not allow it to deal conveniently with
+>this case nor with factorials in general. We need to
+>have clear documentation on the structure of the
+>algebra and it's type system so that it will be more
+>clear where this new functionality would be most
+>efficiently and effacatiously added. As Tim frequently
+>points out, Axiom is a "long term project"... <sigh>
+
+It is possible to build a series of cover functions that always
+work in one type. That will eliminate most of the problems you
+are seeing. Expression(Polynomial(Fraction(Integer))) is a type
+tower that is probably general enough to do what you want. Of 
+course the cover functions will have to coerce things back and
+forth internally to use the existing functions (such as you did
+with partfrac).
+
+>Clearly Axiom is trying to choose types that are somehow
+>"smallest" or most conservative. Surely UP(x,PI) is smaller
+>than POLY INT. No? How about (sin x)::EXPR PI. Why is
+>POLY PI an invalid type?
+
+POLY takes an argument which is a RING.
+You can ask Axiom about these properties thus:
+
+-> )show POLY
+
+  Polynomial R: Ring    
+
+which means that Polynomial requires an argument which is of type Ring.
+So we can ask Axiom about INT and PI:
+
+-> INT has RING
+
+  true
+
+-> PI has RING
+  
+  false
+
+So when you try to construct POLY(PI) Axiom checks the category of
+PI to see if is a Ring. It isn't (it lacks inverses). So Axiom will
+not let you construct an incorrect type. The same mechanism keeps
+you from constructing Polynomials of files, or matricies of streams.
+Files don't have the properties necessary to be a Ring and Polynomials
+assume their coefficients are Rings. When you operate on Polynomials
+the operations for the coefficients (e.g. subtracting) are done by
+looking up the operation "in the coefficient domain". If you do:
+
+)show PI
+
+you'll see that PositiveInteger does not support subtraction so
+it does not make sense to build Polynomials over PositiveIntegers.
+In general if you can construct the type tower the operations will
+be correct. This is the big advantage of Axiom over the 4Ms.
+
+Sleep calls. More later. 
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 12:45:12 -0400 
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: opus 1, act 1
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Wednesday, October 08, 2003 1:39 AM you wrote:
+
+> ...
+> > The distinction between
+> >
+> >  x^2 - 1
+> >
+> >as something of type: POLY INT versus what appears
+> >as essentially the same thing
+> >
+> >  x^2 - 1
+> >
+> >as something of type: UP(x,FRAC INT) actually occurs
+> >very frequently in Axiom (e.g. 1::Float, 1.0::Integer).
+> >Unfortunately it is something rather subtle and not
+> >easily explained (rationalized?) to the novice user,
+> 
+> Think of it in terms of Java code. You can have two
+> classes (POLYINT and UPxFRACINT) that have the same
+> print representation but different properties.
+
+Yes and no. I do not think fondly of the Java programming
+language. Pardon my opinions, but it seems to me that
+Java is largely a failed experiment in portable interpreter/
+compiler design that was too much hyped by the corporate
+establishment (first SUN and then later others). For the
+most part the promises of code reusability and portability
+have yet to be attained.
+
+Now that Maple version 9 has been commercially released,
+I think I can safely mention that I have been involved in
+about 6 months of beta testing of a new graphical user
+interface for Maple written entirely in Java "for portability".
+The experience was frustrating and the results largely
+unsatisfactory (in my opinion). But it has been shipped to
+customers along with the older "classical" interface which
+was written in C. At least they still have that option for
+now.
+
+I like Java in small quantities, e.g. embedded as simple
+scripts inside web pages. But for hacking, give me Perl
+and for a better approach give me Python (more Lisp-like).
+Dropping Java was one of the good things that Microsoft
+actually did. Sorry. It's just an "issue" for me.
+
+> 
+> I suppose that POLY(INT) is similar to UP(x,INT) since
+> the coefficients are integers. There is a way to coerce
+> INTs to FRAC(INT)s (the denominator becomes 1). However
+> notice that FRAC(INT) does not occur at the top level of
+> the "type tower". That is, to coerce UP(x, INT) to
+> UP(x,FRAC INT) you have to "reach into" the type tower
+> and convert something below the top level type of UP.
+> This is a hard problem in general and there is no good
+> theory I'm aware of that says how to do this in a
+> theoretically correct way.
+
+But there is something else here - specifying the variable(s)
+in the polynomial. Without doing that we can not distinguish
+between
+
+  a x + a^2
+
+and
+
+  x a + x^2
+
+So POLY INT and UP(x,INT) are clearly different. It is
+tempting to think of this a purely a "syntactic" type
+difference but I think it becomes a matter of semantics
+in AXIOM.
+
+> ... 
+> I think it was Knuth that said "Teaching BASIC to
+> beginning programmers causes brain damage and the
+> student will never recover".
+
+Indeed! "Re-learning" is often more difficult that "learning".
+
+> The 4Ms have created the illusion that you can freely
+> compute results without worrying about the issues that
+> Axiom struggles with.
+
+I think will have to admit that so far it is a pretty
+convincing "illusion"! I continue to be amazed at what
+is possible with "modern" computer algebra systems -
+and also what remains unreasonably difficult...
+
+> I believe that this illusion makes it very difficult to
+> build ever-larger systems. If you can't appeal to some
+> theory then the complexity alone will overwhelm your
+> efforts. Think of the benefits of a strongly typed language
+> like Java vs a typeless language like BASIC. You can build 
+> programs in BASIC but you eventually hit the wall when the 
+> complexity gets high. Java lets you get further.
+
+Oh, oh. The Java example again ...
+
+> By analogy I'm arguing that the 4Ms make simple things
+> simple but complex things ever harder and that Axiom
+> reverses that. I claim that Axiom scales and the more
+> theory we develop the better it scales.
+>
+
+I don't know. Some simple things are still unreasonably
+hard in Maple and other similar systems. And getting
+started in Axiom is really rather simple, no? I am
+optimistic that a more complete, logical and well
+documented type system for AXIOM could go a long way
+towards making at least the same set of simple things
+simple in Axiom as well.
+ 
+> Of course all of this theory does not help the beginner
+> use Axiom. At my institute (CAISS at City College of New
+> York) we are planning to build a series of simple
+> menu-driven front ends for Axiom in a large variety of
+> courses.
+
+I am very sceptical of this. Both Mathematica and Maple
+(for example see Maplets) have tried this. It does seem
+to be of interest in the "teaching circles" but my
+interest in it for applications in theoretical physics
+is zero.
+
+> The front end hides the complexity because it only
+> works in a single type (e.g. Expression or POLY(INT)) that
+> is sufficient for the beginner. Because the operations are
+> all in one type the issue of type conversion is diminished.
+
+Isn't that like "cutting off AXIOM's nose to suit it's
+face" ?? <grin>
+
+> 
+> It is possible to build a series of cover functions that
+> always work in one type. That will eliminate most of the
+> problems you are seeing. Expression
+>    Polynomial(Fraction(Integer))
+> is a type tower that is probably general enough to do what
+> you want. Of course the cover functions will have to coerce
+> things back and forth internally to use the existing
+> functions (such as you did with partfrac).
+
+Maybe. Perhaps I will try to write a few more like this
+and see if it really does provide a more "4M" type of
+user layer.
+
+> 
+> >Clearly Axiom is trying to choose types that are somehow
+> >"smallest" or most conservative. Surely UP(x,PI) is
+> >smaller than POLY INT. No? How about (sin x)::EXPR PI.
+> >Why is POLY PI an invalid type?
+> 
+> POLY takes an argument which is a RING.
+
+Yes, of course you are right. But there is still the
+issue of specifying the polynomial variables. It seems to
+me that AXIOM could choose UP(x ...), MPOLY([x,y, ... ),
+or DMP([x,y, ... ) instead of POLY. This might help some
+automatic coercions.
+
+> ... 
+> So when you try to construct POLY(PI) Axiom checks the
+> category of PI to see if is a Ring. It isn't (it lacks
+> inverses). So Axiom will not let you construct an incorrect
+> type. The same mechanism keeps you from constructing
+> Polynomials of files, or matricies of streams. Files
+> don't have the properties necessary to be a Ring and
+> Polynomials assume their coefficients are Rings. When
+> you operate on Polynomials the operations for the
+> coefficients (e.g. subtracting) are done by looking up
+> the operation "in the coefficient domain".
+
+Yes. The discussion of Files and Polynomials in the
+same breath is probably quite a mental stretch for
+most beginning AXIOM users (I am now used to this ...)
+And the example seems a bit contrived, but I get your
+point.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 08 15:07:19 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 15:06:59 -0400 
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] AXIOM book and TeXmacs (was: Looking for
+	beginning with axiom.)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+TeXmacs does a pretty good job of importing TeX/LaTeX
+into TeXmacs format (but not so good in the other
+direction in the current version), so I think it should
+be quite easy to put the AXIOM book into this format.
+The tutorial files provided by Mike at NAG where in
+LaTeX form with a few special tags. TeXmacs handled
+the conversion very well. If you want me to give it
+a try, just send me a few sample files.
+
+Putting the LaTeX line breaker algorithm into Axiom
+sounds fine. In fact it seems curious the Sutor chose
+to do it in classic C code rather than in Axiom itself.
+Although I have to admit that I find the way Axiom
+generates LaTeX rather obscure! And for now improving
+and maintaining the tm_axiom.c program seems much
+easier.
+
+I am also interested in David's idea of trying to
+encorporate the HyperDoc browser function into the
+TeXmacs - Axiom interface.
+
+And of course then there is the graphics. TeXmacs can
+accept and insert graphics generated by external programs
+in postscript format. Can Axiom's graphics program
+produce postscript output?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2003 9:44 PM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca; bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+> Cc: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Axiom-mail] Looking for beginning
+> with axiom.
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> At some future point we should discuss how much work it would be to
+> put the book into a texmacs version. I'm a bit buried this week and
+> likely next as well. I haven't had a chance to try your demo yet
+> although I did download the pdf. It appears that line-breaking needs
+> to be slightly smarter. The line breaker algorithm should probably
+> be put into Axiom with a ")set linebreak on " command so it works
+> with all tex output and not just under texmacs.
+> 
+> I did like the pdf. Looks like good work. I'll try it as soon as I
+> get the chance.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 08 15:22:22 2003
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+Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 15:20:11 -0400
+From: Dylan Thurston <dpt@lotus.bostoncoop.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Compilation problems
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
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+
+(I tried sending this before, but it didn't seem to go through.)
+
+I've been trying to compile the CVS version of axiom (because the
+Debian package does not have COMBF.o), on my Debian installation.
+Problems I've encountered so far (runing AXIOM=3Dlinux make):
+
+(a) The makefiles seem to expect the directory
+(top)/mnt/linux/src/algebra to exist already.
+
+(b) creating the NRLIB files from the spad files fails, because
+interpsys fails to run.  After some experimentation, it seems that
+with the following environemnt variables set:
+
+O=3Do AXIOMXLROOT=3Dlinux/compiler SPAD=3D/a/usr/local/src/axiom/mnt/linux =
+OBJ=3D/a/usr/local/src/axiom/obj SPD=3D/a/usr/local/src/axiom MNT=3D/a/usr/=
+local/src/axiom/mnt DAASE=3D/a/usr/local/src/axiom/src/share INC=3D/a/usr/l=
+ocal/src/axiom/src/include LISP=3Dlsp BYE=3Dbye SPADBIN=3D/a/usr/local/src/=
+axiom/mnt/linux/bin AXIOM=3Dlinux
+
+(where /usr/local/src/axiom is the top of the tree), interpsys finds
+the daase files but fails to find the autloads: the makefile runs this
+command:
+
+(cd /a/usr/local/src/axiom/int/algebra ; echo ')co AHYP.spad' | /a/usr/loca=
+l/src/axiom/obj/linux/bin/interpsys )
+
+which fails to find the autloads: interpsys ends with
+
+(1) ->    Loading linux/autoload/apply.
+ 
+   >> System error:
+   Cannot open the file /a/usr/local/src/axiom/int/algebra/./linux/algebra/=
+linux/autoload/apply.
+
+If I unset the AXIOM environment variable, interpsys gets farther.
+
+Can someone who understands the Makefile better than me help me here?
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+--c3bfwLpm8qysLVxt
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+
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+
+Bill,
+
+The graphics program generates .ps files.
+I'm nearing the point where I can extract the graphics code.
+I'm going to give responsibility for that whole subsystem to Dylan.
+
+I'll send you a portion of the book latex shortly (by boat :-) ).
+We should talk about the way to handle a book-sized object in texmacs.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 10:00:37 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 09:21:32 -0400
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] lattice drawing program
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+
+Bill,
+
+Re: lattices. I vaguely remember a program that allowed you to navigate
+a lattice by magnifying portions under the mouse cursor. It was as if
+the whole lattice was wrapped around a ball and you portion of the ball
+closest to you was easier to read than the rest. I can't remember where
+I saw it. Windows XP has a much cheesier version in their taskbar.
+
+re: a willing grad student
+guffaw.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 10:03:42 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 09:24:48 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310091324.h99DOmC14605@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] build bug
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+
+Dylan,
+
+Try making the pathname absolute. And it needs to include the mnt directory
+thus:
+
+AXIOM=/usr/local/axiom/mnt/linux
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 11:00:20 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:20:13 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310091420.h99EKDX18821@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] categorical design, aldor, and the type system
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan, Bill,
+
+re: Aldor rewrite. 
+
+Many people, including myself, have tried to reconstruct and/or
+rewrite the Axiom type system in Aldor. This is unlikely for at least
+4 reasons.
+
+First, the type system is reasonable but adhoc since it doesn't have a
+one to one correspondence with theory. (e.g. what is a RNG?)
+
+Second, there are types that are mathematical but their implementation
+depends on various data structures for efficient implementation so
+there isn't even a guiding theory.
+
+Third, an Aldor implementation would be a library not an
+interpreter/compiler combination so the user would have to perform
+type coercion and simplification, which is very hard to get right.
+
+Fourth, and to the last point, there are hundreds of man-years of
+research in Axiom. A clean-room rewrite would need the many great
+talents that have already contributed to Axiom (although there are new
+talented people) and would never get funded (because computer algebra
+"has been done"). And since Axiom work isn't usually recognized by
+university departments (unlike, say, bourbaki contributions) it is
+unlikely that such a massive, coordinated effort can exist. (A point
+which I'm ignoring as I hope to attract free research for the love of
+it :-) ).
+
+Aldor is a great language and it is a very seductive idea to do Axiom
+over and try to "get it right" but that implies covering a LOT of old
+ground before you develop new work. Plus we don't even know or agree
+about what is "right". I think there is a lot of new mathematics that
+needs to be researched and a lot of mathematics (like symbolic
+summation) that Axiom needs which exists but is not implemented in
+Axiom.
+
+re: type system
+
+We need to examine what exists in depth and decide what the best
+algorithms are for type conversion. I figure we can do this by
+understanding the existing type lattice, codifying the adhoc
+algorithms current in use, and developing a "coercion theory"
+that shows what the algorithms should do. That way we aren't
+just "patching" the problem. We're developing a theory that needs
+to exist. To this end I've started collecting the raw data of
+the existing type signatures so we can do the first step.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 11:04:49 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:25:03 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310091425.h99EP3l18841@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] categorical design
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+
+Bill,
+
+It is perfectly possible to develop an independent type hierarchy
+that lives along side of the existing hierarchy. Indeed the could
+interact where convenient (e.g. using data structures in common
+so already-implemented algorithms can be used).
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 11:10:50 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 10:31:55 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] coerce, cast, partial fractions
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+re: coerce vs casting
+
+I wouldn't equate coercions with type casting. First, type casting in
+languages like C "reinterpret" the bits. Coercions reinterpret the
+type and potentially rewrite the representation. Second, type casting
+traditionally references the "top level type" whereas Axiom can reach
+into the type tower and move an "internal" type (e.g. UP(x,INT) to
+UP(x,FRAC INT)).
+
+re: partial fractions
+
+If I understand the partialFraction answer (perhaps I don't) the
+result given is a partial fraction as far as Axiom is concerned.
+Partial fractions work on the factored equation and it appears
+that Axiom doesn't think it can factor the equation over the
+target domain so the partial fraction uses the "fully factored"
+value. The issue appears to be that the target domain chosen by
+the interpreter is one in which there are no factors. Or perhaps
+it is just a street-level bug :-)
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 13:39:51 2003
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+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 13:39:16 -0400
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: 
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+--7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH
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+
+On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:31:55AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> If I understand the partialFraction answer (perhaps I don't) the
+> result given is a partial fraction as far as Axiom is concerned.
+> Partial fractions work on the factored equation and it appears
+> that Axiom doesn't think it can factor the equation over the
+> target domain so the partial fraction uses the "fully factored"
+> value. The issue appears to be that the target domain chosen by
+> the interpreter is one in which there are no factors. Or perhaps
+> it is just a street-level bug :-)
+
+But how could x^2-1 not be factorizable in any reasonable domain?
+
+I can see that AXIOM might pick a domain where it doesn't know how to
+factor, but I would be very surprised to see one coming from an
+expression like this!
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH
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+
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] 
+	Re: categorical design, aldor, and the type system
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+
+On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:20:13AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> re: type system
+> 
+> We need to examine what exists in depth and decide what the best
+> algorithms are for type conversion. I figure we can do this by
+> understanding the existing type lattice, codifying the adhoc
+> algorithms current in use, and developing a "coercion theory"
+> that shows what the algorithms should do. That way we aren't
+> just "patching" the problem. We're developing a theory that needs
+> to exist. To this end I've started collecting the raw data of
+> the existing type signatures so we can do the first step.
+
+Hmm?  Surely the algorithm used for doing automatic type coercions is
+independent of the existing heirarchy?
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
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+	(dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu)
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+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
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+
+I'm not claiming that the math is right, just trying to figure out
+why it didn't factor the expression. It certainly is a bug.
+
+T
+
+
+
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] categorical design, aldor, and the type system
+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 21:54:31 -0400
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Thursday, October 09, 2003 10:20 AM you wrote:
+> 
+> re: Aldor rewrite. 
+> 
+> Many people, including myself, have tried to reconstruct 
+> and/or rewrite the Axiom type system in Aldor. This is 
+> unlikely for at least 4 reasons.
+>
+
+I agree that this is probably not a reasonable prospect. On
+the other hand, I have contemplated the opposite possibility,
+that is to re-import back into Axiom the new Aldor type
+library. This might be a much smaller project since the new
+Aldor type library was re-designed recently (last year?)
+and is still quite primative and limited compared to Axiom
+as a whole.
+
+Last time I mentioned this you gave a muffled answer which
+I took to mean either of two things: 1) you weren't interested
+or thought it not worthwhile, or 2) there has been some
+discussions with people working on the Aldor project about
+this possibility and so far there is "not good agreement".
+
+Since I think that the relationship between Axiom and Aldor
+is an interesting subject, I would be glad to hear more
+about this situtation when you feel you can or when you
+have time to discuss it.
+ 
+> First, ...
+> 
+> Second, ...
+> 
+> Third, an Aldor implementation would be a library not an 
+> interpreter/compiler combination so the user would have to 
+> perform type coercion and simplification, which is very hard 
+> to get right.
+
+I am not sure I understand your point. As you have pointed
+out, Axiom also compiles it's library (It was from this that
+the notion of Aldor as a separte compiler originally arose,
+right?). And Axiom also usually (when it can) compiles the
+functions provided by the user at "run- time". I understand
+that it some cases Axiom is not able to compile user provided
+code and then resorts to "interpreter" mode. I take this to
+mean that it attempts to delay resolution of types until the
+function is actually applied. This sort of interpreter mode
+is still unique to Axiom, I think.
+
+> 
+> Fourth, ...
+> 
+> Aldor is a great language and it is a very seductive idea to 
+> do Axiom over and try to "get it right" but that implies 
+> covering a LOT of old ground before you develop new work. 
+> Plus we don't even know or agree about what is "right".
+> ...
+
+"Uncle". You've convinced me! <grin>  But seriously I never
+was actually quite thinking along these lines. I have become
+convinced that it is probably possible to work from "within"
+Axiom to extend and change it more gradually along certain
+lines with a true or at least more "categorial implementation"
+only as a longer term goal.
+ 
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 22:35:10 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] categorical design
+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 22:34:30 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	'Bertfried Fauser' <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Thursday, October 09, 2003 10:25 AM you wrote:
+> 
+> It is perfectly possible to develop an independent type 
+> hierarchy that lives along side of the existing hierarchy. 
+> Indeed the could interact where convenient (e.g. using data 
+> structures in common so already-implemented algorithms can be
+> used).
+> 
+
+Yes, this is (more or less) what I was contemplating,
+although it may be that for a "categorial" imlementation
+in the long run very little of the algebra that now exists in
+Axiom would be of much use because the changes must occur
+at a very top level in the type lattice - at the level of
+SetCategory.
+
+Note: I used the word "categorial" (not a typing error).
+This was a convention used by a few category theorists some
+years ago when there was the possibility of being confused
+over other uses of the word "category" and especially to
+avoid the use of the word "categorical" which sounds
+unnecessarily pejorative and non-technical. <grin>
+
+More specifically, I am thinking that it may be possible to
+build on Axiom by intially going even higher up to define
+a new categorial level at the top and then building up to
+SetCategory on which almost all the rest of Axiom currently
+hangs. (This might include Aggregate and some other top level
+Axiom categories as well.) So initially only SetCategory and
+Aggregate become defined in terms of this new deeper level.
+But gradually one could redefine some of the lower types to
+depend on types higher up in the new categorial level. And
+this way gradually shift SetCategory and it's properly related
+types lower down in the hierachy.
+
+This might sound fairly simple, but the problem of course
+is that really the category SET is a rather complex object
+categorially speaking.
+
+But even more speculatively speaking, I have come to realize
+that what we more or less naturally assume to be a type hierachy
+(lattice) is not really a lattice at all in the case of Axiom -
+it contains loops! Your current method of "breaking" these
+loops is quite simple since in most respects the existing
+loops in Axiom are quite simple (This is a claim that I can
+not yet actually substantiate.) But if we can assume a more
+general approach to "solving" such specification loops (e.g.
+by the iterative "fixed point" approach I mentioned many
+emails ago). Then *maybe* it makes sense to actually begin
+now by redefining SetCategory (and a few other top level
+Axiom categories) in terms of some of the lower level ones.
+
+This latter strategy would of course introduce some serious
+and potentially non-trivial loops in the "hierachy". And
+the trouble is that I am really not sure I understand well
+enough what it means to deal in general terms with type
+specifications given in this manner. Now that seems like a
+serious mathematical/computer science research subject to
+me!
+
+I would like to hear more from you (and other longer term
+Axiom builders/hackers) about the loops in Axiom's type
+system. Are these "errors" which need to be eliminated?
+Or are they a new more powerful method of defining types?
+
+Is it true that recent formal developments in mathematics
+support the idea that such loops are really a necessary
+and fundamental part of mathematics? What do you think
+Bertfried? I think it was you who suggested this first here.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 09 22:55:12 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "'Bill Page'" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>,
+	"'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] categorical design
+Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 22:54:30 -0400
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+	'Bertfried Fauser' <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
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+
+BTW, if I haven't already mentioned it here (or even if
+I have ... <grin> ) I would like to recommend a good and
+easily available book on category theory and type systems.
+See the book
+
+  Categories Types and Structures
+  by Asperti and Longo
+  MIT Press, 1991
+
+Now available for download at:
+
+  http://www.di.ens.fr/users/longo/download.html
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] categorical design
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+
+Bill,
+
+re: categorical redesign.
+
+My view of this is to think of Axiom's mathematics as a general
+graph rather than as a lattice with loops. Think of drawing the
+whole of the algebra on the surface of a sphere. Picking one of 
+several defined starting points (sets, categories) in the algebra 
+would be like rotating the ball until the chosen point is at the
+north pole. Everything else is defined in terms of that pole.
+Choosing a new point would be like rotating the sphere to 
+adjust it to the new "north pole" and everything in the graph
+now flows from that point. A loop in the algebra goes all the
+way around the sphere and you can choose any point in the loop
+as fundamental. The choices I made to "break the loop" were
+arbitrary.
+
+I'm not sure if the graph-mapped-onto-a-surface resonates with
+you but that's how I think about it. (The surface need not be a
+sphere, of course).
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+From: Bertfried Fauser <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+To: root <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] categorical design
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+
+Dear Bill,
+
+	I judge myself not an expert in category theory (though I heavily
+use it) and I am certainly not aware of the complexity of AXIOMs type
+system (yet). But perhaps the following may help:
+
+a) There is not "category theory" per se. Many people do quite different
+(and sometimes contradicting) things with categories. Hence with "category
+theory" there has to come meta information to make sure its used the
+_polictical correct_ way. I had some problems with other mathematicians
+whene I used categories not that way ;-)
+-- Set Based category theory, ie the older version. This is still based on
+   the idea (Bourbaki by the way) that all of mathematics should be based
+   on set theory (in my eyes a contradictinmg paradigm to quantum mechanics).
+   Nevertheless, this treatment came up with homological algebra and went
+   into categories which are *not* af type set at all....
+-- Function based category theory (still a new branch of mathematics,
+   started by William Lawvere and others, using *constructivistic* ideas
+   of Brouwer [hence a generic computational approch, one should think]).
+   The idea is to define functions as elementary objects and then compute
+   from scratch what kind of (sometimes awkward!) objects may be
+   manipulated by these functions (domains and codomains may be categories
+   itself). It does not make a choice of a _basic category_ but leaves
+   this open.
+	Regarding AXIOM, a valuable choice would be a topos. Topi (Lawvere
+   calls them toposes, which is linguistical barbaric ;-) Constitute a
+   sort of category which is very close to Set, but slightly larges, just
+   axiomatizing the basic structures of Set. Its a general experience,
+   that if you axiomatize mathematical structures in a categorial way
+   then you get more general structures due to isomorphism invariance of
+   these _objects_.
+
+b) From matroid theory (which encodes very basic facts about linear and
+general dependance of objects) one learns that there is something like a
+cryptomorphism spoiling the idea that mathematics is a well ordrere (or
+even partially ordered) lattice. Indeed you find complicate isomorphisms
+from one axiom system into another which maps basic structures to very
+complicated ones and vice versa (Tim's 'shere', by the way a very
+complicated topological problem to detect on which (hyper)surface a graph
+may live).
+	Hence I guess that there will be no generic or cannonical choice
+for an starting point in the type lattice, but it should be a matter of
+taste and adjusted to the problems you want to attack.
+
+c) Isomorphisms problem.
+	It is a general *problem* (dealt with under the name of
+_categorification_ to 'categorify' a mathematical structure, say the
+natural numbers. Since this is a generalization it is neither canonical
+nor unique and needs meta input (experience or even information from
+physics ie experiments) if the math shall be related to soemthing
+reasonable. A current problem is to categorify the theory of categories (a
+typical mathematical thinking <grin>) which leads to n-category theory,
+which I am try to employ in quantum physics. This is unsolved mathematical
+reasearch, ....
+
+d) Isomorphisms implementation problem.
+	From my own experiments with CAS (eg Maple) there is anothe
+rproblem for actual computations. Having defined a mathematical category,
+you have set up an abstract structure of relations between functions.
+However, if you want to implement this, you need _elements_ on which such
+functions can act. That is you need a modell for your category, such
+modells may be *tremendously* different and it might be a practical
+impossible task to construct an isomorphsims (type conversion) between
+such elements *even if you can mathematically prove they are of the same
+kin*!
+	Moreover, you find *non representable* categories, which cannot be
+represented over the category Set, which are quite awkward object. I do
+not yet see how to impelemt such categories is a CAS.
+	A further example is that patological objects migcome into play.
+Zbigniew Oziewicz and I do search for years now a categorial description
+of Clifford algebras. But reasonable axioms *include* some further
+algebras with quite obscure behaviour which you would not like to address
+by this name. If you introduce base (ie elements represnting the algebra)
+this diaspears, but I do not yet know why..... Such problems will arise if
+a strickt mathematical type system would be implemented.
+
+Hence the AXIOM types may still have a need to be based on some
+representations, which is a second layer of non abstractnes (after the
+choice of a starting 'north pole' in the type graph. I see currently no
+way around this (but I am not an expert in type-ing ;-) )
+
+hope this is informative for you, otherwise I apologize
+cheers
+BF.
+
+% |   | PD Dr Bertfried Fauser    Fachbereich Physik    Fach M 678  |
+%  \ /  Universit"at Konstanz     78457 Konstanz        Germany     |
+% (mul) Phone : +49 7531 883786   FAX : +49 7531 88-4864 or 4266 (comul)
+%   |   E-mail: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de                   / \
+%   |   URL   : http://clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de/~fauser    |   |
+
+>> A prophet does not count in his country -- a patriot nowhere else <<
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 10 09:52:54 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 10 Oct 2003 09:51:59 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+Lines: 29
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Greetings!  Just went to build a fresh cvs snapshot Debian package
+yesterday (to include some of the tutorial documentation developed --
+this stuff is great!), and the build appears to be broken due to
+missing files:
+
+313 making /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/int/input/eqtbl.input from /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src/input/eqtbl.input.pamphlet
+312 making /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/input/eqtbl.input from /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/int/input/eqtbl.input
+315 making /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/int/input/equation.input from /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src/input/equation.input.pamphlet
+314 making /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/input/equation.input from /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/int/input/equation.input
+make[4]: *** No rule to make target `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src/input/errortrap.input.pamphlet', needed by `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/int/input/errortrap.input'.  Stop.
+make[4]: Leaving directory `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src/input'
+make[3]: *** [inputdir] Error 2
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src'
+make[2]: *** [srcdir] Error 2
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs'
+make[1]: *** [all] Error 2
+make[1]: Leaving directory `/fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs'
+make: *** [build-stamp] Error 2
+debuild: fatal error at line 469:
+dpkg-buildpackage failed!
+
+Any advice?
+
+Take care,
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 09:25:32 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310101325.h9ADPWI18215@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 10 Oct 2003 09:51:59 -0400)
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+I'll look at it. I just did a massive update for NAG and it built
+locally before I uploaded it. It looks like a missing stanza in 
+the Makefile. Sorry about that. -- t
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 10 Oct 2003 09:51:59 -0400)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
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+
+Camm,
+
+I fixed it, I believe. I added files to the upload and I forgot to
+cvs add these last two files. Do you happen to know if cvs can
+tell if whether there are files in the tree that have not been
+added to the cvs?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 10 16:15:03 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310102002.h9AK2su16346@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 10 Oct 2003 16:14:19 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310102002.h9AK2su16346@localhost.localdomain>
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+
+Greetings, and thanks!
+
+Yes, when you do a cvs 'diff' (I usually use 'cvs -z9 -q diff -u'),
+you see the modifications explicitly.  If you do a 'cvs update', no
+files that you've modified from the repository will be overwritten,
+but they will be listed with a 'M' flag for 'modified'.  Any files
+present not in the repository appear with a '?' flag, and any files in
+the repository which you've deleted result in a warning message.  the
+last two categories appear identically in a cvs diff too.
+
+Take care,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> I fixed it, I believe. I added files to the upload and I forgot to
+> cvs add these last two files. Do you happen to know if cvs can
+> tell if whether there are files in the tree that have not been
+> added to the cvs?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 10 19:24:55 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310102002.h9AK2su16346@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 10 Oct 2003 19:23:47 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310102002.h9AK2su16346@localhost.localdomain>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
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+
+Hi Tim!  The build works again, thanks!
+
+This is just to confirm that the missing COMBF and source file export
+issues we discussed earlier are still extant, right?
+
+Take care,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> I fixed it, I believe. I added files to the upload and I forgot to
+> cvs add these last two files. Do you happen to know if cvs can
+> tell if whether there are files in the tree that have not been
+> added to the cvs?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 19:47:19 -0400
+To: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+Message-ID: <20031010234719.GB20130@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
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+
+On Fri, Oct 10, 2003 at 07:23:47PM -0400, Camm Maguire wrote:
+> Hi Tim!  The build works again, thanks!
+> 
+> This is just to confirm that the missing COMBF and source file export
+> issues we discussed earlier are still extant, right?
+
+I've successfully applied some of the patches Juergen Weiss posted
+earlier to fix this.  (Well, I'm still compiling with the latest CVS
+files.)  Shall I repost the patches?  Some of them were in a slightly
+odd format.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
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+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 11 03:35:24 2003
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+Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 03:34:46 -0400
+From: William Sit <wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+Organization: City College of New York
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+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
+References: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+
+Dylan Thurston wrote:
+> 
+> On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:31:55AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> > If I understand the partialFraction answer (perhaps I don't) the
+> > result given is a partial fraction as far as Axiom is concerned.
+> > Partial fractions work on the factored equation and it appears
+> > that Axiom doesn't think it can factor the equation over the
+> > target domain so the partial fraction uses the "fully factored"
+> > value. The issue appears to be that the target domain chosen by
+> > the interpreter is one in which there are no factors. Or perhaps
+> > it is just a street-level bug :-)
+> 
+> But how could x^2-1 not be factorizable in any reasonable domain?
+> 
+> I can see that AXIOM might pick a domain where it doesn't know how to
+> factor, but I would be very surprised to see one coming from an
+> expression like this!
+> 
+Surely, x^2 -1 can be factored in POLY INT and Axiom behaves correctly. So the
+problem is not with factoring.
+
+Remember that algorithms in Axiom are categorical. From the documentation in
+partialFraction:
+
+"For a general euclidean domain, it is not known how to factor the denominator.
+Thus the function partialFraction takes as its second argument an element of
+Factored(R)."
+
+It also states that the requirement for R to be a euclidean domain is to
+normalize the denominator.
+
+The fact that SOME domains (or denominators) can be factored is irrelevant to
+Axiom.
+
+An example is:
+a = DMP([x,y], FRAC INT) does not have EuclideanDomain
+b = DMP([x], FRAC INT) does not have EuclideanDomain
+c = UP(x, FRAC INT) has EuclideanDomain
+
+even though mathematically, b and c are the same. But categorically, the DMP
+constructor does not have EuclideanDomain. Of course, nothing prevents us from
+saying something like:
+  DMP(varlist, ring) ...
+  if size?(varlist,1) then EuclideanDomain
+or if size?(varlist,1) then UnivariatePolynomialCategory
+
+but this is not done.
+
+Expression Integer has EuclideanDomain returns true.  Why?
+It seems to inherit this from FunctionSpace(Integer), but I searched the sources
+fspace.spad and expr.spad and neither reference EuclideanDomain directly. (This
+shows how difficult it is to construct the graph of hierarchy based on source
+files).
+
+The problem with partialFraction not working over R = POLY INT is because POLY
+INT does not belong to the category EuclideanDomain (it is multivariate).
+
+However, there is definitely something wrong with the interpreter. In the NAG
+2.3 version, I actually have:
+
+G82322 (3) -> )clear all
+   All user variables and function definitions have been cleared.
+G82322 (1) -> up:= UP(x,FRAC INT)
+
+   (1)  UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+                                                                 Type: Domain
+G82322 (2) -> a:up:=1-x^2
+
+           2
+   (2)  - x  + 1
+                               Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+G82322 (3) -> b:up:=2*x^3
+
+          3
+   (3)  2x
+                               Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+G82322 (4) -> partialFraction(b,factor(a))
+
+                 1       1
+   (4)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+G82322 (5) -> partialFraction(b,a)
+
+                 1       1
+   (5)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+G82322 (6) -> partialFraction(2*x^3::up, 1-x^2::up)
+
+              3
+            2x
+   (6)  - ------
+           2
+          x  - 1
+                                     Type: PartialFraction Expression Integer
+G82322 (7) -> partialFraction(b,a)
+
+                 1       1
+   (7)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+
+
+I did (7) just to make sure that (5) does not come because of (4) (and (7) does
+not come because of (6)).
+
+But why do (5) and (6) behave differently? Aren't these two syntactically the
+same? In each case the second parameter need to be coerced to Factored(R) but
+the two R's are different in (5) and (6).  The behavior in the NAG 2.3 version
+is also different from the one reported by Tim Daly :
+
+Tim:(8) -> partialFraction((2*x^3)::UP(x, FRAC INT), (1-x^2))
+
+                 2x
+   (8)  - 2x - ------
+                2
+               x  - 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+Tim:(9) -> partialFraction((2*x^3), (1-x^2)::UP(x, FRAC INT))
+
+                 1       1
+   (9)  - 2x - ----- - -----
+               x - 1   x + 1
+               Type: PartialFraction UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+
+I have:
+partialFraction(2*x^3::UP(x, FRAC INT), 1-x^2)
+
+
+              3
+            2x
+   (6)  - ------
+           2
+          x  - 1
+                                     Type: PartialFraction Expression Integer
+
+but I also got Tim's (9) the same.
+
+
+William
+
+
+
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+Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 03:44:40 -0400
+From: William Sit <wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+Organization: City College of New York
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+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer]Re: categorical design, aldor,
+	and the type system
+References: <200310091420.h99EKDX18821@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009174018.GB15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
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+
+Dylan Thurston wrote:
+> 
+> On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:20:13AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> > re: type system
+> >
+> > We need to examine what exists in depth and decide what the best
+> > algorithms are for type conversion. I figure we can do this by
+> > understanding the existing type lattice, codifying the adhoc
+> > algorithms current in use, and developing a "coercion theory"
+> > that shows what the algorithms should do. That way we aren't
+> > just "patching" the problem. We're developing a theory that needs
+> > to exist. To this end I've started collecting the raw data of
+> > the existing type signatures so we can do the first step.
+> 
+> Hmm?  Surely the algorithm used for doing automatic type coercions is
+> independent of the existing heirarchy?
+
+The hyperdoc system can list all the domains, categories and packages that
+contain signatures of a particular exported function. Is there any coordination
+between hyperdoc and the interpreter? It seems that the hyperdoc maintains some
+database of domains, etc and is this different from the one used by the
+interpreter? 
+
+William
+-- 
+William Sit
+Department of Mathematics..............Email: wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
+City College of New York..........................Tel: 212-650-5179
+Convent Ave at West 138th Street..................Fax: 212-862-0004
+New York, NY 10031.....Asian Symposium on Computer Mathematics 2003
+USA..........................http://www.mmrc.iss.ac.cn/~ascm/ascm03
+
+
+
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+Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 11:32:37 -0400
+To: William Sit <wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
+Message-ID: <20031011153237.GA22250@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+
+On Sat, Oct 11, 2003 at 03:34:46AM -0400, William Sit wrote:
+> Dylan Thurston wrote:
+> > 
+> > On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:31:55AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> > > If I understand the partialFraction answer (perhaps I don't) the
+> > > result given is a partial fraction as far as Axiom is concerned.
+> > > Partial fractions work on the factored equation and it appears
+> > > that Axiom doesn't think it can factor the equation over the
+> > > target domain so the partial fraction uses the "fully factored"
+> > > value. The issue appears to be that the target domain chosen by
+> > > the interpreter is one in which there are no factors. Or perhaps
+> > > it is just a street-level bug :-)
+> > 
+> > But how could x^2-1 not be factorizable in any reasonable domain?
+> > 
+> > I can see that AXIOM might pick a domain where it doesn't know how to
+> > factor, but I would be very surprised to see one coming from an
+> > expression like this!
+> > 
+> Surely, x^2 -1 can be factored in POLY INT and Axiom behaves correctly. S=
+o the
+> problem is not with factoring.
+> 
+> Remember that algorithms in Axiom are categorical. From the documentation=
+ in
+> partialFraction:
+> 
+> "For a general euclidean domain, it is not known how to factor the denomi=
+nator.
+> Thus the function partialFraction takes as its second argument an element=
+ of
+> Factored(R)."
+> 
+> It also states that the requirement for R to be a euclidean domain is to
+> normalize the denominator.
+
+Sure, that's why the second argument is supposed to be factored _before_
+partialFraction is called.  It's not being factored; this is not a bug
+in partialFraction, but a bug someplace else.
+
+Specifically, from the output with ')lisp (setq |$monitorNewWorld| t)',
+the problem probably lies in whatever is going on in this stanza:
+----------
+---->Factored UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)----> searching op ta=
+ble for:
+   coerce : UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer) -> % from  Factored Un=
+ivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)
+<----#<compiled-function |FR;coerce;R$;43|>(Factored,UnivariatePolynomial(x=
+,Fraction Integer))
+----------
+This looks like it should be calling the standard 'coerce' from
+UP(x, FRAC INT) to FR UP(x, FRAC INT), which should do the factorization
+(according to all the documentation I read), but doesn't!  (Or maybe the
+coercion function from the 'Factored' domain doesn't actually do the
+factorization itself?)
+
+Compare this to what happens when we try to do this coercion explicitly:
+----------
+(4) -> aa:UP(x, FRAC INT) :=3D x^2-1
+
+   (4)  x  - 1
+                               Type: UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+
+(5) -> aa::FR UP(x, FRAC INT)
+---->RationalFactorize UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)----> search=
+ing op table for:
+   factor : UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer) -> Factored Univariate=
+Polynomial(x,Fraction Integer) from  RationalFactorize UnivariatePolynomial=
+(x,Fraction Integer)
+<----#<compiled-function |RATFACT;factor;RPF;1|>(RationalFactorize,Univaria=
+tePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer))
+
+---->Factored UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Integer)----> searching op ta=
+ble for:
+   coerce : % -> OutputForm from  Factored UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction =
+Integer)
+<----#<compiled-function |FR;coerce;$Of;35|>(Factored,UnivariatePolynomial(=
+x,Fraction Integer))
+   (5)  (x - 1)(x + 1)
+                      Type: Factored UnivariatePolynomial(x,Fraction Intege=
+r)
+----------
+Somehow, a different routine ('RationalFactorize') is being called.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--VbJkn9YxBvnuCH5J
+Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
+Content-Description: Digital signature
+Content-Disposition: inline
+
+-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
+Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
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+z44LM3LRxz9d/TCaM8Qf7VI=
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+
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+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <547k3czngc.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 10 Oct 2003 19:23:47 -0400)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] CVS build broken? -- errortrap
+References: <54smm1urnk.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310102002.h9AK2su16346@localhost.localdomain>
+	<547k3czngc.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
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+
+Camm,
+
+I'm working on the COMBF issue now.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 13 14:07:31 2003
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+Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2003 14:06:54 -0400
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Mime-Version: 1.0
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Small TeX output patch
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+--n8g4imXOkfNTN/H1
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+While going through the TeXmacs tutorial, I've noticed several display
+bugs.  I already reported one to the BTS (#5906), but here's another
+small fix, which fixes the display of infinity.
+
+Test case input:
+)set output tex on
+plusInfinity()
+
+Desired output:
+$$
+\infty
+\legno(1)
+$$
+
+
+---------- snip here ------------
+Index: tex.spad.pamphlet
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/tex.spad.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.2
+diff -u -r1.2 tex.spad.pamphlet
+--- tex.spad.pamphlet   9 Oct 2003 10:45:03 -0000       1.2
++++ tex.spad.pamphlet   13 Oct 2003 17:44:55 -0000
+@@ -140,11 +140,11 @@
+     specialStrings : L S :=3D
+       ["cos", "cot", "csc", "log", "sec", "sin", "tan",
+         "cosh", "coth", "csch", "sech", "sinh", "tanh",
+-          "acos","asin","atan","erf","...","$"]
++          "acos","asin","atan","erf","...","$", "infinity"]
+     specialStringsInTeX : L S :=3D
+       ["\cos","\cot","\csc","\log","\sec","\sin","\tan",
+         "\cosh","\coth","\csch","\sech","\sinh","\tanh",
+-          "\arccos","\arcsin","\arctan","\erf","\ldots","\$"]
++          "\arccos","\arcsin","\arctan","\erf","\ldots","\$","\infty"]
+ 
+     -- local function signatures
+ 
+---------- snip here ------------
+
+However, I'm a little concerned about this (and the general approach):
+after all, if you type "infinity" at the prompt, it gets interpreted as
+a variable named "infinity", not as an element of OrderedCompletion.
+The same goes for "sin", of course:
+
+--------------
+   (4)  sin
+$$
+\sin 
+\leqno(4)
+$$
+
+                                                           Type: Variable s=
+in
+--------------
+
+The output really should be similar to what I would get if I typed
+"sine" (which is currently buggy, but that's another issue), but because
+the code patched above looks only at the text of the string to be output
+(which is the only thing available to it), and not the type that was
+producing the output, there are sure to be display glitches.
+
+For the moment, I think the patch above should be applied, but a
+long-term project would be to rethink how TeX output is produced to
+deal with situations like this in a more principled way.
+
+Also, another project would be to remove the "latex" command, which
+seems to be an abortive attempt at another method of producing LaTeX
+output.  It's not used much, and should be incorporated into one of the
+other mechanisms, and even things as simple as "latex (x+y)" produce
+"Unimplemented".
+
+(I'm not sure what the etiquette is.  Should I just go ahead and file
+the bugs myself, and will anybody notice if I do?  Is there a way for me
+to subscribe to the BTS?  I count three bugs here:
+1) Patch for output of "infinity";
+2) Revamp output mechanisms so that "sin" as a variable is treated
+   differently from "sin" the trigonometric function; and
+3) Remove the "latex" function from Category SetCategory.)
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+--n8g4imXOkfNTN/H1
+Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
+Content-Description: Digital signature
+Content-Disposition: inline
+
+-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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+
+iD8DBQE/ium+Veybfhaa3tcRAisKAJ9oPPOKYke7AhE4gwJ99UpA28t2KACeP96M
+5lZgCUsd46S84vs4FHQcgOA=
+=OBsr
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+
+--n8g4imXOkfNTN/H1--
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+In-reply-to: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	(dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Small TeX output patch
+References: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+> For the moment, I think the patch above should be applied, but a
+> long-term project would be to rethink how TeX output is produced to
+> deal with situations like this in a more principled way.
+
+I'll apply the patch you sent.
+
+> Also, another project would be to remove the "latex" command, which
+> seems to be an abortive attempt at another method of producing LaTeX
+> output.  It's not used much, and should be incorporated into one of the
+> other mechanisms, and even things as simple as "latex (x+y)" produce
+> "Unimplemented".
+
+Perhaps we should write up how tex and latex work so we understand
+the machinery better first. I have looked at it, Bill has looked at
+it, and you have looked at it. Some boot code knows about tex as
+well as some of the algebra code. Even some of the lisp code gets
+involved (the ELT bug in strings). I agree we need to rethink this
+but rather than add another version perhaps we should do deep 
+surgery and redesgn it.
+
+> (I'm not sure what the etiquette is.  Should I just go ahead and file
+> the bugs myself, and will anybody notice if I do?  Is there a way for me
+> to subscribe to the BTS?  I count three bugs here:
+
+David Mentre is the "bug czar". We can do it any way he wants.
+David?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 13 14:42:16 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net, Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Small TeX output patch
+References: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310131817.h9DIHGQ26714@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2003 20:41:29 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310131817.h9DIHGQ26714@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Mon, 13 Oct 2003 14:17:16 -0400")
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+>> (I'm not sure what the etiquette is.  Should I just go ahead and file
+>> the bugs myself, and will anybody notice if I do?  Is there a way for me
+>> to subscribe to the BTS?  I count three bugs here:
+>
+> David Mentre is the "bug czar". We can do it any way he wants.
+> David?
+
+:)
+
+Dylan, yes, you should fill the bug yourself. Both Tim and I receive an
+email when a new bug is filled, so yes your bug is noticed[1]. If you
+have a savannah account, I _think_ you can add yourself to the CC: of
+the bug (so being informed of new information on your bug).
+
+Even if you don't think this is a real bug but a needed redesign or a
+missing functionnality, you can add it as a "feature request", with a
+low bug Severity (I usually use 1 to 3). 
+
+If you fill a bug or a feature request, please give example of the given
+command and both the failing and expected output. It helps a lot to
+understand the bug. Your example with "fi"'s ligature in your latest bug
+report is a good example of that.
+
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+[1] And once me or another Axiom hacker will start doing Q&A, the BTS
+    will be the definitive reference point.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 13 19:33:38 2003
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+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Small TeX output patch
+Message-ID: <20031013231646.GB1340@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310131817.h9DIHGQ26714@localhost.localdomain>
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: 
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+
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+
+On Mon, Oct 13, 2003 at 08:41:29PM +0200, David MENTRE wrote:
+> root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+> 
+> >> (I'm not sure what the etiquette is.  Should I just go ahead and file
+> >> the bugs myself, and will anybody notice if I do?  Is there a way for =
+me
+> >> to subscribe to the BTS?  I count three bugs here:
+> >
+> > David Mentre is the "bug czar". We can do it any way he wants.
+> > David?
+> 
+> Dylan, yes, you should fill the bug yourself.
+
+OK, I filed the second two, longer-term bugs; it seems as though the
+"infinity" problem is already done.
+
+> ... Both Tim and I receive an email when a new bug is filled, so yes
+> your bug is noticed[1]. If you have a savannah account, I _think_ you
+> can add yourself to the CC: of the bug (so being informed of new
+> information on your bug).
+
+I didn't see how to do this.  But also, I would like to get
+notifications of new bugs (and maybe also CVS updates) myself; is this
+possible?
+
+> Even if you don't think this is a real bug but a needed redesign or a
+> missing functionnality, you can add it as a "feature request", with a
+> low bug Severity (I usually use 1 to 3). 
+
+I don't think I have the permissions to set the bug Severity, or I would
+have done so...
+
+> If you fill a bug or a feature request, please give example of the given
+> command and both the failing and expected output. It helps a lot to
+> understand the bug. Your example with "fi"'s ligature in your latest bug
+> report is a good example of that.
+
+I saw a place to put test code showing the problem, but no place for
+failing and expected output.  Where should I put that?  In the
+description of the bug itself?
+
+Also, is it possible to submit bugs by e-mail, the way I can with
+Debian?
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--kORqDWCi7qDJ0mEj
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+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 12:40:36 2003
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+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Subject: About Savannah bug reports (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] Small TeX
+	output patch)
+References: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310131817.h9DIHGQ26714@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87y8vpaskm.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<20031013231646.GB1340@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 18:39:56 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <20031013231646.GB1340@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu> (Dylan
+	Thurston's message of "Mon, 13 Oct 2003 19:16:46 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87u16bpycj.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+Hello Dylan,
+
+dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston) writes:
+
+> I didn't see how to do this.  But also, I would like to get
+> notifications of new bugs (and maybe also CVS updates) myself; is this
+> possible?
+
+Yes. It is _possible_ (but not quickly done). We just need to create a
+new mailing list (axiom-dev-announce for example), and subscribe to it
+the BTS. For CVS updates, it is possible to install the CVSreport
+program, available on Savannah. I already have done it for another
+Savannah project. 
+
+Should I do this for Axiom?
+
+> I don't think I have the permissions to set the bug Severity, or I would
+> have done so...
+
+Oh yes. Maybe. I usually log onto savannah with project administrator
+rights, so I might see some fields that other users don't. I have check:
+I cannot make it available for non project member.
+
+In other word, if you create a Savannah account and I add you as a
+project member, you'll have access to those fields.
+
+But otherwise, I set the severity when looking at bugs. You can also add
+a comment in the bug report itself.
+
+> I saw a place to put test code showing the problem, but no place for
+> failing and expected output.  Where should I put that?  In the
+> description of the bug itself?
+
+Yes, in the "Original Submission:" part.
+
+I would place the failing output into "Error message:" part.
+
+All those rules are just guides and should be adapted to any specific
+case.
+
+
+> Also, is it possible to submit bugs by e-mail, the way I can with
+> Debian?
+
+I don't think so. You should submit a bug report on the savannah project
+on Savannah. ;)
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 12:48:43 2003
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+References: <20031013180654.GA31291@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310131817.h9DIHGQ26714@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87y8vpaskm.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<20031013231646.GB1340@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<87u16bpycj.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 18:48:06 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <87u16bpycj.fsf_-_@wanadoo.fr> (David MENTRE's message of "Tue,
+	14 Oct 2003 18:39:56 +0200")
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: About Savannah bug reports
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> In other word, if you create a Savannah account and I add you as a
+> project member, you'll have access to those fields.
+
+ok, I've just seen that you have solve this issue. ;)
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 19:22:33 +0200
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] On literate programming (or the use of noweb)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 17:23:13 -0000
+
+Hello,
+
+I have recently used literate programming and more specifically
+noweb. I'd like to share my experience, from a software engineering
+point of view. If you find this boring, just skip this email.
+
+I have used noweb on:
+
+ - a network processing program in C
+
+ - a client/server in Objective Caml (with some XDR (C-like syntax))
+
+ - a formal model in Promela (for Spin verifier)
+
+
+I use deliberately a very restricted form of chunk inclusion. Basically:
+
+ Explanation on f1...                        (1)
+<<my_file.lisp>>=
+(defun f1 ...)
+@
+
+ Explanation on f2...
+<<my_file.lisp>>=
+(defun f2 ...)
+@
+
+ Explanation on the complicated algo using f1 and f2...
+<<my_file.lisp>>=
+(f1 () (f2 ...))
+@
+
+It is just concatenation of various code chunks in a file. 
+
+In fact, I find the other use of noweb chunks:
+
+<<my chunk>>=                                (2)
+(defun f...)
+@
+
+<<my_file.lisp>>=
+(map ... <<my chunk>> ...)
+@
+
+...*very* dangerous. It is just a simple text expansion as would do a C
+#define. You lose, for example, all the good properties of Lisp macro
+definition with macro parameters renaming.
+
+
+I also try to stick as much as possible to the programming language that
+I am using. For example, OCaml uses text scope for parameters
+definition, so I avoid using noweb chunks to define functions in
+different order. Each file in the original language as its counterpart
+as noweb file. 
+
+One issue I have done on the literate C program was that all the modules
+of the C program were in the same noweb source file. After some times,
+it was a total mess.
+
+Of course, each rule has its exceptions. For example, Promela hasn't any
+capabilities to define functions, so I have used noweb chunks to define
+some kind of macro.
+
+
+To conclude, I would advise the following rules for the use of noweb
+into the Axiom project:
+
+ 1. avoid as much as possible the definition of code chunk which are
+    _included_ in other chunks. Prefer concatenation of code chunks. In
+    short, prefer form (1) over (2);
+
+ 2. restrict yourself to the capabilities of your language. For example,
+    define and use Lisp macros and not noweb chunks as lisp macros.
+
+
+What is your opinion?
+
+
+I hope it brings something to the general issue of software design and
+coding.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 15:00:16 2003
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 14:20:28 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310141820.h9EIKSG09173@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] chunking
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+In fact chunks (except in makefiles) chunks are only used to 
+"lift" pieces of text from the main <<*>> chunk for explanation.
+I'm unaware of any place where I use chunks within chunks.
+
+The primary use of chunking is to reorder the program source into
+a document-style of explanation. If I'm working on the system and
+get a deeper understanding of a function, heavily modify a function,
+or generally have something special to say I will lift the function
+into a chunk, make it a section or subsection, and include documentation.
+
+Within the top level makefile (only, as far as I know) the
+chunk-within-chunk pattern is used to customize the Makefile.${SYS}
+chunks. Since this involves repeated code that has to be included
+in many different outputs it is useful to define the chunk in one
+place and use it in multiple places. 
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 18:17:13 2003
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+
+--7AUc2qLy4jB3hD7Z
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+
+I have investigated Bug #4733 (rounding of negative numbers).  The
+problem is unexpected behaviour of 'shift' with negative arguments:
+'shift(-7,-1)' is -4, while the code in the 'truncate' function in
+float.spad.pamphlet clearly expects the answer to be -3 in this case.
+The definition of what 'shift' should do in IntegerNumberSystem is
+ambiguous about what should happen with negative arguments, but in
+integer.spad.pamphlet 'shift' is actually implemented with a call to the
+lisp function 'ash'; according to the standard I found on the web (see
+http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_ash.htm#ash), 'ash'
+should have the opposite behaviour: '(ash -7 -1)' should be -4 (as GCL
+implements).
+
+Presumably the correct fix involves changing 'shift' so that it rounds
+towards 0 when both arguments are negative (and documenting how it
+actually behaves), rather than changing the code in float.spad to deal
+with the current behaviour?  What will other axiom code expect?  Most of
+the instances in the algebra tree seem to apply 'shift' only when the
+first argument is positive.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--7AUc2qLy4jB3hD7Z
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+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 19:32:32 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 19:06:07 -0400
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+
+Dylan,
+
+[ Some of your emails arrive as text file attachments to
+otherwise empty emails (such as this one) and other times
+as ordinary email? Are you sending an unusual format to
+the axioim mailing list? (e.g. HTML or "rich text" format). ]
+
+I agree with your analysis. Note that a similar but
+different defintion of shift is given in si.spad.pamphlet
+(SingleInteger)
+
+  shift(x,n) == QSLEFTSHIFT(x,n)$Lisp
+
+In Axiom both
+
+  -> )lisp (ASH -7 -1)
+
+and
+
+  -> )lisp (QSLEFTSHIFT -7 -1)
+
+return -4. Oddly, I could not find any definition for
+QSLEFTSHIFT. ASH is an "arithmetic" shift. I looked for
+a Lisp function for "logical" shift (as found in some
+machine architectures) but did not find any. In Axiom
+I can write
+
+  -> ASH(-7,-1)$Lisp
+
+but
+
+  -> QSLEFTSHIFT(-7,-1)$Lisp
+
+says: "QSLEFTSHIFT is not a lisp function ..." ???
+
+Maybe some of the Lisp programmers here can give us a
+clue as to why?
+
+Failing finding a native Lisp function that does the
+job, how about defining it as
+
+  shift(x,y) == integer(ASH(x-1,y)$Lisp)+1
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu
+> [mailto:dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 5:41 PM
+> To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+ 
+> I have investigated Bug #4733 (rounding of negative numbers).
+> The problem is unexpected behaviour of 'shift' with negative
+> arguments: 'shift(-7,-1)' is -4, while the code in the
+> 'truncate' function in float.spad.pamphlet clearly expects the
+> answer to be -3 in this case. The definition of what 'shift'
+> should do in IntegerNumberSystem is ambiguous about what should
+> happen with negative arguments, but in integer.spad.pamphlet
+> 'shift' is actually implemented with a call to the lisp function
+> 'ash'; according to the standard I found on the web (see
+
+http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_ash.htm#ash
+
+> ), 'ash' should have the opposite behaviour: '(ash -7 -1)'
+> should be -4 (as GCL implements).
+>
+> Presumably the correct fix involves changing 'shift' so that
+> it rounds towards 0 when both arguments are negative (and
+> documenting how it actually behaves), rather than changing
+> the code in float.spad to deal with the current behaviour?
+> What will other axiom code expect?  Most of the instances in
+> the algebra tree seem to apply 'shift' only when the first
+> argument is positive.
+>
+> Peace,
+>	Dylan
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 21:02:33 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>, "Page, Bill"
+	<Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 20:00:42 -0400
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+
+Dylan,
+
+You wrote:
+
+>...
+> An alternative is
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) == -integer(ASH(-x,y)$LISP)
+> 
+> which might be clearer.
+> 
+
+I think
+
+  shift(x,y) == sign(x)*integer(ASH(sign(x)*x,y)$Lisp
+
+should be ok for all cases?
+
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 21:34:16 2003
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+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Differential equations?
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+
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+
+Has anyone successfully run any differential equation examples?  See
+bug #5975, but there's no useful information there.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
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+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of
+	negative numbers)
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D43@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+
+I'm buried on three other paths so I can't research this at the moment.
+Things to know:
+
+1 QSLEFTSHIFT is a lisp macro (vmlisp.lisp) so it won't show up in 
+  open code and is only used during compile time. The QS* functions
+  are heavily type-specified so that the lisp compiler can generate
+  optimal code.
+  
+2 The shift function in SingleInteger has the SPADreplace property
+  (see SINT.NRLIB/code.lsp). That means that algebra code that uses
+  shift will be replaced by a call to QSLEFTSHIFT at compile time.
+  The line you are looking for reads:
+
+  (PUT (QUOTE |SINT;shift;3$;44|) (QUOTE |SPADreplace|) (QUOTE QSLEFTSHIFT))
+
+  In the interpreter you'll find the symbol |SINT;shift;3$;44|
+  has the property |SPADreplace| on the property list 
+  with the value QSLEFTSHIFT
+  which the compiler uses to open-code the shift function.
+
+3 Bootstrap issues make the change harder. You have to be sure that
+  algebra code has not compiled the previous macro definition of
+  QSLEFTSHIFT inline (and there is no indication if it has that 
+  you will be able to see without reading the generated code).
+
+4 shift is HIGHLY optimized. if you change it you need to use lisp
+  disassemble to examine the code generated by the compiler. The
+  SINT domain is on the critical path for nearly everything.
+
+The moral is to change it carefully, optimize the hell out of it,
+and test it heavily.
+
+Tim
+
+  
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 22:19:14 2003
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+	(dpt@petunia.bostoncoop.net)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of
+	negative numbers)
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D43@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+
+Dylan,
+
+Unfortunately I can't even look further at the issue now. I'm buried.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 22:44:30 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 19:40:52 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of
+	negative numbers)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan,
+
+On Tuesday, October 14, 2003 7:19 PM you wrote:
+
+> ... 
+> > Failing finding a native Lisp function that does the
+> > job, how about defining it as
+> > 
+> >   shift(x,y) == integer(ASH(x-1,y)$Lisp)+1
+> 
+> In the case when x and y are both negative, I think this gives the
+> "round towards zero" semantics that seem to be expected.  An
+> alternative is
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) == -integer(ASH(-x,y)$LISP)
+> 
+> which might be clearer.
+> 
+
+Ok, I will buy that.
+
+Unfortunately INT, SINT, and NNI are all bootstrapped so
+replacing the code and testing is a little more involved.
+Do you want to try it, or shall I?
+
+BTW, I noticed that in the algebra/Makefile.pamphlet Tim
+uses
+
+ SETCAT -> SINT -> UFD -> GCDDOM -> COMRING -> RING ->
+   RNG -> ABELGRP -> CABMON -> ABELMON -> ABELSG -> SETCAT
+
+as an example of cycle in Axiom's type system. It occurs
+to me that perhaps changes such as you suggested (removing
+the Latex stuff from SETCAT) might help to eliminate *some*
+of this sort of thing.
+
+I am still not sure whether cycles of this kind are a
+good thing or a bad thing ...
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+ 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 22:47:46 2003
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 21:30:40 -0400
+To: "Bill. Page1 (E-mail)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Message-ID: <20031015013040.GC10818@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D46@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
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+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 09:09:50PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> Does
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) =3D=3D -integer(ASH(-x,y)$Lisp
+> 
+> involve two (potential long) integer multiplications?
+> I.e. -1*integer(ASH(-1*x,y)$Lisp
+
+I don't know whether adding/subtracting 1 or negation will be faster,
+but either one should be faster than any multiplication (unless
+multiplication by -1 is special cased somewhere).  There are no carries
+to worry about.
+
+I suspect the additions are probably faster, actually.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--S1BNGpv0yoYahz37
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 22:56:47 2003
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:48:28 -0400
+From: Dylan Thurston <dpt@lotus.bostoncoop.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Message-ID: <20031015024828.GD11183@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D42@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 07:06:07PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> [ Some of your emails arrive as text file attachments to
+> otherwise empty emails (such as this one) and other times
+> as ordinary email? Are you sending an unusual format to
+> the axioim mailing list? (e.g. HTML or "rich text" format). ]
+
+It's because I habitually sign my e-mails, and that's how the mailing
+list software deals with it.  I'll stop if it's too annoying.
+
+> ... Oddly, I could not find any definition for
+> QSLEFTSHIFT.
+
+It's defined as a macro equivalent to ash for fixnum's in
+src/interp/vmlisp.lisp.pamphlet.
+
+> Failing finding a native Lisp function that does the
+> job, how about defining it as
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) == integer(ASH(x-1,y)$Lisp)+1
+
+In the case when x and y are both negative, I think this gives the
+"round towards zero" semantics that seem to be expected.  An
+alternative is
+
+  shift(x,y) == -integer(ASH(-x,y)$LISP)
+
+which might be clearer.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:07:35 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:48:12 -0400
+From: Dylan Thurston <dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Message-ID: <20031015024812.GC11183@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D44@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 08:00:42PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> I think
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) == sign(x)*integer(ASH(sign(x)*x,y)$Lisp
+> 
+> should be ok for all cases?
+
+Yes, but I think we should avoid multiplications here.  Remember that
+the integers may be long...
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:17:57 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>, root <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:23:20 -0400
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+
+Dylan, Tim;
+
+Now Tim has scared me too! <grin>
+
+I am in favour of just changing the use of shift
+in float.spad.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: dpt@petunia.bostoncoop.net [mailto:dpt@petunia.bostoncoop.net]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 10:15 PM
+> To: root
+> Cc: bill.page1@sympatico.ca; axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: 
+> Left shifts of
+> negative numbers)
+> 
+> 
+> On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 10:02:49PM -0400, root wrote:
+> > 4 shift is HIGHLY optimized. if you change it you need to use lisp
+> >   disassemble to examine the code generated by the compiler. The
+> >   SINT domain is on the critical path for nearly everything.
+> 
+> OK.  It seems like maintaining the behaviour float.spad seems to be
+> expecting is going to be slower than the current situation.  How
+> loudly will anyone object if we leave 'shift' so that it does what
+> Common Lisp calls an 'arithmetic shift' (i.e., shift(-7,-1) = -4), and
+> change the code in float.spad?
+> 
+> Peace,
+> 	Dylan
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:25:15 2003
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:49:52 -0400
+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+Message-ID: <20031015024952.GE11183@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D47@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 10:23:20PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> Dylan, Tim;
+> 
+> Now Tim has scared me too! <grin>
+> 
+> I am in favour of just changing the use of shift
+> in float.spad.
+
+OK, I'll do that when I get a chance, as well as taking a look at the
+code in contfrac.spad.pamphlet, which was the only other use of 'shift'
+I saw that might be affected by this issue.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:27:31 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 21:09:50 -0400
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+
+Does
+
+  shift(x,y) == -integer(ASH(-x,y)$Lisp
+
+involve two (potential long) integer multiplications?
+I.e. -1*integer(ASH(-1*x,y)$Lisp
+
+
+> 
+> Yes, but I think we should avoid multiplications here.
+> Remember that the integers may be long...
+> 
+
+
+
+
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:48:00 -0400
+From: Dylan Thurston <dpt@lotus.bostoncoop.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Message-ID: <20031015024800.GB11183@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of
+	negative numbers)
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+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 07:40:52PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> Unfortunately INT, SINT, and NNI are all bootstrapped so
+> replacing the code and testing is a little more involved.
+> Do you want to try it, or shall I?
+
+That scares me a bit.  Can you do it, and record the steps involved?
+
+But I don't think NNI (NonNegativeInteger) should need any changes,
+since there's no difference when the arguments are positive...
+
+Maybe it's worth writing some code to check that the generated .lisp
+files are the same as the cached ones?  Or is that already written?
+
+> BTW, I noticed that in the algebra/Makefile.pamphlet Tim
+> uses
+> 
+>  SETCAT -> SINT -> UFD -> GCDDOM -> COMRING -> RING ->
+>    RNG -> ABELGRP -> CABMON -> ABELMON -> ABELSG -> SETCAT
+> 
+> as an example of cycle in Axiom's type system. It occurs
+> to me that perhaps changes such as you suggested (removing
+> the Latex stuff from SETCAT) might help to eliminate *some*
+> of this sort of thing.
+
+Well, this one would go away if the 'hash' function were removed from
+SETCAT.  It's the obvious weak link in that chain; the others are all
+very reasonable.  (Except that integers mod a power of 2
+are not actually a UFD...)
+
+I thought at first that the 'hash' function was better than 'latex',
+but now I see that that's not true: if the type doesn't support proper
+equality testing, it's not safe to use hash, and if it does, then
+there's always a fall-back (although slower) algorithm, and by having
+a separate 'Hashable' class and checking 'if T has Hashable then ...'
+you could arrange for all algorithms to run as fast in practice.
+
+> I am still not sure whether cycles of this kind are a
+> good thing or a bad thing ...
+
+There may be cases when cycles are necessary, but I don't think this
+is one.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:32:31 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 22:29:55 -0400
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+
+Tim,
+
+Thanks for taking the time to explain all this.
+
+I was especially mystified by the code in float.spad that
+defines:
+
+  shift(x:%,n:I) == [x.mantissa,x.exponent+n]
+
+but you wrote:
+
+> ...
+> Things to know:
+> 
+> ...   
+> 2 The shift function in SingleInteger has the SPADreplace property
+>   (see SINT.NRLIB/code.lsp). That means that algebra code that uses
+>   shift will be replaced by a call to QSLEFTSHIFT at compile time.
+>   The line you are looking for reads:
+> 
+>   (PUT (QUOTE |SINT;shift;3$;44|) (QUOTE |SPADreplace|) 
+> (QUOTE QSLEFTSHIFT))
+> 
+>   In the interpreter you'll find the symbol |SINT;shift;3$;44|
+>   has the property |SPADreplace| on the property list 
+>   with the value QSLEFTSHIFT
+>   which the compiler uses to open-code the shift function.
+> 
+
+Wow! I think that explains a lot...
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:54:46 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:47:32 -0400
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+
+On Tuesday, October 14, 2003 10:30 PM I wrote:
+> 
+> I was especially mystified by the code in float.spad that
+> defines:
+> 
+>   shift(x:%,n:I) == [x.mantissa,x.exponent+n]
+> 
+
+On second (or is it third?) thought, this is not really
+mysterious. The above definition of shift is for the
+case where the first argument is a Float. This definition
+is correct and not directly affected by the problem with
+shift for negative integer arguments.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 14 23:57:59 2003
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+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 21:01:44 -0400
+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Left shifts of negative numbers
+Message-ID: <20031015010144.GA10818@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D44@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+--EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 08:00:42PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> I think
+> 
+>   shift(x,y) =3D=3D sign(x)*integer(ASH(sign(x)*x,y)$Lisp
+> 
+> should be ok for all cases?
+
+Yes, but I think we should avoid multiplications here.  Remember that
+the integers may be long...
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm
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+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+References: <2BE8D331ED40D611812300080219E7FE339D47@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
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+
+didn't mean to scare anyone. it is just that there are several 
+things that are not apparent. i'd recommend trying to build a
+system with your changes, look at the generated lisp code,
+look at the compiled code, look at where the code you are 
+changing is used in the rest of the library, etc. 
+and ask questions. i can't tell you everything but i can give
+you guys some idea of the issues if you ask particular questions.
+
+t
+
+
+
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'dpt@math.harvard.edu'" <dpt@math.harvard.edu>
+Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:57:31 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: algebra cycles again
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan,
+
+On Tuesday, October 14, 2003 10:48 PM you wrote:
+
+[about modifying spad files that involve a bootstrap]
+
+> ... 
+> Maybe it's worth writing some code to check that the
+> generated .lisp files are the same as the cached ones?
+> Or is that already written?
+
+No, as far as I know this hasn't been written. But I
+agree that it would be a good idea. However it is
+apparently not trivial since the symbols in the generated
+lisp code do not seem to be the same as those in the
+at least the current bootstrap lisp code. Perhaps the
+current bootstrap lisp code was not generated by GCL?
+
+If re-generating the bootstrap code from the newly
+compiled bootstrapped modules will stablize the names,
+then a comparison (the next time around) would be
+fairly trivial. Otherwise a more intellegence "equivalence"
+test might be required.
+
+In any case, if we really do need to depend on iteratively
+compiling the algebra code containing cycles to a "fixed
+point" solution, then such a comparison will ultimately
+have to be written.
+
+> 
+> > BTW, I noticed that in the algebra/Makefile.pamphlet Tim
+> > uses
+> > 
+> >  SETCAT -> SINT -> UFD -> GCDDOM -> COMRING -> RING ->
+> >    RNG -> ABELGRP -> CABMON -> ABELMON -> ABELSG -> SETCAT
+> > 
+> > as an example of cycle in Axiom's type system. It occurs
+> > to me that perhaps changes such as you suggested (removing
+> > the Latex stuff from SETCAT) might help to eliminate *some*
+> > of this sort of thing.
+> 
+> Well, this one would go away if the 'hash' function were
+> removed from SETCAT.  It's the obvious weak link in that
+> chain; the others are all very reasonable.  (Except that
+> integers mod a power of 2 are not actually a UFD...)
+> 
+> I thought at first that the 'hash' function was better than
+> 'latex', but now I see that that's not true: if the type
+> doesn't support proper equality testing, it's not safe to
+> use hash, and if it does, then there's always a fall-back
+> (although slower) algorithm, and by having a separate
+> 'Hashable' class and checking 'if T has Hashable then ...'
+> you could arrange for all algorithms to run as fast in
+> practice.
+
+I tentatively agree with you about this. I think it would
+be worth a test to see what impact removing the hash function
+from SETCAT might have on the rest of the type system.
+
+> 
+> > I am still not sure whether cycles of this kind are a
+> > good thing or a bad thing ...
+> 
+> There may be cases when cycles are necessary, but I don't
+> think this is one.
+> 
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 15 00:44:09 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: Left shifts of n
+	egative numbers)
+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 00:23:42 -0400
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+
+Axiom Developers,
+
+In case you didn't get the automatic notice...
+I've posted a patch to float.spad.pamphlet at
+
+https://savannah.nongnu.org/patch/index.php?group_id=2938
+&func=detailpatch&patch_id 74
+
+to correct Bug #4733 (rounding of negative numbers).
+After applying the patch, just re-compile Axiom using
+the command
+
+  make
+
+in the axiom root directory.
+
+So far I have done only preliminary testing.
+
+Dylan, I let you continue to analyze contfrac.
+Thanks.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu
+> [mailto:dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 10:50 PM
+> To: Page, Bill
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] algebra cycles again (was: 
+> Left shifts of
+> n egative numbers)
+> 
+> 
+> On Tue, Oct 14, 2003 at 10:23:20PM -0400, Page, Bill wrote:
+> > Dylan, Tim;
+> > 
+> > Now Tim has scared me too! <grin>
+> > 
+> > I am in favour of just changing the use of shift
+> > in float.spad.
+> 
+> OK, I'll do that when I get a chance, as well as taking a look
+> at the code in contfrac.spad.pamphlet, which was the only other
+> use of 'shift' I saw that might be affected by this issue.
+> 
+> Peace,
+> 	Dylan
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310141820.h9EIKSG09173@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 18:43:29 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310141820.h9EIKSG09173@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Tue, 14 Oct 2003 14:20:28 -0400")
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: chunking
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello Tim,
+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> The primary use of chunking is to reorder the program source into
+> a document-style of explanation. 
+
+That's what I wanted to avoid: moving code chunks to fits the
+documentation. In my modest experience, it is better to follow usual
+coding practice for the given language. I may be wrong. Time will tell.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:34:06 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310151634.h9FGY6g08984@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <20031011153237.GA22250@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	(dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
+References: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<3F87B296.A543BA8E@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+	<20031011153237.GA22250@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
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+
+
+David Mentre writes:
+> Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+> 
+> > The primary use of chunking is to reorder the program source into
+> > a document-style of explanation. 
+> 
+> That's what I wanted to avoid: moving code chunks to fits the
+> documentation. In my modest experience, it is better to follow usual
+> coding practice for the given language. I may be wrong. Time will tell.
+
+Knuth invented the machinery for literate programming because he felt
+that the explanation of code should be arranged for the human needs
+not for machine requirements. If you look at the TeX literate sources
+you'll find he completely rearranges all of TeX to fit the need to
+explain design choices.
+
+I expect the Axiom code to be embedded in research papers (see
+dhmatrix.spad.pamphlet) and textbook sources. The code should appear
+"at the natural location" for the explanation.
+
+So the whole point of chunking is the ability to move code.
+
+If you don't move the code then all you have are "inline comments"
+rather than literate programs. Inline comments are insufficient
+to handle mixing research results, which are the primary items of
+interest, with reduction to practice (that is, the code) which is
+secondary and subject to change.
+
+So far we have almost no research results embedded in the algebra
+code so code chunking is only used to implement bootstrapping.
+I expect this to change in the future. I have permission to use
+several research papers and when I get the world stable I plan
+to start with the research papers to re-chunk and rewrite the
+algebra. We want the algebra directory to combine the mathematics
+with the code. Otherwise no-one will be able to maintain and
+extend the system. There is hardly a word of text about the
+theory behind the integration code, not a comment about extending
+the field of constants, not a hint of practical concerns of
+intermediate expression swell, no discussion of missing cases.
+The code is "just there". 
+
+Beyond the math research there are computational mathematics issues
+that need to be explained. For instance, how are domains created
+by the compiler? What optimizations take place, where are they
+done, and why? (See my note about SINT yesterday. I'm one of the
+few people who know what these optimizations are, where they are,
+why they are important, )
+
+Think of Axiom as a huge mathematical library of textbooks
+rather than a huge pile of code.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 15 13:30:51 2003
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+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 13:30:07 -0400
+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: chunking
+Message-ID: <20031015173007.GC14004@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310141820.h9EIKSG09173@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87ismq8n9q.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+
+--p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+On Wed, Oct 15, 2003 at 06:43:29PM +0200, David MENTRE wrote:
+> Hello Tim,
+> 
+> Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+> 
+> > The primary use of chunking is to reorder the program source into
+> > a document-style of explanation. 
+> 
+> That's what I wanted to avoid: moving code chunks to fits the
+> documentation. In my modest experience, it is better to follow usual
+> coding practice for the given language. I may be wrong. Time will tell.
+
+I have some limited experience with Haskell literate programs.  Haskell
+does not provide any mechanism to move chunks in literate programs, but
+in practice it is not at all an issue: since definitions are almost
+invariably short and can appear in any order, there are few constraints
+on natural writing style.  Axiom may well be the same way, with the
+possible exception of the interface/implementation split.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg
+Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
+Content-Description: Digital signature
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+
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+
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+Z+s+QPyg0tXCnK53BNaarRw=
+=5dRE
+-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
+
+--p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg--
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 15 14:37:53 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: coerce, cast, partial fractions
+References: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<3F87B296.A543BA8E@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+	<20031011153237.GA22250@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310151634.h9FGY6g08984@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 20:36:34 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310151634.h9FGY6g08984@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:34:06 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87ekxe8i19.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Knuth invented the machinery for literate programming because he felt
+> that the explanation of code should be arranged for the human needs
+> not for machine requirements. If you look at the TeX literate sources
+> you'll find he completely rearranges all of TeX to fit the need to
+> explain design choices.
+
+But sometimes machine requirements help understand human needs. It was
+at least my feeling for literate OCaml code.
+
+How many people have read the TeX book and understood it? Don't forget
+that Knuth has designed his tools at a time were languages were quite
+restricted. Nowadays, we have more elaborated tools, at the language
+level. 
+
+I have tried to read Knuth book on graph algorithms (which is also using
+literate programming). I found his code hard to follow. Just my own
+experience.
+
+> I expect the Axiom code to be embedded in research papers (see
+> dhmatrix.spad.pamphlet) and textbook sources. The code should appear
+> "at the natural location" for the explanation.
+
+I'll take a more deep look at dhmatrix.spad.pamphlet.
+
+> So the whole point of chunking is the ability to move code.
+>
+> If you don't move the code then all you have are "inline comments"
+> rather than literate programs. Inline comments are insufficient
+> to handle mixing research results, which are the primary items of
+> interest, with reduction to practice (that is, the code) which is
+> secondary and subject to change.
+
+Ok, you are probably right. But my own feeling is that inline comment is
+sufficient for most of the code. This does not preclude the use of more
+well chosen code chunk for very difficult points or introductory
+overview.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+PS: Tim, what have you done at the CVS tree? It seems that the whole
+    Axiom source tree need to be recompiled.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 14:29:23 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310151829.h9FITND17830@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <87ekxe8i19.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Wed, 15
+	Oct 2003 20:36:34 +0200)
+References: <200310091431.h99EVtJ18877@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<20031009173916.GA15373@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<3F87B296.A543BA8E@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+	<20031011153237.GA22250@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+	<200310151634.h9FGY6g08984@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<87ekxe8i19.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] literate programs
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+I claim that Axiom is different from most programs. Most programs
+can be supported by inline comments. Java code (sorry Bill) is
+a good example. The Javadoc mechanism is sufficient to document
+the various class files in a disciplined way. I can generally
+figure out how to use a class given the Javadoc.
+
+Axiom is different. Axiom programming requires that you understand
+both math and computer science. You need to understand the math theory
+to make, modify, and maintain the math. Javadoc (and inline comments)
+will not be sufficient. 
+
+I also claim (as long as I'm making wild, unsubstantiated claims)
+that all computational mathematics software will eventually require
+literate programming to keep the expertise with the code.
+
+We've all been trained to think of the code as important.
+However, in the long term the mathematical and comp-sci research
+results are important. The reduction to practice (the code) needs
+to evolve and any instance is less important.
+
+re: changing all of the files
+At NAG's request I restored all of the original copyright and license
+text. It took about a week and touched almost every file. Sorry about 
+that.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 15 16:59:20 2003
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+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 16:50:33 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310152050.h9FKoXc29583@localhost.localdomain>
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+In-reply-to: <87vfqq8ny7.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Wed, 15
+	Oct 2003 18:28:48 +0200)
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310151132560.24282-100000@sunanh>
+	<87vfqq8ny7.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+RE: startup problem
+
+You AXIOM variable is set wrong. You must have had a NAG version installed
+at some point. Check your .bashrc file (or other shell startup file).
+It is probably reset in there.
+
+
+RE: binary version
+
+We do have a binary version available but it only seems to work on Redhat 9. 
+Visit axiom.tenkan.org for the executable binary.
+
+Does anyone know what would be needed to create a statically linked lisp?
+
+
+RE: configure, make, make install
+
+configure has nothing to do. You have to set the AXIOM variable.
+We could include a configure shell script that prints "set the AXIOM variable".
+
+make exists and is used. 
+
+I'll look into an "install" stanza in the root Makefile. Consider it a bug
+until this gets fixed.
+
+The whole "configure, make, make install" has an underlying assumption
+that you are working in C. We're working mostly in Lisp. In theory I should
+be using lisp defsystem rather than makefiles. 
+
+RE: failed compile.
+
+The GCL 2.5.2 build failed. saved_gcl is the name of the gcl 2.5.2 lisp
+executable. Make says "Commande introuvable" (which I can't translate).
+Redhat 9 ships with GCC 3.2.2 whereas your GCC version is downlevel.
+Even my Redhat 7.3 system shipped with GCC 2.96. 
+
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 15 17:47:45 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310151132560.24282-100000@sunanh>
+	<87vfqq8ny7.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310152050.h9FKoXc29583@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 23:47:07 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310152050.h9FKoXc29583@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Wed, 15 Oct 2003 16:50:33 -0400")
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Does anyone know what would be needed to create a statically linked
+> lisp?
+
+Not tested: do 'CFLAGS=--static ./configure' at configure step when
+            building GCL. 
+
+Another approach: 'CC="gcc --static" ./configure', still at configure
+            level for GCL.
+
+I think second approach has more chance to work correctly.
+
+> Make says "Commande introuvable" (which I can't translate).
+             ^^"Command not found"
+
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu, david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] infinity in tex mode
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan,
+
+I applied your change, rebuilt the system, tested it, and uploaded
+the changed file to CVS.
+
+David,
+
+The tex infinity bug should be closed.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 06:16:43 2003
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
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+
+
+> RE: binary version
+>
+> We do have a binary version available but it only seems to work on Redhat 9.
+> Visit axiom.tenkan.org for the executable binary.
+>
+> Does anyone know what would be needed to create a statically linked lisp?
+
+For RedHat distributions, you should also create an RPM.
+I understand that all this is quite a burdern, but I really think that
+this should be your highest priority now that Axiom compiles for you.
+
+> The whole "configure, make, make install" has an underlying assumption
+> that you are working in C. We're working mostly in Lisp. In theory I should
+> be using lisp defsystem rather than makefiles.
+
+Yet, ./configure, make, make install is the (GNU) standard for other
+languages too. GNU Emacs is written in lisp too...
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 06:44:26 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: vdhoeven@texmacs.org, camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161213140.28041-100000@sunanh> (message from
+	Joris van der Hoeven on Thu, 16 Oct 2003 12:15:51 +0200 (CEST))
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161213140.28041-100000@sunanh>
+Cc: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	daly@idsi.net, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+Re: rpms 
+
+An rpm is coming. Documentation is my highest priority (Bill Page
+did an Axiom tutorial using TeXmacs. Your feedback is welcome).
+My schedule is more shortest-job-first so minor changes happen
+in a reasonable amount of time. I'm unskilled in making rpms
+so I have to try making a few first anyway.
+
+Re: configure
+
+I'll understand your point and will consider it further.
+
+Re: sorry
+
+Don't worry. If you have problems and you are an experienced 
+"build-from-sources" user then we have more work to do.
+I appreciate your feedback.
+
+Re: removing mnt/linux
+
+I suppose the "make install" should make the AXIOM variable disappear.
+The "axiom" command is supposed to be a shell script and will be again
+in the future. I need to change this soon so it'll be on the shortest
+job list.
+
+Re: "last really stable version of gcc"
+
+Yeah, I understand. I'm in a struggle to compile Magnus which is a 
+huge C++ program that died of code-rot because some damn fool 
+decided to change the C++ language "standard". But my attitude is
+that you have to keep up with the changes so I really have no choice
+but to buy a new C++ book, get educated, and rewrite the code. Pain,
+pain, endless pain. 
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 06:45:04 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: static lisp and rpms
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+Camm, 
+
+do you have any advice on building a static lisp?
+I'm going to try David's suggestion (CC="gcc -static").
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 06:50:55 2003
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 12:50:07 +0200 (CEST)
+From: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
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+
+
+> An rpm is coming.
+
+Great.
+
+> Documentation is my highest priority (Bill Page
+> did an Axiom tutorial using TeXmacs. Your feedback is welcome).
+
+Will do.
+
+> My schedule is more shortest-job-first so minor changes happen
+> in a reasonable amount of time. I'm unskilled in making rpms
+> so I have to try making a few first anyway.
+
+Count between one day and two days of work.
+
+> Re: configure
+>
+> I'll understand your point and will consider it further.
+
+Thanks.
+
+> Re: removing mnt/linux
+>
+> I suppose the "make install" should make the AXIOM variable disappear.
+
+Yes, but it is good to have a directory structure which is as clean
+as possible too. I see no point in having these useless unary directories
+mnt and linux around in a binary tarball.
+
+> Re: "last really stable version of gcc"
+>
+> Yeah, I understand. I'm in a struggle to compile Magnus which is a
+> huge C++ program that died of code-rot because some damn fool
+> decided to change the C++ language "standard". But my attitude is
+> that you have to keep up with the changes so I really have no choice
+> but to buy a new C++ book, get educated, and rewrite the code. Pain,
+> pain, endless pain.
+
+The point is that the whole gcc-3.* series has been *severely bugged*.
+In my case, all code is conform to the previous and current C++,
+but the new C++ optimizer just sucks. Things seem to improve a bit
+in the very last versions though.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 07:05:08 2003
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+What happened with the tm_axiom script since our last discussion?
+Do we have something which is compatible with both Axioms now?
+As soon as this is the case, I will include it in TeXmacs.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 07:14:09 2003
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+	Joris van der Hoeven on Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:00:04 +0200 (CEST))
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161258560.28041-100000@sunanh>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+I believe the decision was that we should make it part of the axiom
+distribution rather than texmacs. There is a legacy issue because
+of the previous Axiom (which has been off the market for 2 years)
+is still being considered. I have to get a copy of the latest version.
+
+I suppose the current answer is that tm_axiom will become part of
+the distribution and magically installed as part of "make install".
+Heck, we could even use "configure" to find texmacs. :-)
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 07:21:31 2003
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+> I suppose the current answer is that tm_axiom will become part of
+> the distribution and magically installed as part of "make install".
+
+That is OK with me, but what do we do with the old version of Axiom?
+Just let it burn in hell?
+
+> Heck, we could even use "configure" to find texmacs. :-)
+
+You may want to use `texmacs --path` or `texmacs --binpath`.
+
+
+
+
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
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+
+re: NAG Axiom
+
+I've offered to pick up support for the prior Axiom, including if
+necessary, providing gratis contract work thru NAG. The response
+is that would require access to sources that were not released and
+they cannot do that. I don't understand why a contract employee
+can't see source code but that's the decision.
+
+I can still support the current NAG Axiom users for algebra.
+They can recompile changes to the algebra files and install them.
+Currently all of the algebra sources are in old Axiom format
+under mnt/linux/src/algebra.
+
+re: texmacs and tm_axiom
+
+Suppose I had tm_axiom in the current directory.
+Suppose I had texmacs installed in /usr/local/texmacs.
+Can you give me a idea of "install" instructions for tm_axiom into texmacs?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 07:58:06 2003
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] synthesis
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+
+*,
+
+There are several requests under consideration.
+
+David and Joris have been calling for a "configure" command.
+Dylan and Bill have been trying to set up tm_axiom with texmacs.
+Camm and Juergen have asked to use the already installed lisp.
+Joris would like a static version of the system.
+Dylan would like the make variables to be available everywhere.
+I've been wondering about platform-specific complexity.
+
+I may have the names wrong but the point is that I'm now convinced
+that I have to change direction.
+
+./configure can be used to attack all of these problems.
+So I'll write up an initial script, post it, and we can play with it.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 08:52:34 2003
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:51:36 +0200 (CEST)
+From: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texamcs.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
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+
+
+> re: NAG Axiom
+>
+> I've offered to pick up support for the prior Axiom, including if
+> necessary, providing gratis contract work thru NAG. The response
+> is that would require access to sources that were not released and
+> they cannot do that. I don't understand why a contract employee
+> can't see source code but that's the decision.
+>
+> I can still support the current NAG Axiom users for algebra.
+> They can recompile changes to the algebra files and install them.
+> Currently all of the algebra sources are in old Axiom format
+> under mnt/linux/src/algebra.
+
+OK, so without any cooperation from NAG, we should probably
+drop the old tm_axiom, except if Andrey Grozin finds a way to
+keep it working.
+
+> re: texmacs and tm_axiom
+>
+> Suppose I had tm_axiom in the current directory.
+> Suppose I had texmacs installed in /usr/local/texmacs.
+> Can you give me a idea of "install" instructions for tm_axiom into texmacs?
+
+First of all, you should really distribute the entire axiom plugin if
+you want to distribute the tm_axiom file. In the current distribution,
+this means all what you have in $TEXMACS_PATH/plugins/axiom,
+where $TEXMACS_PATH=/usr/local/texmacs for you. In general,
+plugins are either installed in $TEXMACS_PATH/plugins (when the user
+has root privileges) or in $HOME/.TeXmacs/plugins (for ordinary users).
+So you should first try the first and then the second.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 09:16:56 2003
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 14:14:54 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+Message-ID: <20031016141454.E21927@nag.co.uk>
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+	from vdhoeven@texmacs.org on Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 02:51:36PM +0200
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texamcs.org, root <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+On Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 02:51:36PM +0200, Joris van der Hoeven wrote:
+<snip>
+> OK, so without any cooperation from NAG, we should probably
+> drop the old tm_axiom, except if Andrey Grozin finds a way to
+> keep it working.
+As I've said several time already the NAG version of Axiom behaves
+exactly the same way as the new version as far as I can see.  The only
+difference is if you invoke it via the `sman' program rather than
+directly, in which case you see two prompts, one for each frame started.  
+This would apply equally to both versions, unless sman is changed.
+
+So I don't think its a question of supporting the NAG and Open versions,
+its a case of whether you want to be able to use the TeXmacs interface
+and sman at the same time.  I believe that our "AXIOMsys" script
+provides the same functionality as your "axiom" program.
+
+I find it frustrating to be accused of not cooperating - we have made
+every scrap of source code available that we could.  Some of the
+remainder we can still use ourselves but not distribute in source form.
+However there is other material that we can no longer use ourselves
+either, so while the idea of carrying on some kind of voluntary support
+network for existing sites is nice it is completely impractical.
+
+Mike.
+
+
+________________________________________________________________________
+This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The
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+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 09:35:38 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161213140.28041-100000@sunanh>
+	<200310161042.h9GAgTD30292@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 16 Oct 2003 09:34:21 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310161042.h9GAgTD30292@localhost.localdomain>
+Message-ID: <54r81dwbky.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 49
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca,
+	vdhoeven@texmacs.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:35:36 -0000
+
+Greetings!
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Joris,
+> 
+> Re: rpms 
+> 
+> An rpm is coming. Documentation is my highest priority (Bill Page
+> did an Axiom tutorial using TeXmacs. Your feedback is welcome).
+> My schedule is more shortest-job-first so minor changes happen
+> in a reasonable amount of time. I'm unskilled in making rpms
+> so I have to try making a few first anyway.
+> 
+
+BTW, to the extent the Debian packaging is accepted, an rpm can be
+made from it with the program 'alien'.
+
+> Re: "last really stable version of gcc"
+> 
+> Yeah, I understand. I'm in a struggle to compile Magnus which is a 
+> huge C++ program that died of code-rot because some damn fool 
+> decided to change the C++ language "standard". But my attitude is
+> that you have to keep up with the changes so I really have no choice
+> but to buy a new C++ book, get educated, and rewrite the code. Pain,
+> pain, endless pain. 
+> 
+
+Of course, we might get one of the energetic maxima lisp hackers to
+write a c++2cl a la f2cl which they used to compile parts of slatec
+into lisp maxima -- anyone for a lisp Magnus project? :-).  I fully
+realize this suggestion is just short of ridiculous -- for humor value
+only!
+
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 09:36:39 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310161043.h9GAhN630296@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 16 Oct 2003 09:28:00 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310161043.h9GAhN630296@localhost.localdomain>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: static lisp and rpms
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:36:37 -0000
+
+Greetings!
+
+Latest 2.6.1 and CVS HEAD has a --enable-static configure option.
+There may be some issues when using readline in this mode, but I
+haven't yet had a chance to plumb the bottom of that.
+
+Take care,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Camm, 
+> 
+> do you have any advice on building a static lisp?
+> I'm going to try David's suggestion (CC="gcc -static").
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+From: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+X-X-Sender: <texmacs@sunanh>
+To: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+In-Reply-To: <20031016141454.E21927@nag.co.uk>
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, grozin@texmacs.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca,
+	axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, root <daly@idsi.net>,
+	Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
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+
+
+> > OK, so without any cooperation from NAG, we should probably
+> > drop the old tm_axiom, except if Andrey Grozin finds a way to
+> > keep it working.
+> As I've said several time already the NAG version of Axiom behaves
+> exactly the same way as the new version as far as I can see.  The only
+> difference is if you invoke it via the `sman' program rather than
+> directly, in which case you see two prompts, one for each frame started.
+> This would apply equally to both versions, unless sman is changed.
+>
+> So I don't think its a question of supporting the NAG and Open versions,
+> its a case of whether you want to be able to use the TeXmacs interface
+> and sman at the same time.  I believe that our "AXIOMsys" script
+> provides the same functionality as your "axiom" program.
+>
+> I find it frustrating to be accused of not cooperating - we have made
+> every scrap of source code available that we could.  Some of the
+> remainder we can still use ourselves but not distribute in source form.
+> However there is other material that we can no longer use ourselves
+> either, so while the idea of carrying on some kind of voluntary support
+> network for existing sites is nice it is completely impractical.
+
+I am sorry for having accused NAG; I just find it frustrating to
+have two tm_axioms for two versions of axiom and nobody able to
+produce a tm_axiom which works for both (for whatever reasons).
+In the current situation, I honestly do not know what
+I am supposed to do.
+
+So I wait for a patch from anyone who is interested in keeping
+the old interface alive. Probably one should modify line 266 of
+the tm_axiom.c we currently distribute, together with the patches
+by David & Bill. If I do not have any patch which works with both
+versions within one month from now, then I will exclusively support
+the free version of axiom, since this seems to be the only version
+which is under active development.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 10:26:40 2003
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 09:42:15 -0400
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: vdhoeven@texmacs.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] tm_axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+I'd rather you continue the support of NAG's version.
+If someone installs the free version then the spiffy
+new "configure" script can replace the tm_axiom file.
+
+Joris and Bill,
+
+Since I haven't been involved in the texmacs/axiom work 
+I need some help setting up the correct configure script.
+Where can I find "the entire axiom plugin"? 
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 10:29:14 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Mike Dewar'" <miked@nag.co.uk>, Joris van der Hoeven
+	<vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:21:05 -0400
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, axiom@tenkan.org,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texamcs.org, root <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+Mike,
+
+I expect that no one really intended to imply that NAG
+was "not co-operating". As you say, this is very far from
+the truth. I think it was a wonderful and bold decision
+to make Axiom open source. And I am sure it will be to
+everyone's advantage that you, personally, and NAG also
+continues to work together with everyone in the open
+source Axiom project. Thank you again.
+
+About tm_axiom. What we need to do is just standardize
+the *name* of the Axiom interpret sans sman etc. I
+propose that starting with the next update to the alpha
+version of open source Axiom, we use AXIOMsys as you
+suggested, in order to be compatible with the NAG version
+of Axiom. (Case insensitive platforms like Windows will
+treat this as AXIOMSYS. That should be ok).
+
+Then we will change the new version of tm_axiom so that
+it start AXIOMsys. And it should work for both.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Mike Dewar [mailto:miked@nag.co.uk]
+> Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2003 9:15 AM
+> To: Joris van der Hoeven
+> Cc: root; camm@enhanced.com; bill.page1@sympatico.ca; 
+> axiom@tenkan.org;
+> axiom-developer@nongnu.org; grozin@texamcs.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+> 
+> 
+> On Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 02:51:36PM +0200, Joris van der Hoeven
+> wrote:
+> <snip>
+> > OK, so without any cooperation from NAG, we should probably
+> > drop the old tm_axiom, except if Andrey Grozin finds a way to
+> > keep it working.
+> As I've said several time already the NAG version of Axiom
+> behaves exactly the same way as the new version as far as I can
+> see.  The only difference is if you invoke it via the `sman'
+> program rather than directly, in which case you see two prompts,
+> one for each frame started. This would apply equally to both
+> versions, unless sman is changed.
+> 
+> So I don't think its a question of supporting the NAG and 
+> Open versions, its a case of whether you want to be able to use
+> the TeXmacs interface and sman at the same time.  I believe
+> that our "AXIOMsys" script provides the same functionality
+ as your "axiom" program.
+> 
+> I find it frustrating to be accused of not cooperating - we have
+> made every scrap of source code available that we could.  Some
+> of the remainder we can still use ourselves but not distribute
+> in source form. However there is other material that we can no
+> longer use ourselves either, so while the idea of carrying on
+> some kind of voluntary support network for existing sites is
+> nice it is completely impractical.
+> 
+> Mike.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 10:32:03 2003
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+From: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
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+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texmacs.org,
+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+> I'd rather you continue the support of NAG's version.
+> If someone installs the free version then the spiffy
+> new "configure" script can replace the tm_axiom file.
+
+That could be a solution, although I find it a bit dirty,
+since it requires overiding the existing plugin.
+Another solution might be to give both plugins a different name.
+We could rename the old axiom as "NAG Axiom".
+
+> Since I haven't been involved in the texmacs/axiom work
+> I need some help setting up the correct configure script.
+> Where can I find "the entire axiom plugin"?
+
+In $TEXMACS_PATH/plugins/axiom
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 10:49:03 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:48:47 -0400
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+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: tm_axiom
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Thursday, October 16, 2003 9:42 AM you wrote:
+> ... 
+> Since I haven't been involved in the texmacs/axiom work 
+> I need some help setting up the correct configure script.
+> Where can I find "the entire axiom plugin"? 
+> 
+
+I should probably wait for Joris to answer in detail, but
+here is what I know...
+
+In TeXmacs version 1.0.2, after installation the axiom
+plug-in seems to be in two parts.
+
+  /usr/share/TeXmacs/plugins/axiom
+    - constains two sub-directories, packages and progs
+      - packages contains a sub-directory session which
+        in turn, constains the axiom stylesheet axiom.ts
+      - progs contains some scheme initialization scripts
+    - no need to change either of these (yet) for the new
+      version of tm_axiom, maybe in a future version
+
+  /usr/libexec/TeXmacs/bin
+    - constains the executable filter files including
+      tm_axiom
+    - right now all I do is replace the tm_axiom program
+      found here with the new one compiled from the tm_axiom.c
+      source on Savannah.
+
+On Thursday, October 16, 2003 10:30 AM Joris wrote:
+
+> ...
+> > Where can I find "the entire axiom plugin"?
+> 
+> In $TEXMACS_PATH/plugins/axiom
+
+On my RedHat 8.0 linux system the version of TeXmacs installed
+from the 1.0.2 RPM does not have any associated environment
+variable called TEXMACS_PATH. Are you referring to the source
+distribution, Joris?
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 10:54:54 2003
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:12:32 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310161412.h9GECWd08765@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+In-reply-to: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161622400.28833-100000@sunanh> (message from
+	Joris van der Hoeven on Thu, 16 Oct 2003 16:30:17 +0200 (CEST))
+References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0310161622400.28833-100000@sunanh>
+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texmacs.org,
+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+I agree that renaming the old version to "NAG Axiom" is probably
+cleaner (unless we figure out a way to unify them).
+
+I have a bunch of future "requirements" for texmacs (like fully
+supporting the literate programming style) which I need to discuss
+with you. I have a paragraph or two from another private discussion
+which I'll send to you. It hints at where I'd like to see Axiom's
+front end systems go. They're on my home machine so I'll send them
+later tonight.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:59:01 +0100
+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+Message-ID: <20031016155901.H21927@nag.co.uk>
+References: <20031016141454.E21927@nag.co.uk>
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+	from vdhoeven@texmacs.org on Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 04:10:11PM +0200
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, grozin@texmacs.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca,
+	axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, root <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+Joris,
+
+I think that you're missing the point.  Its not a case of having two
+tm_axioms for two versions of axiom, its a case of having two tm_axioms
+for two different ways of invoking *the same* axiom.  It just happens
+that the open version of axiom is still incomplete and doesn't yet
+exhibit both forms of behaviour.
+
+I don't quite understand what the problem is in any case.  You can
+always turn prompts off completely (")set message prompt none") if you
+like (in axiom.input or mysyns.input depending on whether its a
+system-wide change or not).
+
+If you really need exactly one prompt, then you can add the following to
+the axiom.input/mysyns.input file, which will suppress the initial
+prompt when Axiom is started by sman (i.e. when the $SpadServer variable
+is set).
+
+)lisp (DEFUN MKPROMPT NIL (COND ((and |$SpadServer| (|BOOT-EQUAL| |$interpreterFrameName| '|initial|)) (MAKESTRING "")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|none|) (MAKESTRING "")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|plain|) (MAKESTRING "-> ")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|step|) (STRCONC (MAKESTRING "(") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING ") -> "))) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|frame|) (STRCONC (STRINGIMAGE |$interpreterFrameName|) (MAKESTRING " (") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING ") -> "))) ('T (STRCONC (STRINGIMAGE |$interpreterFrameName|) (MAKESTRING " [") (SUBSTRING (CURRENTTIME) 8 NIL) (MAKESTRING "] [") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING "] -> ")))) )
+
+Its a bit ugly since it all has to be on one line but should work ...  
+
+Mike.
+
+
+On Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 04:10:11PM +0200, Joris van der Hoeven wrote:
+> 
+> > > OK, so without any cooperation from NAG, we should probably
+> > > drop the old tm_axiom, except if Andrey Grozin finds a way to
+> > > keep it working.
+> > As I've said several time already the NAG version of Axiom behaves
+> > exactly the same way as the new version as far as I can see.  The only
+> > difference is if you invoke it via the `sman' program rather than
+> > directly, in which case you see two prompts, one for each frame started.
+> > This would apply equally to both versions, unless sman is changed.
+> >
+> > So I don't think its a question of supporting the NAG and Open versions,
+> > its a case of whether you want to be able to use the TeXmacs interface
+> > and sman at the same time.  I believe that our "AXIOMsys" script
+> > provides the same functionality as your "axiom" program.
+> >
+> > I find it frustrating to be accused of not cooperating - we have made
+> > every scrap of source code available that we could.  Some of the
+> > remainder we can still use ourselves but not distribute in source form.
+> > However there is other material that we can no longer use ourselves
+> > either, so while the idea of carrying on some kind of voluntary support
+> > network for existing sites is nice it is completely impractical.
+> 
+> I am sorry for having accused NAG; I just find it frustrating to
+> have two tm_axioms for two versions of axiom and nobody able to
+> produce a tm_axiom which works for both (for whatever reasons).
+> In the current situation, I honestly do not know what
+> I am supposed to do.
+> 
+> So I wait for a patch from anyone who is interested in keeping
+> the old interface alive. Probably one should modify line 266 of
+> the tm_axiom.c we currently distribute, together with the patches
+> by David & Bill. If I do not have any patch which works with both
+> versions within one month from now, then I will exclusively support
+> the free version of axiom, since this seems to be the only version
+> which is under active development.
+> 
+> 
+> ________________________________________________________________________
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+
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+	'Tim Daly' <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: tm_axiom
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+
+
+> > > Where can I find "the entire axiom plugin"?
+> >
+> > In $TEXMACS_PATH/plugins/axiom
+>
+> On my RedHat 8.0 linux system the version of TeXmacs installed
+> from the 1.0.2 RPM does not have any associated environment
+> variable called TEXMACS_PATH. Are you referring to the source
+> distribution, Joris?
+
+I refer to the static binary tarball. If you use an rpm,
+then the binaries get split from the data, as you explained very well.
+
+
+
+
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+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, grozin@texmacs.org, A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
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+
+
+> Yes, it is old-fashioned. There have been discussions about changing it
+> and I believe several people on the list have investigated it. Dylan
+> has looked at it deeply enough to understand where to patch simple
+> things. There is also work by Bill to look at the line-breaking algorithm
+> as well as discussion about embedding line-breaking into Axiom's tex code.
+
+I have looked a bit at Bill's intro too. It seems that the LaTeX
+generation has lots of problems. For instance, it even attempts to
+line break formulas at the interior of big parenthesis...
+The TeXamcs-specific \* for multiplication is also missing.
+You should try to make the LaTeX generation as easy as possible and
+let TeXmacs do the formatting and line-breaking.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 11:18:39 2003
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+To: "Andrey G. Grozin" <A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su>
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+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, grozin@texmacs.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca,
+	Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+> My idea about supporting both free and old NAG Axiom in TeXmacs is very
+> simple (though not very clean, probably). Let's change the (new)
+> tm_axiom.c slightly, in such a way that it can accept a command-line
+> argument. If there is no argument (argc==1), let it expect one prompt at
+> the beginning, thus nicely interacting with the free version. If there is
+> an argument (argc>1), let it expect two prompts. Then those who want to
+> use the old NAG axiom can change the command-line to, e.g.,
+> tm_axiom nag in the plugin.
+
+That is OK with me too.
+
+> It would be good (and not only here) to allow user to supply command-line
+> arguments when starting a session.
+
+You may now configure variant sessions, as I explained you.
+This should be sufficient for a while.
+
+Is there a way to detect automatically with which version of axiom
+we are dealing? Can we use both at the same time?
+
+
+
+
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+	Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:26:44 -0400
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:26:44 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310161426.h9GEQi809645@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su
+In-reply-to: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310162143020.29374-100000@star.inp.nsk.su>
+	(A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310162143020.29374-100000@star.inp.nsk.su>
+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texmacs.org,
+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+> My idea about supporting both free and old NAG Axiom in TeXmacs is very 
+> simple (though not very clean, probably). Let's change the (new) 
+...[snip]...
+
+I like the suggestion.
+
+> One additional thought about the new tm_axiom. Currently, TeX-generation 
+> in Axiom produces horribly old-fashioned TeX, not modern LaTeX. It 
+> produces such monsters as
+> {\root 3 \of x}
+> TeXmacs does not understand this (rightfully, I think). The new tm_axiom 
+> tries to work around such issues. It would be much better to improve TeX 
+> generation in the free Axiom. Or to leave TeX generation as it stands, 
+> copy it into LaTeX generation, and improve it.                        
+
+Yes, it is old-fashioned. There have been discussions about changing it
+and I believe several people on the list have investigated it. Dylan
+has looked at it deeply enough to understand where to patch simple
+things. There is also work by Bill to look at the line-breaking algorithm
+as well as discussion about embedding line-breaking into Axiom's tex code.
+
+>                                                This should be not too 
+> difficult.
+
+An old irish fellow once said: There is no such thing as a simple job.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:08:26 +0200 (CEST)
+From: Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
+X-X-Sender: <texmacs@sunanh>
+To: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: tm_axiom
+In-Reply-To: <20031016155901.H21927@nag.co.uk>
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+	axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, root <daly@idsi.net>,
+	Joris van der Hoeven <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>
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+
+
+Andrey: could you please try to patch your tm_axiom.c program
+in order to make it compatible with everybody? I think that this
+should be most easy for you, using what Mike, David and Bill have
+been saying... Notice that you can find a binary tarball at
+
+	http://savannah.nongnu.org/files/?group=axiom
+
+for the free version of Axiom. Just download
+
+	axiom-debian-3.0-linux-i386-cvs-2003-09-28.tar.gz
+
+and set the AXIOM and PATH environement variables as needed.
+
+If supporting both versions of axiom in a single plugin turns out
+to be too difficult, I can also rename axiom -> nag-axiom for
+NAG's version of Axiom.
+
+> I think that you're missing the point.  Its not a case of having two
+> tm_axioms for two versions of axiom, its a case of having two tm_axioms
+> for two different ways of invoking *the same* axiom.  It just happens
+> that the open version of axiom is still incomplete and doesn't yet
+> exhibit both forms of behaviour.
+>
+> I don't quite understand what the problem is in any case.  You can
+> always turn prompts off completely (")set message prompt none") if you
+> like (in axiom.input or mysyns.input depending on whether its a
+> system-wide change or not).
+>
+> If you really need exactly one prompt, then you can add the following to
+> the axiom.input/mysyns.input file, which will suppress the initial
+> prompt when Axiom is started by sman (i.e. when the $SpadServer variable
+> is set).
+>
+> )lisp (DEFUN MKPROMPT NIL (COND ((and |$SpadServer| (|BOOT-EQUAL| |$interpreterFrameName| '|initial|)) (MAKESTRING "")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|none|) (MAKESTRING "")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|plain|) (MAKESTRING "-> ")) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|step|) (STRCONC (MAKESTRING "(") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING ") -> "))) ((|BOOT-EQUAL| |$inputPromptType| '|frame|) (STRCONC (STRINGIMAGE |$interpreterFrameName|) (MAKESTRING " (") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING ") -> "))) ('T (STRCONC (STRINGIMAGE |$interpreterFrameName|) (MAKESTRING " [") (SUBSTRING (CURRENTTIME) 8 NIL) (MAKESTRING "] [") (STRINGIMAGE |$IOindex|) (MAKESTRING "] -> ")))) )
+>
+> Its a bit ugly since it all has to be on one line but should work ...
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 11:30:05 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Joris van der Hoeven'" <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>, Tim Daly
+	<daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:29:38 -0400
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+	A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: tm_axiom
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+
+Joris,
+
+On Thursday, October 16, 2003 11:13 AM you wrote:
+> 
+> > Yes, it is old-fashioned. There have been discussions about
+> > changing it and I believe several people on the list have
+> > investigated it. Dylan has looked at it deeply enough to
+> > understand where to patch simple things. There is also work
+> > by Bill to look at the line-breaking algorithm as well as
+> > discussion about embedding line-breaking into Axiom's tex
+> > code.
+> 
+> I have looked a bit at Bill's intro too. It seems that the
+> LaTeX generation has lots of problems. For instance, it even
+> attempts to line break formulas at the interior of big
+> parenthesis...
+
+You are talking about the LaTeX generation of the line-break
+routines that I inserted into the new version of tm_axiom,
+right? If so, you are right that this line-break code has
+only been properly tested on a subset of TeX/LaTeX output
+produced by Axiom, enven though the "C" code is actually
+quite old. As I understand from Tim and from the comments
+in the code, it was written some years ago by Robert Sutor
+(a primary Axiom developer) specifically to produce the
+LaTeX output that became part of the Axiom Book.
+
+> The TeXamcs-specific \* for multiplication is also missing.
+> You should try to make the LaTeX generation as easy as
+> possible and let TeXmacs do the formatting and line-breaking.
+> 
+
+I do not understand how to let TeXmacs do the line-breaking.
+Without the line-break code that I inserted into tm_axiom,
+TeXmacs seems to do exactly the same thing as LaTeX with the
+long math lines - they just run off the page on the left.
+Can you tell me how to get TeXmacs to break some long LaTeX
+code that is passed through the plugin interface? Or where
+should I read about this?
+
+In general I agree that we should improve the TeX/LaTeX
+generated by Axiom, but when I first tried this by submitting
+a patch to get right of the \root{n} \of {x} horror, Tim
+pointed out to me there are some "legacy" programs that
+might be broken by such changes.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 11:34:31 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Joris van der Hoeven'" <vdhoeven@texmacs.org>, "Andrey G. Grozin"
+	<A.G.Grozin@inp.nsk.su>
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:34:08 -0400
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+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, grozin@texmacs.org,
+	Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: tm_axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Joris, and Andrey,
+
+> > If there is an argument (argc>1), let it expect two
+> > prompts. Then those who want to use the old NAG axiom
+> > can change the command-line to, e.g., tm_axiom nag in
+> > the plugin.
+> 
+> That is OK with me too.
+
+This is a good idea but no very "user configuration friendly".
+
+> 
+> > It would be good (and not only here) to allow user to 
+> > supply command-line arguments when starting a session.
+>
+
+Yes.
+ 
+> You may now configure variant sessions, as I explained you.
+> This should be sufficient for a while.
+>
+
+???
+ 
+> Is there a way to detect automatically with which version
+> of axiom we are dealing? Can we use both at the same time?
+>
+
+Please understand what Mike Dewar is trying to tell you:
+
+  It is not necessary to detect which version.
+
+All that is necessary is to just start
+
+   AXIOMsys
+
+instead of the whole group of three (or more?) processes
+that are usually started in the NAG commercial version.
+tm_axiom only interfaces with one of these - the Axiom
+interpret itself.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 16 17:02:22 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	id 46AB11CAD9A; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:02:20 +0200 (CEST)
+From: Antoine Hersen <antoine.hersen@aiesec.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Content-Type: text/plain
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
+Organization: AIESEC Esiea
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+Mime-Version: 1.0
+X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 
+Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:02:20 +0200
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] GCL configuration
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:02:20 -0000
+
+Hello,
+
+I am using Gentoo linux and in order to pass gcl compilation I had to
+change its ./configure which now look loke this :
+
+./configure --enable-vssize=65536*2 --disable-statsysbfd
+--enable-readline --enable-maxpage=128*1024 --enable-locbfd
+
+I dont understand what excatly it's changing, will I run into trouble
+later ?
+
+Thanks
+Antoine Hersen
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 19 12:29:48 2003
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+References: <200310160325.h9G3PEp29777@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: infinity in tex mode
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+
+Hello Tim & Dylan,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> David,
+>
+> The tex infinity bug should be closed.
+
+In fact, there was no open bug on TeX infinity. 
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <87u165tcmr.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Sun, 19
+	Oct 2003 18:29:00 +0200)
+References: <200310160325.h9G3PEp29777@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87u165tcmr.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: infinity in tex mode
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+
+> > David,
+> >
+> > The tex infinity bug should be closed.
+> 
+> In fact, there was no open bug on TeX infinity. 
+
+yeehaa! i'm finally getting ahead of the bugs :-)
+
+t
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 19 15:56:41 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2003 21:56:00 +0200
+Message-ID: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello Tim,
+
+I was trying my trick to build a statically linked Axiom but the
+compilation failed at one step. After building a fresh gcl (which is
+indeed static), I erased obj/linux/bin/interpsys and
+obj/linux/bin/depsys to force their recompilation. Recompilation of
+depsys fails with following error message:
+
+make[3]: Entering directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src/interp'
+3 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/depsys
+
+>
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/makedep.lisp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/sys-pkg.lsp
+Finished loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/sys-pkg.lsp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/nocompil.lsp
+Finished loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/nocompil.lsp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/util.o
+
+Error: Undefined symbol
+Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+Error signalled by LOAD.
+Broken at LOAD.  Type :H for Help.
+>>4 /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/depsys created
+63 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/macros.o from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/int/interp/macros.lisp
+/bin/sh: /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/depsys: No such file or directory
+make[3]: *** [/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/macros.o] Error 127
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src/interp'
+make[2]: *** [interpdir] Error 2
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src'
+make[1]: *** [srcdir] Error 2
+make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom'
+make: *** [all] Error 2
+
+Do you see what could have gone wrong?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 19 17:59:08 2003
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+Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2003 17:58:15 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Sun, 19
+	Oct 2003 21:56:00 +0200)
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David,
+
+You must have tried to build GCL outside of Axiom. 
+It appears that you didn't link the Axiom library to the lisp image.
+This happens as part of the lisp build process when Axiom does the build.
+
+Axiom untars GCL then applies the patches in the zips directory.
+One of the patches modifies the GCL build so that it includes Axiom's code
+in the GCL image. If you build GCL by hand you have to make the modifications
+by hand. This is one of the hard issues about using any pre-installed lisp.
+
+To solve the problem modify the top level Makefile.pamphlet to 
+include the --static flag (or whatever mods you made to get GCL to be
+static), then do 
+
+make clean
+make
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 20 12:52:24 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 18:51:29 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Sun, 19 Oct 2003 17:58:15 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> You must have tried to build GCL outside of Axiom. 
+
+No. I just made a 'make' inside the axiom/ directory.
+
+> It appears that you didn't link the Axiom library to the lisp image.
+> This happens as part of the lisp build process when Axiom does the build.
+>
+> Axiom untars GCL then applies the patches in the zips directory.
+
+Yes, this was done.
+
+> One of the patches modifies the GCL build so that it includes Axiom's code
+> in the GCL image. If you build GCL by hand you have to make the modifications
+> by hand. This is one of the hard issues about using any pre-installed lisp.
+
+What I have done:
+
+ 1. applied following patch:
+
+--- axiom-i386-dm/axiom/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet	Mon Sep 29 21:03:10 2003
++++ axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet	Sun Oct 19 21:08:18 2003
+@@ -122,7 +122,7 @@
+ relocating object files.
+ <<gclConfigureMake>>=
+ 	@(cd ${GCLVERSION} ; \
+-	./configure --enable-vssize=65536*2 --enable-statsysbfd --enable-readline --enable-maxpage=128*1024 ; \
++	CC="gcc --static" ./configure --enable-vssize=65536*2 --enable-statsysbfd --enable-readline --enable-maxpage=128*1024 ; \
+ 	${ENV} ${MAKE} ; \
+ 	cp unixport/saved_gcl ${OUT}/lisp )
+ @
+
+
+ 2. erased lsp/gcldir and lsp/gcl-2.5.2/
+
+ 3. erased obj/linux/bin/depsys and obj/linux/bin/interpsys
+
+ 4. make
+
+(and yes, I have setup the $AXIOM variable)
+
+> To solve the problem modify the top level Makefile.pamphlet to 
+> include the --static flag (or whatever mods you made to get GCL to be
+> static), then do 
+>
+> make clean
+
+I wanted to avoid that. Compiling algebra takes 12h on my old machine. 
+
+I retry with a 'make clean'. To be continued.... :)
+
+Thanks to have taken a look at this issue.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 20 17:16:41 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 23:15:53 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (David MENTRE's message of "Mon, 20
+	Oct 2003 18:51:29 +0200")
+Message-ID: <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> I retry with a 'make clean'. To be continued.... :)
+
+I tried again after a make clean and I obtain once again the same error
+message:
+
+
+make[3]: Entering directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src/interp'
+5 invoking make in /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src/interp with parms:
+SYS= linux
+LSP= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/lsp
+PART= cprogs
+SPAD= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/mnt/linux
+SRC= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src
+INT= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/int
+MID= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/int/interp
+OUT= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp
+OBJ= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj
+MNT= /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/mnt
+O=o LISP=lsp BYE=bye
+
+>
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/makeint.lisp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/sys-pkg.lsp
+Finished loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/sys-pkg.lsp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/nocompil.lsp
+Finished loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/nocompil.lsp
+Loading /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/interp/util.o
+
+Error: Undefined symbol
+Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+Error signalled by LOAD.
+Broken at LOAD.  Type :H for Help.
+>>6 /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/interpsys created
+cp: cannot stat `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/interpsys': No such file or directory
+make[3]: *** [/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/obj/linux/bin/interpsys] Error 1
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src/interp'
+make[2]: *** [interpdir] Error 2
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom/src'
+make[1]: *** [srcdir] Error 2
+make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-static-i386-dm/axiom'
+make: *** [all] Error 2
+
+
+I don't know if it is related to the static GCL or a more fundamental
+error in axiom build system.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 20 20:58:36 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Mon, 20
+	Oct 2003 23:15:53 +0200)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+
+David,
+
+I'll try a static build here. 
+The result will take a while as I only have a slow system available.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 20 23:19:17 2003
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+Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 23:18:23 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Mon, 20
+	Oct 2003 23:15:53 +0200)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David,
+
+I see the same result you get.
+I'll look into it further.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 20 23:46:27 2003
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+Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 23:45:28 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <200310210318.h9L3IN602293@localhost.localdomain> (message from
+	root on Mon, 20 Oct 2003 23:18:23 -0400)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310210318.h9L3IN602293@localhost.localdomain>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+
+David,
+
+The statically linked GCL image has a problem:
+
+make file foo.lisp:
+
+(defun test (st) (read-char st))
+
+at lisp prompt:
+
+>(compile-file "foo.lisp")
+>(load "foo.o")
+
+Error: Undefined symbol
+Fast links are on: do (si::use-fast-links nil) for debugging
+Error signalled by EVAL.
+Broken at LOAD.  Type :H for Help.
+>>
+
+replacing READ-CHAR by READ succeeds.
+
+So the problem appears to be the compiled reference to the READ-CHAR
+function and has nothing to do with Axiom. This looks like a GCL bug.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 08:29:13 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: WZocher@t-online.de (Wolfgang Zocher)
+Date: 20 Oct 2003 22:28:38 +0200
+Message-ID: <m34qy3wt55.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de>
+Lines: 15
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+X-Seen: false
+X-ID: JT7ZxvZTQeTRO19-2YAFK7tULNgWNT0x44TwYDpdGdh5fw0pIQbDQf
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] pamphlet-noweb-latex
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Hi all,
+
+when I produce tex-files from algebra-pamphlets the \spad - command and
+commands like \em, \tt etc. are going to deliver wrong representations in the
+resulting latex-file, i.e. \spad {G} is translated to \\spad\{G\}. This is
+obviously wrong - the first form (\spad {G}) or {\spad G} is right. 
+
+Inspection of noweb.sty shows that the characters \ and {} have a special
+meaning and it seems to me that this must be wrong. However, I'm very new to
+literate programming and all the tools belonging to LP. 
+
+Is there anybody out there who can clarify this issue??
+
+Thanks and regards
+Wolfgang   
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 09:52:49 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 08:50:27 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310211250.h9LCoRr11229@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: wzocher@t-online.de, david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] \spad
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+It's not your fault. There is a problem with the tex tag.
+The problem is that Axiom has its own tag definitions which
+are not (yet) in the axiom.sty file. I'll look into it.
+
+David,
+
+Could you add this as a bug?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 09:55:12 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+References: <200310211250.h9LCoRr11229@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: WZocher@t-online.de (Wolfgang Zocher)
+Date: 21 Oct 2003 15:49:27 +0200
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: \spad
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hi Tim,
+
+I've added the \spad fault as bug. I hope I've done this the right way :-)
+
+Regards,
+Wolfgang
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 11:36:33 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:35:49 -0400
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Unused old versions of GCL in CVS
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+I recently refreshed my copy of the Axiom CVS and I could
+not help but notice (download speed!) that there are four
+unused version of GCL in the CVS totaling more than 25 Mb.
+Can you see any reason for keeping 2.4.1, 2.4.3 and 2.5?
+Also I see that the naming convention for 2.5.3 is different
+(.tar.gz). Am I correct that this version is also not used?
+
+I would offer to clean this up and maybe also move things
+to the most recent version of GCL (2.6.1-15) - or do you
+already have plans for that? But I am a little unsure about
+how to remove things from CVS.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 12:40:00 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 11:59:41 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310211559.h9LFxfR26806@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+There are several versions of GCL in the repository because
+I do builds on multiple versions when bug testing. Most of
+those bugs were related to package issues which should all
+be fixed by now.
+
+There was a bug in the 2.5.3 build that kept me from using that version.
+
+The current build is on 2.5.2 but will move to 2.6 when I get a
+chance.  I will remove the other versions tonight.
+
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 12:41:00 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:00:54 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310211600.h9LG0sp27242@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+Is 2.6 stable?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 12:51:39 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:11:38 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310211611.h9LGBcY27278@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 16:51:37 -0000
+
+Bill,
+
+In answer to your implied question about deleting files from CVS
+this appears to work:
+
+cvs update                  make sure you have the latest
+cd (where)                  go to the file's directory
+rm filename                 remove the file first
+cvs delete filename         tell cvs to delete the file
+cd (top)                    go to the top level directory containing CVS
+cvs ci -m"removed filename" do a checkin
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 13:43:35 2003
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+	Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:42:10 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:42:12 -0400
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+
+Tim,
+
+Yes, according to the new GCL version numbering scheme
+x.y.z-w is stable if y is an even number. The previous
+stable version (I think) was 2.5.4 which was prior to
+the introduction of the new numbering scheme.
+
+The current *unstable* development version of GCL is
+2.7.0-11.
+
+Check for the most recent stuff at
+
+  http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/
+
+Note: These are not just debian files.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Tim Daly
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 12:01 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Cc: axiom@tenkan.org; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Is 2.6 stable?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org 
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-> developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 13:46:05 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1AC0a5-0003UD-C8
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+	Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:38:24 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:37:56 -0400
+Message-ID: <000001c397fa$254bab00$6501a8c0@Asus>
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 17:46:04 -0000
+
+Tim,
+
+Yes, according to the new GCL version numbering scheme
+x.y.z-w is stable if y is an even number. The previous
+stable version (I think) was 2.5.4 which was prior to
+the introduction of the new numbering scheme.
+
+The current *unstable* development version of GCL is
+2.7.0-11.
+
+Check for the most recent stuff at
+
+  http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/
+
+Note: These are not just debian files.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Tim Daly
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 12:01 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Cc: axiom@tenkan.org; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Is 2.6 stable?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org 
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-> developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 14:23:03 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1AC19r-0003eY-1n
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+	Tue, 21 Oct 2003 14:22:16 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 14:22:17 -0400
+Message-ID: <000601c39800$45669ac0$6501a8c0@Asus>
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+In-Reply-To: <54vfqpwbvj.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: 'Camm Maguire' <camm@enhanced.com>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+
+Tim, David,
+
+You might recall that on Thursday, October 16, 2003 9:28 AM
+Camm Maquire wrote:
+
+> 
+> Latest 2.6.1 and CVS HEAD has a --enable-static configure 
+> option. There may be some issues when using readline in this 
+> mode, but I haven't yet had a chance to plumb the bottom of
+> that.
+> 
+
+On Monday, October 20, 2003 11:45 PM Tim wrote:
+
+> 
+> The statically linked GCL image has a problem:
+> 
+> make file foo.lisp:
+> 
+> (defun test (st) (read-char st))
+> 
+> at lisp prompt:
+> 
+> >(compile-file "foo.lisp")
+> >(load "foo.o")
+> 
+
+I tried this under Windows with GCL 2.6.1 which is statically
+linked without readline by default (I think?). It worked fine.
+
+So it seems that moving to 2.6.1, building with the new
+.\configure --enable-static option and eliminating readline
+might correct your static linking problem.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 21 14:29:40 2003
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+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:49:51 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310211749.h9LHnpR02684@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] GCL 2.6.1 and static
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+I just downloaded the sources for GCL-2.6.1. I'll do two builds
+tonight, one for Axiom and if that succeeds, one to try the static build.
+If either (or both) succeed I'll upload a new version based on GCL-2.6.1
+and trash the other GCLs.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+References: <87d6ctt31r.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310192158.h9JLwFx18382@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87d6crc0oe.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <87y8vfa9va.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+	<200310210318.h9L3IN602293@localhost.localdomain>
+	<200310210345.h9L3jSW02480@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 20:29:24 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <200310210345.h9L3jSW02480@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Mon, 20 Oct 2003 23:45:28 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87llrev3zv.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> So the problem appears to be the compiled reference to the READ-CHAR
+> function and has nothing to do with Axiom. This looks like a GCL bug.
+
+Ok. I suppose this was done on gcl 2.5.2 included with Axiom CVS and
+which is now an old version of gcl.
+
+As Camm already told use that stable gcl 2.6.x has support for static
+binary (./configure --static), I propose to postpone support of
+statically linked Axiom until one of use integrates gcl 2.6.x into
+Axiom.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 22 03:12:43 2003
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+	Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:38:24 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:37:56 -0400
+Message-ID: <000001c397fa$254bab00$6501a8c0@Asus>
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+Yes, according to the new GCL version numbering scheme
+x.y.z-w is stable if y is an even number. The previous
+stable version (I think) was 2.5.4 which was prior to
+the introduction of the new numbering scheme.
+
+The current *unstable* development version of GCL is
+2.7.0-11.
+
+Check for the most recent stuff at
+
+  http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/
+
+Note: These are not just debian files.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: 
+> axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu.org 
+> [mailto:axiom-developer-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@nongnu
+> .org] On Behalf Of Tim Daly
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 12:01 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Cc: axiom@tenkan.org; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] other GCL versions
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Is 2.6 stable?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org 
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-> developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 22 09:39:05 2003
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+	by rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id h9MCuGk28962;
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+Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 08:56:16 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310221256.h9MCuGk28962@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] porting
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+
+*,
+
+HP offers a site to try out various versions of Linux.
+http://www.testdrive.compaq.com/os/linux
+
+Does anyone have access to this site?
+Is is possible to run the Axiom build on each system
+and save the console output?
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 22 10:22:35 2003
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+Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 10:16:24 -0400
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] porting
+Message-ID: <20031022141624.GA19523@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310221256.h9MCuGk28962@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Mime-Version: 1.0
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
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+
+
+--+HP7ph2BbKc20aGI
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+On Wed, Oct 22, 2003 at 08:56:16AM -0400, Tim Daly wrote:
+> 
+> Does anyone have access to this site?
+> Is is possible to run the Axiom build on each system
+> and save the console output?
+
+You can sign up yourself, at
+http://www.testdrive.compaq.com/accounts/register.shtml
+or is this a request for someone else to do it?
+
+I believe that the Debian packages have already been built on all the
+architectures they offer, however.
+
+(By the way, are you aware just how much console output the Axiom build
+produces?  It's really ludicrous.)
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--+HP7ph2BbKc20aGI
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+=ZkaO
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+
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+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 22 10:38:33 2003
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+Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 09:58:36 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310221358.h9MDwaX02539@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] porting
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan,
+
+I did sign up for the HP site, actually. I've been trying to
+port to some of these platforms locally but I lack the experience
+with their "mindset" or can't reach their distribution sites
+(e.g. debian and SuSE) because my systems are standalone.
+
+Yeah, the console output could probably be redirected (and I do
+redirect the pamphlet build output by default) or reduced. But
+it contains just enough output to debug a failed build. Fortunately
+I no longer work on my teletype :-). I suppose I could figure out
+how to set a "user" flag to suppress output. I'll put it on the
+todo list.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 07:41:26 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] gcl-2.6.1
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+
+*,
+
+Axiom is now based on gcl-2.6.1
+The cvs has been updated.
+I've removed gcl-2.* compressed tar files (except for gcl-2.5.2).
+I'll remove 2.5.2 once 2.6.1 has been shown stable.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 11:32:34 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310231532.h9NFWY828373@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: TestDrive@hp.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Axiom build
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+I've successfully transferred the source files. Thanks.
+
+I'm using TestDrive servers to ensure that Axiom runs on HP 
+hardware/software combinations. The Axiom build makes heavy
+use of the C compiler. I can nice the process to 19 but I'd
+rather do the builds when the servers are lightly used. Do
+you have "off hour" times (say at night) that you might
+recommend?
+
+Is the /house/timdaly file system NFS shared? The Axiom build
+is designed to take advantage of this by caching system-independent
+work.
+
+Once I've verified that Axiom runs everywhere is there someone I
+can contact about including Axiom in HP distributions? The system
+is free, is of commercial quality (it used to be commercial code),
+and I'm willing to support it.
+
+Thanks,
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 12:47:32 2003
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 12:46:43 -0400
+To: root <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] synthesis
+Message-ID: <20031023164643.GA23438@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu>
+References: <200310161156.h9GBu3R30430@localhost.localdomain>
+Mime-Version: 1.0
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+User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i
+From: dpt@exoskeleton.math.harvard.edu (Dylan Thurston)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+--wRRV7LY7NUeQGEoC
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Content-Disposition: inline
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+On Thu, Oct 16, 2003 at 07:56:03AM -0400, root wrote:
+> There are several requests under consideration.
+> 
+> David and Joris have been calling for a "configure" command.
+> Dylan and Bill have been trying to set up tm_axiom with texmacs.
+> Camm and Juergen have asked to use the already installed lisp.
+> Joris would like a static version of the system.
+> Dylan would like the make variables to be available everywhere.
+> I've been wondering about platform-specific complexity.
+> 
+> I may have the names wrong but the point is that I'm now convinced
+> that I have to change direction.
+> 
+> ./configure can be used to attack all of these problems.
+> So I'll write up an initial script, post it, and we can play with it.
+
+It occurs to me that you have a lot on your plate right now (with the
+documentation and all), and that there are probably other people on the
+list with more experience setting up autoconf than you.  Perhaps this
+would be a good task for someone else?
+
+[Or if you've already done this, that's great too.]
+
+I don't have experience with autoconf, but I'd be happy to learn.
+
+Peace,
+	Dylan
+
+--wRRV7LY7NUeQGEoC
+Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
+Content-Description: Digital signature
+Content-Disposition: inline
+
+-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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+
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+770zplqm/lt6P5iOp/mA6hU=
+=rh+u
+-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
+
+--wRRV7LY7NUeQGEoC--
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 12:52:10 2003
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 12:12:14 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310231612.h9NGCE432367@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: dpt@math.harvard.edu
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] configure
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dylan,
+
+Great. Give it a try. I've looked at autoconf in detail but it was 
+nearly 2 years ago but I can answer some questions about it. I think
+Camm has also suffered thru it so he may have answers you need. In
+any case, feel free to ask.
+
+Thanks,
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 12:58:13 2003
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+	id 1ACikP-00025R-00; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 12:55:41 -0400
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+References: <000601c39800$45669ac0$6501a8c0@Asus>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 23 Oct 2003 12:55:41 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <000601c39800$45669ac0$6501a8c0@Asus>
+Message-ID: <54llrbvqpe.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 123
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 16:58:09 -0000
+
+Greetings!  OK, thanks for the report -- I've just committed a fix in
+cvs 2.6.1 and head.  The patch is in two parts, one loads weak symbols
+as well as undefined symbols into the bfd symbol table, and the other
+maps the 't' and 'nil stream descriptors properly in optimized
+references to read-char.  These will be in the next stable and
+unstable release on the temp site.
+
+Take care,
+
+Index: read.d
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/gcl/gcl/o/read.d,v
+retrieving revision 1.14.4.1.2.2.2.2
+diff -u -r1.14.4.1.2.2.2.2 read.d
+--- read.d	14 Sep 2003 02:30:45 -0000	1.14.4.1.2.2.2.2
++++ read.d	23 Oct 2003 16:37:07 -0000
+@@ -2298,19 +2298,30 @@
+ @)
+ 
+ object
+-read_byte1(str,eof)
+-object str,eof;
+-{if (stream_at_end(str))
+-   return eof;
+- return make_fixnum(readc_stream(str));}
++read_byte1(strm,eof)
++object strm,eof;
++{
++  if (strm == Cnil)
++    strm = symbol_value(sLAstandard_inputA);
++  else if (strm == Ct)
++    strm = symbol_value(sLAterminal_ioA);
++  if (stream_at_end(strm))
++    return eof;
++  return make_fixnum(readc_stream(strm));
++}
+ 
+ object
+-read_char1(str,eof)
+-object str,eof;
+-{if (stream_at_end(str))
+-   return eof;
+- return code_char(readc_stream(str));}
+-
++read_char1(strm,eof)
++object strm,eof;
++{
++  if (strm == Cnil)
++    strm = symbol_value(sLAstandard_inputA);
++  else if (strm == Ct)
++    strm = symbol_value(sLAterminal_ioA);
++  if (stream_at_end(strm))
++    return eof;
++  return code_char(readc_stream(strm));
++}
+ 
+ @(defun copy_readtable (&optional (from `current_readtable()`) to)
+ @
+Index: sfasli.c
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/gcl/gcl/o/sfasli.c,v
+retrieving revision 1.10.4.2.2.1
+diff -u -r1.10.4.2.2.1 sfasli.c
+--- sfasli.c	6 Sep 2003 17:22:50 -0000	1.10.4.2.2.1
++++ sfasli.c	23 Oct 2003 16:37:07 -0000
+@@ -59,7 +59,7 @@
+     if (!*q[u]->name)
+       continue;
+ 
+-    if (strncmp(q[u]->section->name,"*UND*",5))
++    if (strncmp(q[u]->section->name,"*UND*",5) && ! q[u]->flags & BSF_WEAK)
+       continue;
+ 
+     if ((c=(char *)strstr(q[u]->name,"@@"))) {
+
+
+"Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca> writes:
+
+> Tim, David,
+> 
+> You might recall that on Thursday, October 16, 2003 9:28 AM
+> Camm Maquire wrote:
+> 
+> > 
+> > Latest 2.6.1 and CVS HEAD has a --enable-static configure 
+> > option. There may be some issues when using readline in this 
+> > mode, but I haven't yet had a chance to plumb the bottom of
+> > that.
+> > 
+> 
+> On Monday, October 20, 2003 11:45 PM Tim wrote:
+> 
+> > 
+> > The statically linked GCL image has a problem:
+> > 
+> > make file foo.lisp:
+> > 
+> > (defun test (st) (read-char st))
+> > 
+> > at lisp prompt:
+> > 
+> > >(compile-file "foo.lisp")
+> > >(load "foo.o")
+> > 
+> 
+> I tried this under Windows with GCL 2.6.1 which is statically
+> linked without readline by default (I think?). It worked fine.
+> 
+> So it seems that moving to 2.6.1, building with the new
+> .\configure --enable-static option and eliminating readline
+> might correct your static linking problem.
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 13:10:45 2003
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 12:30:00 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310231630.h9NGU0Y00915@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] static build  and HP TestDrive hp156 console
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: daly@idsi.net
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+
+Thanks.
+
+I just built and tested a non-static version of the system using
+2.6.1 and it works fine (modulo the fact that the files were renamed).
+The 2.6.1 version is in the CVS and will be the default build.
+The static version failed as mentioned. I'll try a static rebuild 
+(possibly tonight).
+
+I am doing compiles using HP's TestDrive server farm.
+Just out of wild hope I tried it on one of their 64bit Itanium machines.
+I've attached the console log. It blew up quite early in the build
+because it couldn't recognize the machine type. Under Schelter's 
+regime it used to be the case that you set the machine type by typing
+./add-defs foo
+Can you tell me how the machine type is decided now?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+=====================================================================
+
+bash-2.05b# telnet hp156
+Trying 192.233.54.156...
+Connected to hp156.
+Escape character is '^]'.
+Debian GNU/Linux 3.0 spe156.testdrive.hp.com
+spe156 login: timdaly
+Password: 
+
+Last login: Thu Oct 23 12:02:44 2003 from rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu on pts/1
+Linux spe156 2.4.18-mckinley-smp #1 SMP Thu Jul 11 12:51:02 MDT 2002 ia64 unknown
+---------------------------------------
+The Testdrive program is here to enable you to get direct access via the
+internet to Compaq's high end AlphaServers and Proliant servers.  We thank
+you for your time trying out our equipment and encourage
+suggestions.  Please send all comments and feedback to
+testdrive@compaq.com.
+
+Rules of the Program
+--------------------
+We do not allow the following:
+1. Running password crackers, dnetc clients, seti, distrib.net, etc.
+
+2. Bringing down our machines, cracking, etc.  We have no doubt that you
+can break into the machines if you really want to, but why.  When you
+bring down a machine you take away a free and valuable resource from the
+open source community.  So please, think before you act.
+
+3. Long running, CPU bound processes are not encouraged.  The 
+Testdrive program is not intended as a benchmark nor production
+environment.  
+Programs that consume significant amounts of system resources only make
+other 
+users Testdrive experiences less useful.  Experiencing the power of Compaq 
+systems should be taken in moderation for everyone's benefit! :-)
+
+4. Abusive file storage.  Testdrive is not intended as an ISP/ASP
+environment.  
+User areas are not backed up, and cannot be restored.  Users with large 
+amount of disk usage should understand they are simply consuming their 
+fellow testers resources.
+
+Connections and File Moving
+---------------------------
+We only allow ftp and telnet in to the testdrive program. No outgoing
+connections are allowed.
+
+To move a file, ftp into any of our testdrive machines, and use a put to
+place the files in your house directory.  From there they will be
+available on all machines.
+
+For fast local access from individual machines to your files, use the /tmp
+directory on the local machine.
+
+Thanks again for Testdriving
+
+Testdrive Team
+spe156> bash
+bash-2.05a$ pwd
+/house/timdaly
+bash-2.05a$ cd axiom
+bash-2.05a$ echo $AXIOM
+/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux
+bash-2.05a$ make
+13 making noweb
+patching file modules.c
+mnt.o: In function `emitfile':
+mnt.o(.text+0xc72): the use of `tmpnam' is dangerous, better use `mkstemp'
+make[1]: [install-shell] Error 1 (ignored)
+make[1]: [install-code] Error 1 (ignored)
+/bin/sh: texhash: command not found
+make[1]: [install-elisp] Error 1 (ignored)
+0 SPAD=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux SYS=linux SPD=/house/timdaly/axiom LSP=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp GCLDIR=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 SRC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src INT=/house/timdaly/axiom/int OBJ=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj MNT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt ZIPS=/house/timdaly/axiom/zips TMP=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp SPADBIN=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin INC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/include CCLBASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/ccl/ccllisp PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything NOISE=-o /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp/trace GCLVERSION=gcl-2.5.2
+10 copying /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts to /house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin
+1 making a linux system, PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything
+2 Environment SPAD=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux SYS=linux SPD=/house/timdaly/axiom LSP=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp GCLDIR=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 SRC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src INT=/house/timdaly/axiom/int OBJ=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj MNT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt ZIPS=/house/timdaly/axiom/zips TMP=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp SPADBIN=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin INC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/include CCLBASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/ccl/ccllisp PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything NOISE=-o /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp/trace GCLVERSION=gcl-2.5.2
+make[1]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom'
+11 checking directory structure
+12 Environment: PLF=LINUXplatform CCF=-O2 -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE -DLINUXplatform -I/usr/X11/include LDF=-L/usr/X11R6/lib CC=gcc AWK=awk RANLIB=ranlib TOUCH=touch TAR=tar AXIOMXLROOT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/compiler O=o BYE=bye LISP=lsp DAASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/share
+18 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src
+make[2]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src'
+1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts
+make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts'
+1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts'
+5 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib
+make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib'
+2 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/bsdsignal.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet
+3 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/bsdsignal.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/bsdsignal.c
+8 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cursor.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/cursor.c.pamphlet
+9 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/cursor.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cursor.c
+11 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/edin.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/edin.c.pamphlet
+12 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/edin.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/edin.c
+14 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/fnct_key.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet
+15 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/fnct_key.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/fnct_key.c
+17 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/halloc.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/halloc.c.pamphlet
+18 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/halloc.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/halloc.c
+20 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/openpty.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/openpty.c.pamphlet
+21 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/openpty.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/openpty.c
+23 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/pixmap.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet
+24 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/pixmap.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/pixmap.c
+26 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/prt.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/prt.c.pamphlet
+27 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/prt.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/prt.c
+29 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/sockio-c.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/sockio-c.c.pamphlet
+30 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/sockio-c.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/sockio-c.c
+32 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/spadcolors.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/spadcolors.c.pamphlet
+33 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/spadcolors.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/spadcolors.c
+35 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/util.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/util.c.pamphlet
+36 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/util.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/util.c
+38 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/wct.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/wct.c.pamphlet
+39 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/wct.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/wct.c
+41 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XDither.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XDither.c.pamphlet
+42 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XDither.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XDither.c
+44 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XShade.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XShade.c.pamphlet
+45 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XShade.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XShade.c
+47 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XSpadFill.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XSpadFill.c.pamphlet
+48 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XSpadFill.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XSpadFill.c
+5 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cfuns-c.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet
+6 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/cfuns-c.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cfuns-c.c
+1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/libspad.a
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib'
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src'
+0 PLF=LINUXplatform CCF=-O2 -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE -DLINUXplatform -I/usr/X11/include LDF=-L/usr/X11R6/lib CC=gcc AWK=awk RANLIB=ranlib TOUCH=touch TAR=tar AXIOMXLROOT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/compiler O=o BYE=bye LISP=lsp DAASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/share
+10 copying /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts to /house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin
+19 making /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp
+make[2]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp'
+2 building gcl-2.5.2
+3 applying EXTRAS patch to h/linux.defs
+patching file linux.defs
+4 setup ini files for EXTRAS patch
+5 applying HAVE_XDR patch to h/linux.h
+patching file linux.h
+6 applying libspad.a patch to unixport/makefile
+patching file makefile
+7 applying toploop patch to unixport/init_gcl.lsp
+patching file init_gcl.lsp.in
+8 applying object_to_float patch
+patching file cmpaux.c
+9 applying in-package patch
+patching file package.d
+10 applying EXIT patch
+18 applying MAX_STACK_SIZE patch
+patching file main.c
+11 applying tail-recursive noise patch
+patching file cmpflet.lsp
+12 applying tail-recursive noise patch
+patching file cmpcall.lsp
+creating cache ./config.cache
+checking host system type... ia64-unknown-linux-gnu
+host=ia64-unknown-linux-gnu
+enable_machine=
+Exactly one loader option must be chosen: dlopen=yes statsysbfd=yes dynsysbfd=no locbfd=no custreloc=no
+make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+rm -f bin/gcl xbin/gcl
+MGCLDIR=`echo /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 | sed -e 'sX^\([a-z]\):X/\1Xg'` ; \
+GCLDIR=`echo /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2` ; \
+make install-command "INSTALL_LIB_DIR=$GCLDIR" "prefix=$GCLDIR" "BINDIR=$MGCLDIR/unixport"
+make[4]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+(echo '#!/bin/sh' ; \
+if gcc --version | grep -q -i mingw ; then echo "export C_INCLUDE_PATH=`echo $INSTALL_LIB_DIR`/h"; else echo "export C_INCLUDE_PATH=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/h:\$C_INCLUDE_PATH"; fi ;\
+echo exec /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/unixport/ \\ ; \
+echo '   -dir' /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/unixport/ \\ ; \
+echo '   -libdir' /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/ \\ ; \
+echo '   -eval '\''(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)'\' \\ ;\
+! [ -d "" ] || echo '   -eval '\''(setq si::*tk-library* '\"\"')'\' \\;\
+[ "" = "" ] || echo '   -eval '\''(si::init-readline)'\' \\;\
+echo '     '\"\$@\" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl;
+echo '#' other options: -load "/tmp/foo.o" -load "jo.lsp" -eval '"(joe 3)"' >> /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+chmod a+x /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclm.bat
+if gcc --version | grep -q mingw ; then (echo '@SET cd='; \
+ echo '@SET promp%prompt%'; \
+ echo '@PROMPT SET cd'; \
+ echo '@CALL>%temp%.\setdir.bat'; \
+ echo '@'; \
+ echo '% do not delete this line %'; \
+ echo '@ECHO off'; \
+ echo 'PROMPT %promp'; \
+ echo 'FOR %%c IN (CALL DEL) DO %%c %temp%.\setdir.bat'; \
+ echo 'set cwd=%cd%'; \
+ echo 'set libdir=%cd%\..\lib\gcl-2.5.0'; \
+ echo 'set unixportdir=%libdir%\unixport'; \
+ echo 'path %cd%\..\mingw\bin;%PATH%'; \
+ echo "start %unixportdir%\saved_gcl.exe -dir %unixportdir% -libdir %libdir% -eval \"(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)\" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclm.bat ; fi
+rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclfinal.bat
+if gcc --version | grep -q -i mingw ; then (echo 'ECHO path %1\mingw\bin;%PATH% > gcli.bat'; \
+ echo "ECHO start %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0\unixport\saved_gcl.exe -dir %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0\unixport -libdir %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0 -eval \"(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)\" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9 >> gcli.bat" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclfinal.bat ; fi
+make[4]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+(cd xbin ; cp ../bin/gcl .)
+cd cmpnew && make collectfn.o
+make[4]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/cmpnew'
+../unixport/saved_gcl ../unixport/ -compile collectfn.lsp
+make[4]: ../unixport/saved_gcl: Command not found
+make[4]: *** [collectfn.o] Error 127
+make[4]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/cmpnew'
+make[3]: *** [cmpnew/collectfn.o] Error 2
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+cp: cannot stat `unixport/saved_gcl': No such file or directory
+make[2]: *** [gcldir] Error 1
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp'
+make[1]: *** [lspdir] Error 2
+make[1]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom'
+make: *** [all] Error 2
+bash-2.05a$ uname -a
+uname -a
+Linux spe156 2.4.18-mckinley-smp #1 SMP Thu Jul 11 12:51:02 MDT 2002 ia64 unknown
+bash-2.05a$ exit
+exit
+exit
+spe156> exit
+exit
+spe156> logout
+Connection closed by foreign host.
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 14:23:44 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <200310231630.h9NGU0Y00915@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 23 Oct 2003 14:22:45 -0400
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+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: static build  and HP TestDrive hp156 console
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:23:42 -0000
+
+Greetings!
+
+You're in luck -- axiom ia64 lives, at least on Debian, which is most
+likely exactly the machine you are running.
+
+This is a configure script default error -- just add
+--disable-statsysbfd --enable-dlopen to the configure flags.
+Currently needed (alas) on mips(el), ia64, hppa, and alpha. 
+
+One additional annoyance remains on ia64 -- the ld.so 'function
+descriptors' are dynamically generated, which means that unless the
+shared libs at runtime are exactly the same as at build time, you can
+lose big.  Emacs had a similar issue, as they like us make images with
+unexec, which stores function addresses in the executable's .data
+section.  Was the original motivation for the static build option, but
+alas again, this does not seem to work with dlopen (naturally).
+Probably the shortest way out is to implement
+bfd_relocate_section_contents on this machine, but so far there are no
+users (I know of), and this is low priority, esp. with the appearance
+of amd64, which is fully supported in 64bit mode.
+
+Please let me know if you have probs.
+
+Take care,
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Thanks.
+> 
+> I just built and tested a non-static version of the system using
+> 2.6.1 and it works fine (modulo the fact that the files were renamed).
+> The 2.6.1 version is in the CVS and will be the default build.
+> The static version failed as mentioned. I'll try a static rebuild 
+> (possibly tonight).
+> 
+> I am doing compiles using HP's TestDrive server farm.
+> Just out of wild hope I tried it on one of their 64bit Itanium machines.
+> I've attached the console log. It blew up quite early in the build
+> because it couldn't recognize the machine type. Under Schelter's 
+> regime it used to be the case that you set the machine type by typing
+> ./add-defs foo
+> Can you tell me how the machine type is decided now?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> =====================================================================
+> 
+> bash-2.05b# telnet hp156
+> Trying 192.233.54.156...
+> Connected to hp156.
+> Escape character is '^]'.
+> Debian GNU/Linux 3.0 spe156.testdrive.hp.com
+> spe156 login: timdaly
+> Password: 
+> 
+> Last login: Thu Oct 23 12:02:44 2003 from rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu on pts/1
+> Linux spe156 2.4.18-mckinley-smp #1 SMP Thu Jul 11 12:51:02 MDT 2002 ia64 unknown
+> ---------------------------------------
+> The Testdrive program is here to enable you to get direct access via the
+> internet to Compaq's high end AlphaServers and Proliant servers.  We thank
+> you for your time trying out our equipment and encourage
+> suggestions.  Please send all comments and feedback to
+> testdrive@compaq.com.
+> 
+> Rules of the Program
+> --------------------
+> We do not allow the following:
+> 1. Running password crackers, dnetc clients, seti, distrib.net, etc.
+> 
+> 2. Bringing down our machines, cracking, etc.  We have no doubt that you
+> can break into the machines if you really want to, but why.  When you
+> bring down a machine you take away a free and valuable resource from the
+> open source community.  So please, think before you act.
+> 
+> 3. Long running, CPU bound processes are not encouraged.  The 
+> Testdrive program is not intended as a benchmark nor production
+> environment.  
+> Programs that consume significant amounts of system resources only make
+> other 
+> users Testdrive experiences less useful.  Experiencing the power of Compaq 
+> systems should be taken in moderation for everyone's benefit! :-)
+> 
+> 4. Abusive file storage.  Testdrive is not intended as an ISP/ASP
+> environment.  
+> User areas are not backed up, and cannot be restored.  Users with large 
+> amount of disk usage should understand they are simply consuming their 
+> fellow testers resources.
+> 
+> Connections and File Moving
+> ---------------------------
+> We only allow ftp and telnet in to the testdrive program. No outgoing
+> connections are allowed.
+> 
+> To move a file, ftp into any of our testdrive machines, and use a put to
+> place the files in your house directory.  From there they will be
+> available on all machines.
+> 
+> For fast local access from individual machines to your files, use the /tmp
+> directory on the local machine.
+> 
+> Thanks again for Testdriving
+> 
+> Testdrive Team
+> spe156> bash
+> bash-2.05a$ pwd
+> /house/timdaly
+> bash-2.05a$ cd axiom
+> bash-2.05a$ echo $AXIOM
+> /house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux
+> bash-2.05a$ make
+> 13 making noweb
+> patching file modules.c
+> mnt.o: In function `emitfile':
+> mnt.o(.text+0xc72): the use of `tmpnam' is dangerous, better use `mkstemp'
+> make[1]: [install-shell] Error 1 (ignored)
+> make[1]: [install-code] Error 1 (ignored)
+> /bin/sh: texhash: command not found
+> make[1]: [install-elisp] Error 1 (ignored)
+> 0 SPAD=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux SYS=linux SPD=/house/timdaly/axiom LSP=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp GCLDIR=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 SRC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src INT=/house/timdaly/axiom/int OBJ=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj MNT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt ZIPS=/house/timdaly/axiom/zips TMP=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp SPADBIN=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin INC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/include CCLBASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/ccl/ccllisp PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything NOISE=-o /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp/trace GCLVERSION=gcl-2.5.2
+> 10 copying /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts to /house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin
+> 1 making a linux system, PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything
+> 2 Environment SPAD=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux SYS=linux SPD=/house/timdaly/axiom LSP=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp GCLDIR=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 SRC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src INT=/house/timdaly/axiom/int OBJ=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj MNT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt ZIPS=/house/timdaly/axiom/zips TMP=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp SPADBIN=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin INC=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/include CCLBASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/ccl/ccllisp PART=cprogs SUBPART=everything NOISE=-o /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/tmp/trace GCLVERSION=gcl-2.5.2
+> make[1]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom'
+> 11 checking directory structure
+> 12 Environment: PLF=LINUXplatform CCF=-O2 -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE -DLINUXplatform -I/usr/X11/include LDF=-L/usr/X11R6/lib CC=gcc AWK=awk RANLIB=ranlib TOUCH=touch TAR=tar AXIOMXLROOT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/compiler O=o BYE=bye LISP=lsp DAASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/share
+> 18 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src
+> make[2]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src'
+> 1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts
+> make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts'
+> 1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts
+> make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts'
+> 5 making /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib
+> make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib'
+> 2 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/bsdsignal.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet
+> 3 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/bsdsignal.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/bsdsignal.c
+> 8 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cursor.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/cursor.c.pamphlet
+> 9 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/cursor.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cursor.c
+> 11 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/edin.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/edin.c.pamphlet
+> 12 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/edin.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/edin.c
+> 14 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/fnct_key.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet
+> 15 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/fnct_key.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/fnct_key.c
+> 17 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/halloc.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/halloc.c.pamphlet
+> 18 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/halloc.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/halloc.c
+> 20 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/openpty.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/openpty.c.pamphlet
+> 21 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/openpty.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/openpty.c
+> 23 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/pixmap.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet
+> 24 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/pixmap.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/pixmap.c
+> 26 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/prt.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/prt.c.pamphlet
+> 27 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/prt.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/prt.c
+> 29 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/sockio-c.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/sockio-c.c.pamphlet
+> 30 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/sockio-c.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/sockio-c.c
+> 32 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/spadcolors.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/spadcolors.c.pamphlet
+> 33 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/spadcolors.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/spadcolors.c
+> 35 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/util.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/util.c.pamphlet
+> 36 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/util.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/util.c
+> 38 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/wct.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/wct.c.pamphlet
+> 39 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/wct.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/wct.c
+> 41 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XDither.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XDither.c.pamphlet
+> 42 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XDither.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XDither.c
+> 44 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XShade.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XShade.c.pamphlet
+> 45 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XShade.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XShade.c
+> 47 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XSpadFill.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/XSpadFill.c.pamphlet
+> 48 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/XSpadFill.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/XSpadFill.c
+> 5 making /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cfuns-c.c from /house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet
+> 6 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/cfuns-c.o from /house/timdaly/axiom/int/lib/cfuns-c.c
+> 1 making /house/timdaly/axiom/obj/linux/lib/libspad.a
+> make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src/lib'
+> make[2]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/src'
+> 0 PLF=LINUXplatform CCF=-O2 -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE -DLINUXplatform -I/usr/X11/include LDF=-L/usr/X11R6/lib CC=gcc AWK=awk RANLIB=ranlib TOUCH=touch TAR=tar AXIOMXLROOT=/house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/compiler O=o BYE=bye LISP=lsp DAASE=/house/timdaly/axiom/src/share
+> 10 copying /house/timdaly/axiom/src/scripts to /house/timdaly/axiom/mnt/linux/bin
+> 19 making /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp
+> make[2]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp'
+> 2 building gcl-2.5.2
+> 3 applying EXTRAS patch to h/linux.defs
+> patching file linux.defs
+> 4 setup ini files for EXTRAS patch
+> 5 applying HAVE_XDR patch to h/linux.h
+> patching file linux.h
+> 6 applying libspad.a patch to unixport/makefile
+> patching file makefile
+> 7 applying toploop patch to unixport/init_gcl.lsp
+> patching file init_gcl.lsp.in
+> 8 applying object_to_float patch
+> patching file cmpaux.c
+> 9 applying in-package patch
+> patching file package.d
+> 10 applying EXIT patch
+> 18 applying MAX_STACK_SIZE patch
+> patching file main.c
+> 11 applying tail-recursive noise patch
+> patching file cmpflet.lsp
+> 12 applying tail-recursive noise patch
+> patching file cmpcall.lsp
+> creating cache ./config.cache
+> checking host system type... ia64-unknown-linux-gnu
+> host=ia64-unknown-linux-gnu
+> enable_machine=
+> Exactly one loader option must be chosen: dlopen=yes statsysbfd=yes dynsysbfd=no locbfd=no custreloc=no
+> make[3]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+> rm -f bin/gcl xbin/gcl
+> MGCLDIR=`echo /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2 | sed -e 'sX^\([a-z]\):X/\1Xg'` ; \
+> GCLDIR=`echo /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2` ; \
+> make install-command "INSTALL_LIB_DIR=$GCLDIR" "prefix=$GCLDIR" "BINDIR=$MGCLDIR/unixport"
+> make[4]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+> rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+> (echo '#!/bin/sh' ; \
+> if gcc --version | grep -q -i mingw ; then echo "export C_INCLUDE_PATH=`echo $INSTALL_LIB_DIR`/h"; else echo "export C_INCLUDE_PATH=/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/h:\$C_INCLUDE_PATH"; fi ;\
+> echo exec /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/unixport/ \\ ; \
+> echo '   -dir' /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/unixport/ \\ ; \
+> echo '   -libdir' /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/ \\ ; \
+> echo '   -eval '\''(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)'\' \\ ;\
+> ! [ -d "" ] || echo '   -eval '\''(setq si::*tk-library* '\"\"')'\' \\;\
+> [ "" = "" ] || echo '   -eval '\''(si::init-readline)'\' \\;\
+> echo '     '\"\$@\" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl;
+> echo '#' other options: -load "/tmp/foo.o" -load "jo.lsp" -eval '"(joe 3)"' >> /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+> chmod a+x /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gcl
+> rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclm.bat
+> if gcc --version | grep -q mingw ; then (echo '@SET cd='; \
+>  echo '@SET promp%prompt%'; \
+>  echo '@PROMPT SET cd'; \
+>  echo '@CALL>%temp%.\setdir.bat'; \
+>  echo '@'; \
+>  echo '% do not delete this line %'; \
+>  echo '@ECHO off'; \
+>  echo 'PROMPT %promp'; \
+>  echo 'FOR %%c IN (CALL DEL) DO %%c %temp%.\setdir.bat'; \
+>  echo 'set cwd=%cd%'; \
+>  echo 'set libdir=%cd%\..\lib\gcl-2.5.0'; \
+>  echo 'set unixportdir=%libdir%\unixport'; \
+>  echo 'path %cd%\..\mingw\bin;%PATH%'; \
+>  echo "start %unixportdir%\saved_gcl.exe -dir %unixportdir% -libdir %libdir% -eval \"(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)\" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclm.bat ; fi
+> rm -f /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclfinal.bat
+> if gcc --version | grep -q -i mingw ; then (echo 'ECHO path %1\mingw\bin;%PATH% > gcli.bat'; \
+>  echo "ECHO start %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0\unixport\saved_gcl.exe -dir %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0\unixport -libdir %1\lib\gcl-2.5.0 -eval \"(setq si::*allow-gzipped-file* t)\" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9 >> gcli.bat" ) > /house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/bin/gclfinal.bat ; fi
+> make[4]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+> (cd xbin ; cp ../bin/gcl .)
+> cd cmpnew && make collectfn.o
+> make[4]: Entering directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/cmpnew'
+> ../unixport/saved_gcl ../unixport/ -compile collectfn.lsp
+> make[4]: ../unixport/saved_gcl: Command not found
+> make[4]: *** [collectfn.o] Error 127
+> make[4]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2/cmpnew'
+> make[3]: *** [cmpnew/collectfn.o] Error 2
+> make[3]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp/gcl-2.5.2'
+> cp: cannot stat `unixport/saved_gcl': No such file or directory
+> make[2]: *** [gcldir] Error 1
+> make[2]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom/lsp'
+> make[1]: *** [lspdir] Error 2
+> make[1]: Leaving directory `/house/timdaly/axiom'
+> make: *** [all] Error 2
+> bash-2.05a$ uname -a
+> uname -a
+> Linux spe156 2.4.18-mckinley-smp #1 SMP Thu Jul 11 12:51:02 MDT 2002 ia64 unknown
+> bash-2.05a$ exit
+> exit
+> exit
+> spe156> exit
+> exit
+> spe156> logout
+> Connection closed by foreign host.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+To: Tim Daly <axiom@tenkan.org>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 22:39:08 +0200
+Message-ID: <873cdjadub.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building from scratch
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello Tim,
+
+I tried to build Axiom from scratch (with gcl 2.6.1) on my powerpc
+machine and the build failed with following error message on
+INTERP.EXPOSED.
+
+make[3]: Entering directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/interp'
+make[3]: *** No rule to make target `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet', needed by `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/interp/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED'.  Stop.
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/interp'
+make[2]: *** [interpdir] Error 2
+
+I thought that INTERP.EXPOSED was gone[1]. Would the issue related to
+powerpc arch?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+[1] http://mail.nongnu.org/archive/html/axiom-developer/2003-10/msg00068.html
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <873cdjadub.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Thu, 23
+	Oct 2003 22:39:08 +0200)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building from
+	scratch
+References: <873cdjadub.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David,
+
+INTERP.EXPOSED is gone. Did you do a cvs update before the build?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building from 
+	scratch
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+
+Tim,
+
+I had the same problem as David when I downloaded the CVS to
+a virgin machine last week. There is still a reference to
+src/algebra/INTERP.EXPOSED in the src/interp/Makefile. I solved
+it (temporarily) by copying INTERP.EXPOSED.pamphlet into
+src/algebra from an earlier distribution.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 4:44 PM
+> To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+> Cc: axiom@tenkan.org; axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building
+> from scratch
+> 
+> 
+> David,
+> 
+> INTERP.EXPOSED is gone. Did you do a cvs update before the build?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 17:20:41 2003
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 17:18:45 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9B6@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building from 
+	scratch
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9B6@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, axiom@tenkan.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 21:20:37 -0000
+
+Bill, 
+
+I just tried:
+
+cd /tmp
+
+cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet
+
+cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet
+
+cd axiom/src/interp
+
+fgrep -i interp.exposed Makefile.pamphlet
+
+and find no reference. I'm confused.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 18:03:17 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Received: (from root@localhost)
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+	Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:02:32 -0400 (EDT)
+Received: from corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca (corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+	[131.136.1.77])
+	by fw.drenet.dnd.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h9NM2Var047712;
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building from 
+	scratch
+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:02:55 -0400
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19)
+Content-Type: text/plain;
+	charset="iso-8859-1"
+X-Info: scanned for viruses
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, axiom@tenkan.org
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 22:03:15 -0000
+
+Tim,
+
+You are right. It is gone. (but it was there last week...)
+<grin>
+
+BTW, thanks very much for your work on GCL 2.6.1!
+
+I have started work again on the Windows port. Until your
+update of the CVS, I was working with the Windows binary
+version of GCL 2.6.1. I have got as far as building
+interpsys, but I get a "memory may be damaged" error when
+it trys to compile the first spad file (AHYP.spad). Maybe
+this is due to the ad hoc way I tried to get around linking
+the cfuns-c external routines.
+
+Now I will start again, compile GCL 2.6.1 under MSYS and
+linking in the externals.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 5:19 PM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; david.mentre@wanadoo.fr; axiom@tenkan.org;
+> axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error on INTERP.EXPOSED when building
+> from scratch
+> 
+> 
+> Bill, 
+> 
+> I just tried:
+> 
+> cd /tmp
+> 
+> cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co 
+> axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet
+> 
+> cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co 
+> axiom/src/interp/Makefile.pamphlet
+> 
+> cd axiom/src/interp
+> 
+> fgrep -i interp.exposed Makefile.pamphlet
+> 
+> and find no reference. I'm confused.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 18:23:44 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:20:33 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom@tenkan.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: daly@idsi.net
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 22:22:14 -0000
+
+Bill,
+
+I believe that both you and David had a problem. 
+I probably uploaded a bad Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+Re: Windows GCL-2.6.1 
+I downloaded Camm's image but it won't run under Windows XP.
+
+If you get a chance could you jot down the steps you take to
+build GCL on Windows? I tried to get make to work but got nowhere.
+Windows XP make me so enfeebled that I can't seem to figure out
+how to get any of my tools working. I guess that's why the code
+name for this version was Kryptonite :-) I have both mingw and
+cygwin installed.
+
+Thanks.
+Supergirl.
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 18:48:13 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Message-ID: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BC@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 18:47:48 -0400
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19)
+Content-Type: text/plain;
+	charset="iso-8859-1"
+X-Info: scanned for viruses
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, axiom@tenkan.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 22:48:11 -0000
+
+Tim,
+
+Did you download?
+
+ 
+http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/gcl_2.6.1.mingw32_japi_xdr_
+20030929.zip
+
+Unzip it and run the install program. It installed and
+runs under Windows XP for me with no problems (although
+an earlier version did fail on the install unless you
+installed it into a directory named c:/lang).
+
+What kind of "won't run" did you get when you tried it?
+
+About Windows - just think of it like travelling to a
+foriegn country where no one speaks your language ...
+
+Details of building GCL from scratch under MSYS and notes
+on required patches to AXIOM to follow later (tonight if
+possible).
+
+Cheers,
+Bill.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 6:21 PM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; david.mentre@wanadoo.fr; axiom@tenkan.org;
+> axiom-developer@nongnu.org; camm@enhanced.com
+> Subject: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> I believe that both you and David had a problem. 
+> I probably uploaded a bad Makefile.pamphlet.
+> 
+> Re: Windows GCL-2.6.1 
+> I downloaded Camm's image but it won't run under Windows XP.
+> 
+> If you get a chance could you jot down the steps you take to
+> build GCL on Windows? I tried to get make to work but got nowhere.
+> Windows XP make me so enfeebled that I can't seem to figure out
+> how to get any of my tools working. I guess that's why the code
+> name for this version was Kryptonite :-) I have both mingw and
+> cygwin installed.
+> 
+> Thanks.
+> Supergirl.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 19:10:20 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1ACoax-0007LX-K4
+	for mharc-axiom-developer@gnu.org; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:10:19 -0400
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.24)
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+	id 1ACoaM-0007DF-Ik
+	for axiom-developer@nongnu.org; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:10:13 -0400
+Received: from [66.134.96.17] (helo=intech19.enhanced.com)
+	by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
+	id 1ACoaL-0007CZ-Vg; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:09:42 -0400
+Received: from camm by intech19.enhanced.com with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian))
+	id 1ACoXj-0002fx-00; Thu, 23 Oct 2003 19:06:59 -0400
+To: daly@idsi.net
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 23 Oct 2003 19:06:59 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
+Message-ID: <5465if4kq4.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 33
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org,
+	axiom@tenkan.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
+List-Archive: <http://mail.gnu.org/pipermail/axiom-developer>
+List-Post: <mailto:axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+List-Help: <mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=help>
+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 23:10:17 -0000
+
+Greetings!  Alas I'm equally enfeebled on Windows, and of course none
+of the deb binaries will run there.  But we have our staunch Mike
+Thomas to help you when needed.
+
+Take care, 
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Bill,
+> 
+> I believe that both you and David had a problem. 
+> I probably uploaded a bad Makefile.pamphlet.
+> 
+> Re: Windows GCL-2.6.1 
+> I downloaded Camm's image but it won't run under Windows XP.
+> 
+> If you get a chance could you jot down the steps you take to
+> build GCL on Windows? I tried to get make to work but got nowhere.
+> Windows XP make me so enfeebled that I can't seem to figure out
+> how to get any of my tools working. I guess that's why the code
+> name for this version was Kryptonite :-) I have both mingw and
+> cygwin installed.
+> 
+> Thanks.
+> Supergirl.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 21:29:27 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2003 21:29:05 -0400
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: "'camm@enhanced.com'" <camm@enhanced.com>,
+	"'axiom-developer@nongnu.org'" <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org, "'axiom@tenkan.org'" <axiom@tenkan.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Thursday, October 23, 2003 6:48 PM I wrote:
+> 
+> Did you download?
+> 
+>   
+> http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/gcl_2.6.1.min
+> gw32_japi_xdr_20030929.zip
+> 
+> Unzip it and run the install program. It installed and
+> runs under Windows XP for me with no problems (although
+> an earlier version did fail on the install unless you
+> installed it into a directory named c:/lang).
+> 
+
+I have just tried this and I see that the problem with the
+install directory still exists. When the install scripts
+asks where you want to install GCL, tell it
+
+  c:/lang/gcl261
+
+instead of the default, then the install will complete
+normally.
+
+I understood that Mike Thomas was going to upload a corrected
+version a couple of weeks ago but perhaps it has not yet made
+it to debian.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 23:28:31 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: 
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] ports
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+
+David,
+
+Thanks to HP's TestDrive program we have shown that Axiom 
+successfully builds and runs on the following systems:
+
+ Slackware Linux 8.0.01 on Intel
+ ProLiant ML530 2@800MHz
+ Linux spe160 2.4.20 #20 Mon Mar 17 22:55:24 PST 2003 i686 unknown
+
+
+ Red Hat Linux 8.0 on Intel 
+ ProLiant ML530 2@1.0GHz 
+ Red Hat Enterprise Linux ES release 2.1 (Panama)
+ Kernel 2.4.9-e.12smp on an i686
+ Linux spe141.testdrive.hp.com 2.4.9-e.12smp #1 SMP Tue Feb 11 02:24:10 EST 2003 i686 unknown
+
+Could you update the "ports" webpage?
+I've also saved the complete image of the build tree so we
+can create binary files for these distributions.
+
+
+More are on the way. 
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 23 23:53:38 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] GCL-2.5.2 build
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+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 03:53:35 -0000
+
+Camm,
+
+The version I'm porting to the various HP systems is GCL-2.5.2
+(mostly because I'm doing many things in parallel and 2.6.1
+is on a different thread of work). 
+
+I get warnings (not errors) of the form:
+
+cmpcall.c: In function `LnkTL124':
+cmpcall.c:1949: warning: dereferencing type-punned pointer will break strict-aliasing rules
+
+The message is output hundreds of times during the build for many files.
+It does not seem to affect the result but I'm passing it along anyway.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 02:32:44 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 02:32:24 -0400
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
+List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
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+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 06:32:42 -0000
+
+Tim,
+
+On Thursday, October 23, 2003 6:21 PM you asked
+> 
+> If you get a chance could you jot down the steps you take
+> to build GCL on Windows? I tried to get make to work but
+> got nowhere. Windows XP make me so enfeebled that I can't
+> seem to figure out how to get any of my tools working.
+> I guess that's why the code name for this version was
+> Kryptonite :-) I have both mingw and cygwin installed.
+> 
+
+Well, this will get you started with GCL. With these
+patches, the make at least starts the build of Axiom
+but fails because of Windows use of file names that contain
+a C:/xxx (GCL thinks this is a package name).  I've solved
+this by passing strings instead of symbols.
+
+So in the next message I will send you at least one more
+set of patches for this and also a patch to boot to handle
+the carriage return (char = 13) found in Windows text files.
+
+Detailed steps:
+
+1) Go to http://www.mingw.org/download.shtml and download
+
+  http://prdownloads.sf.net/mingw/MinGW-3.1.0-1.exe?download
+
+  http://prdownloads.sf.net/mingw/MSYS-1.0.9.exe?download
+
+  http://prdownloads.sf.net/mingw/msysDTK-1.0.1.exe?download
+
+  http://prdownloads.sf.net/mingw/gcc-core-3.3.1-20030804-1.tar.gz?download
+
+2) Install these files in the same order as above. I just
+accept the default locations. The last one should be extracted
+into c:/mingw and overwrites the older version of gcc. When you
+are done, you should be able to start MSYS and a get
+
+  $ gcc -v
+  gcc version 3.3.1 (mingw special 20030804-1)
+
+3) Copy the current Axiom CVS into you MSYS home directory.
+
+4) Now you need to apply the patches given below.
+
+5) Set the AXIOM environment variable
+
+  echo 'export AXIOM=`pwd -W`/mnt/windows' > .profile
+  . .profile
+
+6) And start your engines!
+
+  make clean
+  make
+
+Let me know how it goes. Don't be afraid to ask if some
+Windows silliness doesn't make sense to you.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+patch1.windows:
+---------------
+
+This patch modifies the main Axiom Makefile for Windows.
+You need to do this in order to "bootstrap" noweb. Note
+the use of the MSYS -W option on pwd. This produces a
+windows compatible path name.
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/Makefile axiom/Makefile
+--- axiom-save/Makefile	Fri Oct 24 00:48:05 2003
++++ axiom/Makefile	Thu Oct 23 19:41:02 2003
+@@ -1,4 +1,4 @@
+-SPD=$(shell pwd)
++SPD=$(shell pwd -W)
+ SYS=$(notdir $(AXIOM))
+ SPAD=${SPD}/mnt/${SYS}
+ LSP=${SPD}/lsp
+@@ -11,7 +11,7 @@
+ INT=${SPD}/int
+ OBJ=${SPD}/obj
+ MNT=${SPD}/mnt
+-ZIPS=${SPD}/zips
++ZIPS=${shell pwd}/zips
+ TMP=${OBJ}/tmp
+ SPADBIN=${MNT}/${SYS}/bin
+ INC=${SPD}/src/include
+@@ -49,6 +49,9 @@
+ 	cd ${OBJ}/noweb/src/c ; \
+ 	cp ${ZIPS}/noweb.modules.c.patch . ; \
+ 	patch <noweb.modules.c.patch ; \
++	cd ${OBJ}/noweb/src ; \
++	cp ${ZIPS}/noweb.src.Makefile.patch . ; \
++	patch <noweb.src.Makefile.patch ; \
+ 	cd ${OBJ}/noweb/src ; \
+ 	${MAKE} BIN=${MNT}/${SYS}/bin LIB=${MNT}/${SYS}/bin/lib \
+                 MAN=${MNT}/${SYS}/bin/man \
+
+This patch adds a windows section to the Makefile pamphlet
+file.
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/Makefile.pamphlet axiom/Makefile.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/Makefile.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:05 2003
++++ axiom/Makefile.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 19:45:08 2003
+@@ -1849,6 +1849,55 @@
+ <<clean>>
+ 
+ @
++
++\subsection{Makefile.windows}
++Annoyingly enough it seems that GCL uses a default extension of .lsp
++rather than .lisp so we add the {\bf LISP} variable here. We need to
++depend on the default extension behavior because the system build
++will load either the interpreted or compiled form of a file depending
++on which is available. This varies at different stages of the build.
++<<Makefile.windows>>=
++# System dependent Makefile for the Intel/Windows/MSYS platform
++# Platform variable
++PLF:=MSYSplatform
++# C compiler flags
++CCF:="-O2 -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE -D${PLF}
+-I/usr/X11/include"
++#CCF:=-g -fno-strength-reduce -Wall -D_GNU_SOURCE  -D${PLF}
+-I/usr/X11/include
++# Loader flags
++LDF:= -L/usr/X11R6/lib 
++# C compiler to use
++CC:=gcc 
++AWK=awk
++RANLIB=ranlib
++TOUCH=touch
++TAR=tar
++AXIOMXLROOT=${AXIOM}/compiler
++O=o
++BYE=bye
++LISP=lsp
++DAASE=${SRC}/share
++
++ENV=PLF=${PLF} CCF=${CCF} LDF=${LDF} CC=${CC} AWK=${AWK} RANLIB=${RANLIB} \
++    TOUCH=${TOUCH} TAR=${TAR} AXIOMXLROOT=${AXIOMXLROOT} O=${O} BYE=${BYE}
+\
++    LISP=${LISP} DAASE=${DAASE}
++
++all: rootdirs noweb srcsetup lspdir srcdir
++	@echo 45 Makefile.linux called
++	@echo 46 Environment : ${ENV} 
++	@echo 47 finished system build on `date` | tee >lastBuildDate
++
++<<rootdirs>>
++<<noweb.windows>>
++<<literate commands>>
++<<srcsetup>>
++<<src>>
++<<lsp>>
++<<document>>
++<<clean>>
++
++@
++
++
+ \eject
+ \begin{thebibliography}{99}
+ \bibitem{1} CMUCL {\bf http://www.cons.org/cmucl}
+
+
+This patch adds a patch to the lisp Makefile for mingw.defs
+similiar to to one of linux.defs (see below). It removes one
+of the windows incompatibe GCL ./configure options. It also
+avoids trying to link sockio-c since we are not able to compile
+it as it stands under windows. Perhaps it can be re-written
+for windows, but maybe a better solution would be to use GCL's
+built-in session stuff - help!
+
+Let's just cross our fingers and hope that this omission
+doesn't bit us too hard later in the build.
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet axiom/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:12 2003
++++ axiom/lsp/Makefile.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 01:13:10 2003
+@@ -20,7 +20,8 @@
+ This patch is to {\bf h/386-linux.defs} to include two 
+ global variables, {\bf EXTRAS} and {\bf EXTRA\_LIB}
+ \begin{verbatim}
+-EXTRAS = ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/cfuns-c.o ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/sockio-c.o
++EXTRAS = ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/cfuns-c.o
++# ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/sockio-c.o
+ EXTRA_LIB=${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/libspad.a
+ \end{verbatim}
+ The {\bf EXTRAS} variable is used to include two files into the
+@@ -45,6 +46,9 @@
+ 	@(cd ${GCLVERSION}/h ; \
+ 	  echo 3 applying EXTRAS patch to h/linux.defs ; \
+ 	  patch <${SPD}/zips/${GCLVERSION}.h.linux.defs.patch )
++	@(cd ${GCLVERSION}/h ; \
++	  echo 3a applying EXTRAS patch to h/mingw.defs ; \
++	  patch <${SPD}/zips/${GCLVERSION}.h.mingw.defs.patch )
+ 	@(echo 4 setup ini files for EXTRAS patch ; \
+ 	  touch ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/cfuns-c.ini ; \
+ 	  touch ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/sockio-c.ini )
+@@ -174,7 +178,7 @@
+ relocating object files.
+ <<gclConfigureMake>>=
+ 	@(cd ${GCLVERSION} ; \
+-	./configure --enable-vssize=65536*2 --enable-statsysbfd
+--enable-readline --enable-maxpage=128*1024 ; \
++	./configure --enable-vssize=65536*2 --enable-readline
+--enable-maxpage=128*1024 ; \
+ 	${ENV} ${MAKE} ; \
+ 	cp unixport/saved_gcl ${OUT}/lisp )
+ @
+
+
+This patch changes the lib Makefile to avoid compiling
+C code that doesn't work under Windows. Note also the 
+assing of the platform conditional define to gcc.
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/src/lib/Makefile.pamphlet axiom/src/lib/Makefile.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/src/lib/Makefile.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:35 2003
++++ axiom/src/lib/Makefile.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 23:15:58 2003
+@@ -102,9 +102,10 @@
+ 
+ AR=	${OUT}/bsdsignal.o  ${OUT}/cursor.o ${OUT}/edin.o     \
+         ${OUT}/fnct_key.o   ${OUT}/halloc.o ${OUT}/openpty.o  \
+-        ${OUT}/pixmap.o     ${OUT}/prt.o    ${OUT}/sockio-c.o \
+-        ${OUT}/spadcolors.o ${OUT}/util.o   ${OUT}/wct.o      \
+-        ${OUT}/XDither.o    ${OUT}/XShade.o ${OUT}/XSpadFill.o 
++        ${OUT}/pixmap.o     ${OUT}/prt.o     \
++        
++#	${OUT}/sockio-c.o ${OUT}/spadcolors.o ${OUT}/util.o ${OUT}/XDither.o
+${OUT}/XShade.o
++# ${OUT}/wct.o ${OUT}/XSpadFill.o 
+ 
+ OTHER=	${OUT}/cfuns-c.o
+ 
+@@ -130,7 +131,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/bsdsignal.o: ${MID}/bsdsignal.c
+ 	@echo 3 making ${OUT}/bsdsignal.o from ${MID}/bsdsignal.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/bsdsignal.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/bsdsignal.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -164,7 +165,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/cfuns-c.o: ${MID}/cfuns-c.c
+ 	@echo 6 making ${OUT}/cfuns-c.o from ${MID}/cfuns-c.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/cfuns-c.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/cfuns-c.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -193,7 +194,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/cursor.o: ${MID}/cursor.c
+ 	@echo 9 making ${OUT}/cursor.o from ${MID}/cursor.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/cursor.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/cursor.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -222,7 +223,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/edin.o: ${MID}/edin.c
+ 	@echo 12 making ${OUT}/edin.o from ${MID}/edin.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/edin.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/edin.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -251,7 +252,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/fnct_key.o: ${MID}/fnct_key.c
+ 	@echo 15 making ${OUT}/fnct_key.o from ${MID}/fnct_key.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/fnct_key.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/fnct_key.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -280,7 +281,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/halloc.o: ${MID}/halloc.c
+ 	@echo 18 making ${OUT}/halloc.o from ${MID}/halloc.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/halloc.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/halloc.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -309,7 +310,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/openpty.o: ${MID}/openpty.c
+ 	@echo 21 making ${OUT}/openpty.o from ${MID}/openpty.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/openpty.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/openpty.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -338,7 +339,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/pixmap.o: ${MID}/pixmap.c
+ 	@echo 24 making ${OUT}/pixmap.o from ${MID}/pixmap.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/pixmap.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/pixmap.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -367,7 +368,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/prt.o: ${MID}/prt.c
+ 	@echo 27 making ${OUT}/prt.o from ${MID}/prt.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/prt.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/prt.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -401,7 +402,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/sockio-c.o: ${MID}/sockio-c.c
+ 	@echo 30 making ${OUT}/sockio-c.o from ${MID}/sockio-c.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/sockio-c.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/sockio-c.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -430,7 +431,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/spadcolors.o: ${MID}/spadcolors.c
+ 	@echo 33 making ${OUT}/spadcolors.o from ${MID}/spadcolors.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/spadcolors.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/spadcolors.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -460,7 +461,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/util.o: ${MID}/util.c
+ 	@echo 36 making ${OUT}/util.o from ${MID}/util.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/util.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/util.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -489,7 +490,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/wct.o: ${MID}/wct.c
+ 	@echo 39 making ${OUT}/wct.o from ${MID}/wct.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/wct.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/wct.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -518,7 +519,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/XDither.o: ${MID}/XDither.c
+ 	@echo 42 making ${OUT}/XDither.o from ${MID}/XDither.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/XDither.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/XDither.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -547,7 +548,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/XShade.o: ${MID}/XShade.c
+ 	@echo 45 making ${OUT}/XShade.o from ${MID}/XShade.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/XShade.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/XShade.c )
+ 
+ @
+ 
+@@ -576,7 +577,7 @@
+ ${OUT}/XSpadFill.o: ${MID}/XSpadFill.c
+ 	@echo 48 making ${OUT}/XSpadFill.o from ${MID}/XSpadFill.c
+ 	@( cd ${OUT} ; \
+-	gcc -c -I${INC} ${MID}/XSpadFill.c )
++	gcc -c -D${PLF} -I${INC} ${MID}/XSpadFill.c )
+ 
+ @
+
+
+Here are some preliminary patches to the C code that
+we can compile under Windows.
+ 
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet axiom/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:35 2003
++++ axiom/src/lib/bsdsignal.c.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 20:13:46 2003
+@@ -44,6 +44,9 @@
+ SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE.
+ */
+ @
++\section{Windows}
++The signal function is not available under Windows.
++
+ <<*>>=
+ <<license>>
+ 
+@@ -64,6 +67,9 @@
+ bsdSignal(int sig,SignalHandlerFunc action,int restartSystemCall)
+ #endif
+ {
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++  return (SignalHandlerFunc) -1;
++#else
+   struct sigaction in,out;
+   in.sa_handler = action;
+   /* handler is reinstalled - calls are restarted if restartSystemCall */
+@@ -81,6 +87,7 @@
+   
+   return (sigaction(sig, &in, &out) ? (SignalHandlerFunc) -1 : 
+ 	  (SignalHandlerFunc) out.sa_handler);
++#endif
+ }
+ @
+ \eject
+
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet axiom/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:35 2003
++++ axiom/src/lib/cfuns-c.c.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 22:05:52 2003
+@@ -168,23 +168,29 @@
+             if (geteuid() == buf.st_uid) {
+                 return (2 * ((buf.st_mode & S_IWUSR) != 0));
+             }
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+             else if (getegid() == buf.st_gid) {
+                 return (2 * ((buf.st_mode & S_IWGRP) != 0));
+             }
+             else {
+                 return (2 * ((buf.st_mode & S_IWOTH) != 0));
+             }
++#endif
+         }
+     }
+     else if (geteuid() == buf.st_uid) {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IWUSR) != 0);
+     }
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     else if (getegid() == buf.st_gid) {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IWGRP) != 0);
+     }
+     else {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IWOTH) != 0);
+     }
++#endif
+ }
+ 
+ 
+@@ -206,12 +212,15 @@
+     else if (geteuid() == buf.st_uid) {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IREAD) != 0);
+     }
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     else if (getegid() == buf.st_gid) {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IRGRP) != 0);
+     }
+     else {
+         return ((buf.st_mode & S_IROTH) != 0);
+     }
++#endif
+ }
+ 
+ 
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet axiom/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:35 2003
++++ axiom/src/lib/fnct_key.c.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 20:42:02 2003
+@@ -44,9 +44,14 @@
+ SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE.
+ */
+ @
++\section{Windows}
++These functions are not implemented in Windows.
++
+ <<*>>=
+ <<license>>
+ 
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+ #include "useproto.h"
+ 
+ #include <unistd.h>
+@@ -83,7 +88,7 @@
+ static char *defaulteditor = "clefedit";
+ char editorfilename[100];
+ 
+-
++#endif
+ 
+ /*
+  * The following function environment variable clef editor. The command
+@@ -97,6 +102,8 @@
+ set_editor_key(void )
+ #endif
+ {
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     int pid;
+ 
+     sprintf(editorfilename, "/tmp/clef%d", pid = getpid());
+@@ -105,6 +112,7 @@
+         (function_key[12]).type = SPECIAL;
+         (function_key[12]).str = defaulteditor;
+     }
++#endif
+ }
+ 
+ 
+@@ -121,6 +129,8 @@
+     If found it gets the key bindings from within
+     *****/
+ {
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     char *HOME, path[1024], string[1024];
+     int key;
+     int fd;
+@@ -187,6 +197,7 @@
+      * Now set the editor function key
+      */
+     set_editor_key();
++#endif
+ }
+ 
+ 
+@@ -201,7 +212,8 @@
+ get_key(int fd,char * ty)
+ #endif
+ {
+-
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     /*
+      * Determines the key number being mapped, and whether it is immediate
+or
+      * delay. It reurns the key value, and modifies the parameter type
+@@ -221,6 +233,7 @@
+         }
+     }
+     else
++#endif
+         return 0;
+ }
+ 
+@@ -233,6 +246,9 @@
+ get_str(int fd,char * string)
+ #endif
+ {
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++    return 0;
++#else
+     /** Gets the key mapping being bound **/
+     char c;
+     int count = 0;
+@@ -249,6 +265,7 @@
+     }
+     *trace = '\0';
+     return count;
++#endif
+ }
+ 
+ void 
+@@ -270,6 +287,8 @@
+ handle_function_key(int key,int  chann)
+ #endif
+ {
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+     /** this procedure simply adds the string specified by the function key
+       to the buffer                                               ****/
+     int count, fd;
+@@ -391,7 +410,7 @@
+         break;
+     }
+     return;
+-
++#endif
+ }
+ @
+ \eject
+
+
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet axiom/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet
+--- axiom-save/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet	Fri Oct 24 00:48:35 2003
++++ axiom/src/lib/pixmap.c.pamphlet	Thu Oct 23 21:07:00 2003
+@@ -44,28 +44,30 @@
+ SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE.
+ */
+ @
++/section{Windows}
++The function pixmap are not available under Windows/MSYS.
++@
+ <<*>>=
+ <<license>>
+-
+ #include "useproto.h"
+-
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+ #include <X11/Xlib.h>
+ #include <X11/Xutil.h>
+ #include <X11/Xos.h>
+-#include <stdlib.h>
+-#include <stdio.h>
+ #include <netinet/in.h>
+-
+-#define yes 1
+-#define no  0
+-
+-
+-
+ #include "spadcolors.h"
+ 
+ #include "pixmap.H1"
+ #include "halloc.H1"
+ #include "spadcolors.H1"
++#endif
++#include <stdlib.h>
++#include <stdio.h>
++
++#define yes 1
++#define no  0
++
+ 
+ 
+ 
+@@ -303,9 +305,9 @@
+ 
+ #else /*OLD*/
+ 
+-
++#if defined(MSYSplatform)
++#else
+ #include "xpm.h"
+-
+ int
+ #ifdef _NO_PROTO
+ read_pixmap_file(display, screen, filename, xi, width, height)
+@@ -369,11 +371,11 @@
+   xi = XGetImage(dsp, wid, x, y, width, height, AllPlanes, ZPixmap);
+   if (xi==0) return ;
+   status=XpmWriteFileFromImage(dsp,fn,xi,0,0);
+-  
+ }
+ 
+ 
+ #endif
++#endif  
+ 
+
+Here is the mingw.defs patch that is referred to above. 
+ 
+diff -Naur -xint -x*.dvi -xgcl-2.6.1 -xCVS -xbin -xobj -xnoweb -xgcldir
+axiom-save/zips/gcl-2.6.1.h.mingw.defs.patch
+axiom/zips/gcl-2.6.1.h.mingw.defs.patch
+--- axiom-save/zips/gcl-2.6.1.h.mingw.defs.patch	Wed Dec 31 19:00:00
+1969
++++ axiom/zips/gcl-2.6.1.h.mingw.defs.patch	Fri Oct 24 00:11:42 2003
+@@ -0,0 +1,12 @@
++--- mingw.defs	Thu Oct 23 23:21:39 2003
+++++ mingw.defs-new	Thu Oct 23 23:26:46 2003
++@@ -5,7 +5,8 @@
++ #
++ 
++ SHELL        = sh
++-
+++EXTRAS = ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/cfuns-c.o
+++# ${OBJ}/${SYS}/lib/sockio-c.o
++ OFLAG	     = -O 
++ LIBS	    += -lwsock32
++ LIBC 	     =
+
+------------------------
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 04:59:03 2003
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+From: michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 10:55:07 +0200
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+X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c)
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 08:59:00 -0000
+
+Hello Bill,
+
+> > http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/gcl_2.6.1.min
+> > gw32_japi_xdr_20030929.zip
+> > 
+> > Unzip it and run the install program. It installed and
+> > runs under Windows XP for me with no problems (although
+> > an earlier version did fail on the install unless you
+> > installed it into a directory named c:/lang).
+> > 
+> 
+> I have just tried this and I see that the problem with the
+> install directory still exists. When the install scripts
+> asks where you want to install GCL, tell it
+> 
+>   c:/lang/gcl261
+> 
+> instead of the default, then the install will complete
+> normally.
+
+Yes you are right, the script that creates gcl.bat during the installation=
+ 
+seems to be broken? The only difference I saw between an installation in 
+c:\lang\gcl261 and another directory is that the c:\lang\gcl261\bin 
+directory contains 2 more files gcl.bat and gcl.pif. If for some reason 
+specific to Axiom you need to use gcl from another directory than 
+lang/gcl261, it seems that you can just move the whole directory 
+c:\lang\gcl261 to your new directory, and add the following file gcl.bat 
+in directory "NewDirectory\bin" (with the example directory  
+C:\programs\gcl-2.6.1):
+
+------------------- gcl.bat
+@echo off
+rem Define the main directory of gcl
+set W$=3Dc:\programs\gcl-2.6.1
+rem set C_INCLUDE_PATH=3D%W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\h
+path %W$%\mingw\bin;%PATH%
+start %W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\unixport\saved_gcl.exe -dir %W$%/lib/gcl-
+2.6.1/unixport/ -libdir %W$%/lib/gcl-2.6.1/ -eval "(setq si::*allow-
+gzipped-file* t)" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9
+------------------- End of gcl.bat
+
+This works for me on Windows 98SE, I suppose it would run too under any 
+version of Windows NT (4.0, 2000 or XP)
+
+It think one can comment the line with C_INCLUDE_PATH, at least as long as=
+ 
+gcl.bat just runs the executable for gcl. I don't think the env variable 
+for gcc compiler is of any use to run the executable? Or is it for some 
+reason I am unaware of ?.  Anyway, on Win98, gcl can be run without this 
+var being defined.
+
+Best wishes,
+
+Michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+http://www.univ-orleans.fr/EXT/ASTEX
+ftp://ftp.univ-orleans.fr/pub/tex/PC/AsTeX
+liste de discussion: astex@univ-orleans.fr
+Abonnement =E0 la liste: envoyer un message de contenu
+"sub astex Nom Prenom Etablissement" =E0 sympa@univ-orleans.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 07:37:49 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] GCL-2.5.2 build
+References: <200310240352.h9O3qcM16338@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 24 Oct 2003 07:30:30 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <200310240352.h9O3qcM16338@localhost.localdomain>
+Message-ID: <54wuaukh49.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 37
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 11:37:46 -0000
+
+Hi Tim!  Yes, this gcc-3.3 specific warning/default optimization
+setting was addressed in 2.5.4 and later.  As you note, the old code
+does not in fact appear to break with gcc-3.3, however.
+
+Take care,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> The version I'm porting to the various HP systems is GCL-2.5.2
+> (mostly because I'm doing many things in parallel and 2.6.1
+> is on a different thread of work). 
+> 
+> I get warnings (not errors) of the form:
+> 
+> cmpcall.c: In function `LnkTL124':
+> cmpcall.c:1949: warning: dereferencing type-punned pointer will break strict-aliasing rules
+> 
+> The message is output hundreds of times during the build for many files.
+> It does not seem to affect the result but I'm passing it along anyway.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] regression testing, macro table
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+
+*,
+
+I previously broke the util.ht file. Somehow I clipped out the
+stanza that walks into that subdirectory. That's been fixed.
+
+I put up an early-release version of regression testing.
+Basically it works as follows:
+
+* the final build completes
+* the input files are generated
+* a Makefile is generated in int/input
+* the Makefile is invoked which
+   - runs the input files
+   - saves the output
+
+If you look at the Makefile (the source is in src/input/Makefile.pamphlet
+under the <<regression tests>> chunk you can see that I've classified the
+working/failing input files by type of failure. That way we have a larger
+set of test cases for chasing a particular failure type.
+
+"Failing" means that it causes a lisp break. "Working" means it doesn't.
+
+Note that some of the "working" input files are still buggy for 2 reasons.
+First, the names of the types or operators have changed so the input file
+function fail to execute. Second, the input fails because it is supposed
+to fail. That is, the input file is demonstrating a bug or intentionally
+incorrect code. Failures can be found in the output by searching for
+"Daly bug" messages The name is a holdover from scratchpad and was in
+the NAG version. It is enabled by )set message test on. It exists so
+I can automate detecting failures.
+
+The regression testing is cheesy and limp but it is a start.
+The Computer Algebra Test Suite (CATS) effort will eventually 
+replace it.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 07:44:01 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 07:43:30 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] completion of algebra lattice
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+I just posted an update to the Axiom CVS that completes
+the algegra lattice. I added two new layers layer22 and
+layer23 for the last remaining uncompiled modules. There
+were also a few typos in module names etc. that I cleared
+up. Finally I also updated the daase files now that our
+lattice is complete.
+
+So at long last the version of Axiom in the CVS has the
+complete algebra. I tested it with some of the axiom
+commands in the tutorial that previously failed. Everything
+looks ok to me.
+
+Let me know if there are any problems.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: completion of algebra lattice
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+
+Excellent. I've downloaded it and I'll try it here.
+
+I just added regression testing and now we can see if the input
+files work with the new algebra. If you look in src/input/Makefile.pamphlet
+for the <<regression tests>> chunk you can see the input files that break
+with the new algebra. Adding the ${COMBF} variable to the all stanza
+should test all of those input files that break because COMBF was missing.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 08:33:15 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: 
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] ports
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+
+David,
+
+Axiom has been shown to build on:
+
+SuSE Linux Ent Svr 8.0 on Intel   
+ProLiant DL360 G2 2@1.4GHz
+
+I'll make the tgz of the executable available soon.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 13:03:32 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 13:00:30 -0400
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
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+
+Tim,
+
+The new complete algebra lattice seems to run all of
+the "regression tests" (including COMBF and the others)
+without lisp failures. The only test that might have a
+problem is
+
+  lextripk (12)
+
+which seems like it goes into an infinite loop (it is
+still running after 15 minutes) when it calls
+grobner$lextripack.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Friday, October 24, 2003 8:03 AM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: completion of algebra lattice
+> 
+> 
+> Excellent. I've downloaded it and I'll try it here.
+> 
+> I just added regression testing and now we can see if the
+> input files work with the new algebra. If you look in 
+> src/input/Makefile.pamphlet for the <<regression tests>>
+> chunk you can see the input files that break with the new
+> algebra. Adding the ${COMBF} variable to the all stanza
+> should test all of those input files that break because
+> COMBF was missing.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 13:15:13 2003
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+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 19:14:32 +0200
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom@tenkan.org, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello Tim,
+
+I had properly updated my CVS tree before doing the make.
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> I believe that both you and David had a problem. 
+> I probably uploaded a bad Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+I think I have understood: there are both interp/Makefile and
+interp/Makefile.pamphlet in the CVS, with the *same* date[1].
+
+In the Makefile, INTERP.EXPOSED is present[2]. 
+In the Makefile.pamphlet, INTERP.EXPOSED is gone.
+
+As the date are the same, Makefile is not rebuild from
+Makefile.pamphlet. Thus the wrong reference to INTERP.EXPOSED.
+
+ => Erasing src/interp/Makefile solve the issue.
+
+
+Conclusion: we should erase from CVS the following files:
+
+lsp/ccl/src/axbase/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/boot/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/caxbase/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/cclbase/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/cslbase/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/scripts/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/src/util/Makefile
+lsp/ccl/Makefile
+lsp/Makefile
+src/algebra/Makefile
+src/Makefile
+src/boot/Makefile
+src/doc/Makefile
+src/etc/Makefile
+src/include/Makefile
+src/input/Makefile
+src/interp/Makefile
+src/lib/Makefile
+src/scripts/Makefile
+src/share/Makefile
+
+(notice that I propose to keep the root Makefile*. We have already
+discussed that before)
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+[1] At least in my clean CVS tree. I don't know if this behavior is due
+    to CVS or due to my own use of CVS.
+
+[2] See http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/axiom/axiom/src/interp/Makefile?rev=1.3&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+References: <200310240327.h9O3RXd16311@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
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+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 19:18:45 +0200
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: ports
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Could you update the "ports" webpage?
+
+Done.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C1@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 19:29:08 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C1@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill Page's message of "Fri, 24 Oct 2003 13:00:30 -0400")
+Message-ID: <873cdi7dej.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+Hello Bill,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> The new complete algebra lattice seems to run all of
+> the "regression tests" (including COMBF and the others)
+> without lisp failures. 
+
+If you have time, you can close the corresponding bugs on savannah.
+
+Otherwise, you can give me a list of bug that might be closed and I'll
+double-check.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+PS : Many thanks for updating the algebra. The path is now open to our
+     first stable release.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 13:09:20 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310241709.h9OH9Kv24243@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] algebra completion
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+
+Bill, 
+
+I did a checkout and build. My build blows up during the algebra compiles
+at NODE1.spad. Does this compile for you?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 13:50:08 2003
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+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 13:09:59 -0400
+Message-Id: <200310241709.h9OH9xE24250@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] algebra completion
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+
+David,
+
+I agree about removing the non-root Makefiles.
+I'll do that tonight.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 14:18:56 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 14:18:40 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: algebra completion
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+
+Tim,
+
+That's odd. NODE1.o is in layer21. I did not
+change anything in layers21 and below.
+
+Yes, it compiled for me with no problem. I have
+a file called NODE1.o in mnt/linux/algebra.
+
+Usual questions: Did you start from zero?
+What linux flavor?
+What kind of "blows up"?
+
+Bill.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Tim Daly [mailto:daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu]
+> Sent: Friday, October 24, 2003 1:09 PM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: algebra completion
+> 
+> 
+> Bill, 
+> 
+> I did a checkout and build. My build blows up during
+> the algebra compiles at NODE1.spad. Does this compile
+> for you?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 14:21:45 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 14:21:32 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: algebra completion
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Friday, October 24, 2003 1:09 PM you wrote:
+> 
+> I did a checkout and build. My build blows up during
+> the algebra compiles at NODE1.spad. Does this compile
+> for you?
+
+Maybe it's a daase problem? Can you try reverting to the
+database files from the previous version?
+
+Bill.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 15:45:49 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 21:44:44 +0200
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+Cc: 
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Another failing build on EFUPXS: GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello,
+
+Sorry to bother you once again. It appears that my build fails once
+again on EFUPXS.spad (for latest Axiom CVS):
+
+0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.spad from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/algebra/efupxs.spad.pamphlet
+0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.spad
+
+(AXIOM Sockets) The AXIOM server number is undefined.
+[...]
+   Loading 
+      /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/ISTRING.o
+      for domain IndexedString 
+reloc for vs_overflow is overflowing
+ 
+   >> System error:
+   Cannot get relocated section contents
+
+
+protected-symbol-warn called with (NIL)
+(1) -> 0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/EFUPXS.o from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB
+cp: cannot stat `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB/code.o': No such file or directory
+make[3]: *** [/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/EFUPXS.o] Error 1
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/algebra'
+make[2]: *** [algebradir] Error 2
+
+
+Any idea on what can going wrong? Is the message "reloc for vs_overflow
+is overflowing" informs of an issue with gcl? I found such an error
+message in lsp/gcl-2.6.1/o/sfaslbdf.c.
+
+I'm building on Debian stable on PowerPC architecture.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 24 18:32:39 2003
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+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+References: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 24 Oct 2003 18:20:41 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Message-ID: <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 64
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Another failing build on EFUPXS:
+	GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Greetings!
+
+ppc relocs are 24bit by default, unless you compile with the
+-mlong-calls (or some such), first supported on ppc in gcc-3.3.  The
+configure script (at least on recent gcl, how recent I'm not sure),
+should detect gcc-3.3 if present and add this option automatically.
+Without it, loads on big images will lose.  Ran into this with the
+acl2 book verifications, which are now known to work with -mlong-call.
+
+Take care,
+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> Hello,
+> 
+> Sorry to bother you once again. It appears that my build fails once
+> again on EFUPXS.spad (for latest Axiom CVS):
+> 
+> 0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.spad from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/algebra/efupxs.spad.pamphlet
+> 0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.spad
+> 
+> (AXIOM Sockets) The AXIOM server number is undefined.
+> [...]
+>    Loading 
+>       /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/ISTRING.o
+>       for domain IndexedString 
+> reloc for vs_overflow is overflowing
+>  
+>    >> System error:
+>    Cannot get relocated section contents
+> 
+> 
+> protected-symbol-warn called with (NIL)
+> (1) -> 0 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/EFUPXS.o from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB
+> cp: cannot stat `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/int/algebra/EFUPXS.NRLIB/code.o': No such file or directory
+> make[3]: *** [/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/mnt/linux/algebra/EFUPXS.o] Error 1
+> make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-powerpc/axiom/src/algebra'
+> make[2]: *** [algebradir] Error 2
+> 
+> 
+> Any idea on what can going wrong? Is the message "reloc for vs_overflow
+> is overflowing" informs of an issue with gcl? I found such an error
+> message in lsp/gcl-2.6.1/o/sfaslbdf.c.
+> 
+> I'm building on Debian stable on PowerPC architecture.
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+> David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 03:05:35 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+To: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+References: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 09:04:47 +0200
+In-Reply-To: <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (Camm Maguire's message
+	of "24 Oct 2003 18:20:41 -0400")
+Message-ID: <87ekx1ztkg.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Another failing build on EFUPXS:
+	GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com> writes:
+
+> ppc relocs are 24bit by default, unless you compile with the
+> -mlong-calls (or some such), first supported on ppc in gcc-3.3.
+[...]
+> Without it, loads on big images will lose.  Ran into this with the
+
+Ouch! So if I read you correclty, you mean I can't compile Axiom on my
+Debian stable/gcc 2.95.4 powerpc machine? 
+
+A possible workaround: could I compile Axiom, statically linked, on a
+powerpc machine with gcc-3.3 and then execute it on my powerpc debian
+stable?
+
+Another possible workaround: would it work with gcl-2.5.2 on my debian
+stable (gcc 2.95.4)?
+
+
+While I'm asking questions on gcl, do I need to recompile everything
+from scratch if I switch gcl version used to compile Axiom (from
+gcl-2.5.2 -> gcl-2.6.1)?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 03:30:41 2003
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+To: gcl-devel@gnu.org
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 09:29:58 +0200
+Message-ID: <87ad7pzseh.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Which option to maximize architecture portability
+	on gcl-2.6.1
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Subscribe: <http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer>,
+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 07:30:38 -0000
+
+Hello Camm,
+
+I have yet another question on gcl-2.6.1. I noticed that my current
+gcl-2.6.1 on my Celeron machine is using the -march=pentiumpro gcc
+flag. 
+
+In the eventuality where I would like to compile a static version of
+Axiom portable on any usable x86 machine (pentium or greater), which
+option should I give to gcl configure to have something like -march=i586
+given to gcc?
+
+In other words, even if I compile Axiom with gcl-2.6.1 on latest Athlon
+or Pentium 4 machine, I would like to have a binary runnable on any x86
+machine (except maybe i486 and i386).
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 11:02:40 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <873cdi7dej.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Fri, 24
+	Oct 2003 19:29:08 +0200)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C1@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<873cdi7dej.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: daly@idsi.net, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Bill,
+
+I re-downloaded the CVS copy and did a build from scratch overnight.
+It appears that the system won't build from CVS at the moment.
+Try building from a clean CVS download and see if it works for you.
+If not I think we need to back out the changes until we figure it out.
+
+I was not able to complete the lattice because I ran into database problems.
+The new databases don't seem to be able to rebuild the system. 
+It looks like you tripped across the same bug. 
+
+I first found the database problem when I tried to use a newly built system
+complete the algebra. It turned out that the newly built system couldn't
+compile the older code. I suspect there has been a change to the database
+code and I'm looking into the problem.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 11:26:37 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	id 1ADQEv-0007UY-00; Sat, 25 Oct 2003 11:22:05 -0400
+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+References: <87ad7pzseh.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 25 Oct 2003 11:22:05 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <87ad7pzseh.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Message-ID: <54wuat2vhe.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 46
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2
+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Which option to maximize
+	architecture portability on gcl-2.6.1
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 15:26:35 -0000
+
+Greetings!  If memory serves, gcc doesn't (yet) emit ISA extension
+instructions with any flag setting.  If this is the case, what you
+have is fine.  To be safe, you can redefine the compiler::*cc*
+variable as desired (e.g. just omit any march setting).
+
+The stock Debian gcl does not have an march gcc flag setting.  If you
+build gcl yourself, and have a CFLAGS environment variable set, and
+march setting could be thus captured.
+
+Take care,
+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> Hello Camm,
+> 
+> I have yet another question on gcl-2.6.1. I noticed that my current
+> gcl-2.6.1 on my Celeron machine is using the -march=pentiumpro gcc
+> flag. 
+> 
+> In the eventuality where I would like to compile a static version of
+> Axiom portable on any usable x86 machine (pentium or greater), which
+> option should I give to gcl configure to have something like -march=i586
+> given to gcc?
+> 
+> In other words, even if I compile Axiom with gcl-2.6.1 on latest Athlon
+> or Pentium 4 machine, I would like to have a binary runnable on any x86
+> machine (except maybe i486 and i386).
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+>  david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 11:32:07 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	id 1ADQKg-0007Vx-00; Sat, 25 Oct 2003 11:28:02 -0400
+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Another failing build on
+	EFUPXS: GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+References: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<87ekx1ztkg.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 25 Oct 2003 11:28:02 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <87ekx1ztkg.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
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+
+Greetings!
+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com> writes:
+> 
+> > ppc relocs are 24bit by default, unless you compile with the
+> > -mlong-calls (or some such), first supported on ppc in gcc-3.3.
+> [...]
+> > Without it, loads on big images will lose.  Ran into this with the
+> 
+> Ouch! So if I read you correclty, you mean I can't compile Axiom on my
+> Debian stable/gcc 2.95.4 powerpc machine? 
+> 
+
+Most likely not.  On ppc, you'll be much happier with gcc-3.3.  You
+can apt-get -q -b source it, 'apt pin' it (probably the easiest), or
+set up an unstable debian chroot anvironment.
+
+> A possible workaround: could I compile Axiom, statically linked, on a
+> powerpc machine with gcc-3.3 and then execute it on my powerpc debian
+> stable?
+> 
+
+This will work as long as you don't compile any further modules on
+stable.  Make sure the compiler::*cc* variable has not hardcoded
+gcc-3.3. 
+
+> Another possible workaround: would it work with gcl-2.5.2 on my debian
+> stable (gcc 2.95.4)?
+> 
+
+This is not a gcl issue, but a gcc one.  I.e. the problem exists with
+all gcl on top of gcc < 3.3.
+
+> 
+> While I'm asking questions on gcl, do I need to recompile everything
+> from scratch if I switch gcl version used to compile Axiom (from
+> gcl-2.5.2 -> gcl-2.6.1)?
+> 
+
+Should not be necessary to recompile the axiom modules, but you will
+need to ensure that all the intermediary images are build atop the new
+gcl. 
+
+BTW, you know that there is a pre-built Debian axiom package for ppc
+(unstable)?  
+
+Take care,
+
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+>  david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+To: "Mike Thomas" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+References: <3F99050B.20466.61A811@localhost>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 25 Oct 2003 11:31:47 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <3F99050B.20466.61A811@localhost>
+Message-ID: <54oew52v18.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
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+Cc: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
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+
+Greetings!  Mike, do you have a moment to upload a binary without the
+path hard-coding? 
+
+Take care,
+
+michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr writes:
+
+> Hello Bill,
+> 
+> > > http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/gcl_2.6.1.min
+> > > gw32_japi_xdr_20030929.zip
+> > > 
+> > > Unzip it and run the install program. It installed and
+> > > runs under Windows XP for me with no problems (although
+> > > an earlier version did fail on the install unless you
+> > > installed it into a directory named c:/lang).
+> > > 
+> > 
+> > I have just tried this and I see that the problem with the
+> > install directory still exists. When the install scripts
+> > asks where you want to install GCL, tell it
+> > 
+> >   c:/lang/gcl261
+> > 
+> > instead of the default, then the install will complete
+> > normally.
+> 
+> Yes you are right, the script that creates gcl.bat during the installatio=
+n 
+> seems to be broken? The only difference I saw between an installation in=
+ 
+> c:\lang\gcl261 and another directory is that the c:\lang\gcl261\bin 
+> directory contains 2 more files gcl.bat and gcl.pif. If for some reason 
+> specific to Axiom you need to use gcl from another directory than 
+> lang/gcl261, it seems that you can just move the whole directory 
+> c:\lang\gcl261 to your new directory, and add the following file gcl.bat=
+ 
+> in directory "NewDirectory\bin" (with the example directory  
+> C:\programs\gcl-2.6.1):
+> 
+> ------------------- gcl.bat
+> @echo off
+> rem Define the main directory of gcl
+> set W$=3Dc:\programs\gcl-2.6.1
+> rem set C_INCLUDE_PATH=3D%W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\h
+> path %W$%\mingw\bin;%PATH%
+> start %W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\unixport\saved_gcl.exe -dir %W$%/lib/gcl-
+> 2.6.1/unixport/ -libdir %W$%/lib/gcl-2.6.1/ -eval "(setq si::*allow-
+> gzipped-file* t)" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9
+> ------------------- End of gcl.bat
+> 
+> This works for me on Windows 98SE, I suppose it would run too under any 
+> version of Windows NT (4.0, 2000 or XP)
+> 
+> It think one can comment the line with C_INCLUDE_PATH, at least as long a=
+s 
+> gcl.bat just runs the executable for gcl. I don't think the env variable=
+ 
+> for gcc compiler is of any use to run the executable? Or is it for some 
+> reason I am unaware of ?.  Anyway, on Win98, gcl can be run without this=
+ 
+> var being defined.
+> 
+> Best wishes,
+> 
+> Michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+> http://www.univ-orleans.fr/EXT/ASTEX
+> ftp://ftp.univ-orleans.fr/pub/tex/PC/AsTeX
+> liste de discussion: astex@univ-orleans.fr
+> Abonnement =E0 la liste: envoyer un message de contenu
+> "sub astex Nom Prenom Etablissement" =E0 sympa@univ-orleans.fr
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+To: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87k76u7e2v.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 25 Oct 2003 12:37:45 -0400
+In-Reply-To: <87k76u7e2v.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom@tenkan.org, Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, daly@idsi.net,
+	axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Greetings!  BTW, there are several other files I had to add manually
+to the clean target of debian/rules in the Debian package to make sure
+that a clean,build,clean cycle returns to the same point:
+
+	rm -f lsp/Makefile.dvi src/algebra/Makefile.dvi src/input/Makefile.dvi obj/noweb/contrib/kostas/Makefile obj/noweb/src/c/notangle.o obj/noweb/src/c/getline.o obj/noweb/src/c/match.o obj/noweb/src/c/modules.o obj/noweb/src/c/modtrees.o obj/noweb/src/c/strsave.o obj/noweb/src/c/main.o obj/noweb/src/c/errors.o obj/noweb/src/c/columns.o obj/noweb/src/c/nt obj/noweb/src/c/markmain.o obj/noweb/src/c/markup.o obj/noweb/src/c/markup obj/noweb/src/c/mnt.o obj/noweb/src/c/mnt obj/noweb/src/c/finduses.o obj/noweb/src/c/recognize.o obj/noweb/src/c/finduses mnt/bin/lib/nt mnt/bin/lib/markup mnt/bin/lib/mnt mnt/bin/lib/finduses mnt/bin/Makefile.dvi  Makefile.dvi src/Makefile.dvi src/interp/Makefile.dvi src/doc/Makefile.dvi
+
+There are also several scripts intalled by default under mnt/linux,
+(several of which I'm guessing are an oversight at present), but
+which, if shipped, need to be executable (for Debian policy at least:)
+
+	cd debian/axiom && chmod -x ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/lib/nwmtime ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/tex/axiom.sty ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/axiom.sty ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/tail ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/htmltoc ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/Makefile ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/boxup ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/Makefile.pamphlet ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/head ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/bin/showdvi ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/topics.data ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/doc/msgs/s2-us.msgs ./usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/gloss.text
+
+
+There also are (or were) CVS directories installed which had to be
+removed by hand.
+
+Very minor issues, so don't anyone spend too many brain cycles here!
+
+Take care,
+
+
+
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> writes:
+
+> Hello Tim,
+> 
+> I had properly updated my CVS tree before doing the make.
+> 
+> root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+> 
+> > I believe that both you and David had a problem. 
+> > I probably uploaded a bad Makefile.pamphlet.
+> 
+> I think I have understood: there are both interp/Makefile and
+> interp/Makefile.pamphlet in the CVS, with the *same* date[1].
+> 
+> In the Makefile, INTERP.EXPOSED is present[2]. 
+> In the Makefile.pamphlet, INTERP.EXPOSED is gone.
+> 
+> As the date are the same, Makefile is not rebuild from
+> Makefile.pamphlet. Thus the wrong reference to INTERP.EXPOSED.
+> 
+>  => Erasing src/interp/Makefile solve the issue.
+> 
+> 
+> Conclusion: we should erase from CVS the following files:
+> 
+> lsp/ccl/src/axbase/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/boot/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/caxbase/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/cclbase/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/cslbase/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/scripts/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/src/util/Makefile
+> lsp/ccl/Makefile
+> lsp/Makefile
+> src/algebra/Makefile
+> src/Makefile
+> src/boot/Makefile
+> src/doc/Makefile
+> src/etc/Makefile
+> src/include/Makefile
+> src/input/Makefile
+> src/interp/Makefile
+> src/lib/Makefile
+> src/scripts/Makefile
+> src/share/Makefile
+> 
+> (notice that I propose to keep the root Makefile*. We have already
+> discussed that before)
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> 
+> [1] At least in my clean CVS tree. I don't know if this behavior is due
+>     to CVS or due to my own use of CVS.
+> 
+> [2] See http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/axiom/axiom/src/interp/Makefile?rev=1.3&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
+> -- 
+> David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+	Sat, 25 Oct 2003 12:42:01 -0400
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 12:42:04 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
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+
+Tim,
+
+On Saturday, October 25, 2003 10:58 AM you wrote:
+> 
+> I re-downloaded the CVS copy and did a build from scratch 
+> overnight. It appears that the system won't build from CVS at 
+> the moment. Try building from a clean CVS download and see if 
+> it works for you. If not I think we need to back out the 
+> changes until we figure it out.
+
+Ok, I am in the process of trying it again now on a different
+machine. I built the whole algebra just fine on my RedHat 8.0
+system with gcc 3.2-7, but using Juergen's databases files of
+course.
+
+> 
+> I was not able to complete the lattice because I ran into 
+> database problems. The new databases don't seem to be able to 
+> rebuild the system. It looks like you tripped across the same
+> bug. 
+
+I did notice that the new database files that I built were
+slightly different in size than Juergen's (some a little
+bigger and some a little smaller). I wonder how Juergen built
+those database files. Right now it seems that they are the
+only ones that work ...
+
+> 
+> I first found the database problem when I tried to use a 
+> newly built system complete the algebra. It turned out
+> that the newly built system couldn't compile the older code.
+> I suspect there has been a change to the database code and
+> I'm looking into the problem.
+
+But Juergen somehow managed to do it, right? Because the
+ones that we started with (before I added Juergen's database
+files to the CVS in September) also did not work. But I
+think he claimed to have built the ones that do work using
+that system. Or was there some other magic involved?
+
+So I guess I am going to have to learn something about the
+database files. As you look into this problem, if you feel
+like discussing it, I'm all ears.
+
+Anyway, I will let you know if I can build the new system
+on my RedHat 9.0 system. (It's faster, it only takes about
+3 hours to complete.) And if it fails like yours then I
+will back out the CVS back to Juergen's database files.
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
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+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 19:09:39 +0200
+Message-ID: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC046C6473@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+Thread-Topic: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+Thread-Index: AcObFzxditfZQPatSn2nwCsvvJuafQAAwing
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>, <daly@idsi.net>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Oct 2003 17:09:39.0972 (UTC)
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+
+I think I build the database on cmu cl. Difference in
+size is probably due to not including hypertex references
+into the database files. That should not make any
+difference to the current problems. Besides that, no
+``magic'' was involved.
+
+Regards
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Bill Page [mailto:bill.page1@sympatico.ca] 
+> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2003 6:42 PM
+> To: daly@idsi.net
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+> 
+> 
+> Tim,
+> 
+> On Saturday, October 25, 2003 10:58 AM you wrote:
+> > 
+> > I re-downloaded the CVS copy and did a build from scratch 
+> > overnight. It appears that the system won't build from CVS at 
+> > the moment. Try building from a clean CVS download and see if 
+> > it works for you. If not I think we need to back out the 
+> > changes until we figure it out.
+> 
+> Ok, I am in the process of trying it again now on a different
+> machine. I built the whole algebra just fine on my RedHat 8.0
+> system with gcc 3.2-7, but using Juergen's databases files of
+> course.
+> 
+> > 
+> > I was not able to complete the lattice because I ran into 
+> > database problems. The new databases don't seem to be able to 
+> > rebuild the system. It looks like you tripped across the same
+> > bug. 
+> 
+> I did notice that the new database files that I built were
+> slightly different in size than Juergen's (some a little
+> bigger and some a little smaller). I wonder how Juergen built
+> those database files. Right now it seems that they are the
+> only ones that work ...
+> 
+> > 
+> > I first found the database problem when I tried to use a 
+> > newly built system complete the algebra. It turned out
+> > that the newly built system couldn't compile the older code.
+> > I suspect there has been a change to the database code and
+> > I'm looking into the problem.
+> 
+> But Juergen somehow managed to do it, right? Because the
+> ones that we started with (before I added Juergen's database
+> files to the CVS in September) also did not work. But I
+> think he claimed to have built the ones that do work using
+> that system. Or was there some other magic involved?
+> 
+> So I guess I am going to have to learn something about the
+> database files. As you look into this problem, if you feel
+> like discussing it, I'm all ears.
+> 
+> Anyway, I will let you know if I can build the new system
+> on my RedHat 9.0 system. (It's faster, it only takes about
+> 3 hours to complete.) And if it fails like yours then I
+> will back out the CVS back to Juergen's database files.
+> 
+> Regards,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 14:26:24 2003
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+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 14:25:17 -0400
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54smlhqnmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 25 Oct 2003 12:37:45 -0400)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
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+Cc: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, daly@idsi.net, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	axiom@tenkan.org
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+
+Your list:
+
+These are gone:
+
+lsp/Makefile.dvi 
+src/algebra/Makefile.dvi 
+src/input/Makefile.dvi 
+src/Makefile.dvi 
+src/interp/Makefile.dvi 
+src/doc/Makefile.dvi
+
+These should never be in the "distribution" which should only contain 
+files in the mnt directory. The obj and int directories can be deleted
+at any time. They are only caches.
+
+obj/noweb/contrib/kostas/Makefile 
+obj/noweb/src/c/notangle.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/getline.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/match.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/modules.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/modtrees.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/strsave.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/main.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/errors.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/columns.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/nt 
+obj/noweb/src/c/markmain.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/markup.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/markup 
+obj/noweb/src/c/mnt.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/mnt 
+obj/noweb/src/c/finduses.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/recognize.o 
+obj/noweb/src/c/finduses 
+
+These are used by noweb. In particular, the document command will
+invoke nt and markup. 
+
+mnt/bin/lib/nt 
+mnt/bin/lib/markup 
+mnt/bin/lib/mnt 
+mnt/bin/lib/finduses 
+
+I'll look into these. There shouldn't be Makefiles in mnt.
+
+mnt/bin/Makefile.dvi 
+
+This should remain. It is the primary documentation root and
+needs to be available to users before the build. It is essentially
+the top level "README" 
+
+Makefile.dvi 
+
+I'm confused. You siad: "need to be executable" but you wrote: "chmod -x"
+which will remove the execution bit.
+
+This part of noweb and is an internal command
+./mnt/linux/bin/lib/nwmtime 
+
+These are TeX macros not user commands and can't be executed.
+
+./mnt/linux/bin/tex/axiom.sty 
+./mnt/linux/bin/axiom.sty 
+
+These are the components of the boxup command which works as follows:
+
+boxup foo
+
+rename foo to foo.org
+concatenate head, foo, and tail (in that order) into foo.pamphlet,
+run notangle to extract foo from foo.pamphlet,
+diff foo and foo.org to ensure that 
+
+./mnt/linux/bin/boxup 
+./mnt/linux/bin/head
+./mnt/linux/bin/tail 
+
+These will go away:
+
+./mnt/linux/bin/Makefile 
+./mnt/linux/bin/Makefile.pamphlet 
+
+These are Axiom internal data files, not scripts
+
+./mnt/linux/algebra/topics.data 
+./mnt/linux/doc/msgs/s2-us.msgs 
+./mnt/linux/algebra/gloss.text
+
+
+I have no idea what this does:
+./mnt/linux/bin/htmltoc 
+
+This was a feeble attempt at document support. Texmacs and ADVI
+extensions will eventually do better.
+
+./mnt/linux/bin/showdvi 
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 15:02:27 2003
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+Message-ID: <002a01c39b2a$70c20100$0201a8c0@direcpc.com>
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC046C6473@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 15:01:41 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Juergen,
+
+Just so that I am clear, could you please confirm again that you
+did *not* create the database files using the GCL version of
+Axiom?
+
+For Axiom do you currently use GCL or do you use CMU CL?
+
+Tim, is CMU CL an intended target lisp for Axiom? If so, then
+perhaps we should also be actively using both lisps with Axiom -
+especially if there are some things that CMU CL can do that
+GCL can't.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page
+
+----- Original Message ----- 
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>; <daly@idsi.net>
+Cc: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2003 1:09 PM
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+
+
+I think I build the database on cmu cl. Difference in
+size is probably due to not including hypertex references
+into the database files. That should not make any
+difference to the current problems. Besides that, no
+``magic'' was involved.
+
+Regards
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 15:51:03 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+In-reply-to: <002a01c39b2a$70c20100$0201a8c0@direcpc.com>
+	(bill.page1@sympatico.ca)
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: completion of algebra lattice
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+CMUCL is an intended target lisp for Axiom. Indeed, the previous
+CVS at tenkan had the CMU files available.
+
+If CMUCL can build correct databases and GCL can't then it indicates
+that the problem is in the underlying common lisp. We can test if
+this is true by generating a database from the same set of NRLIBs
+using CMUCL and GCL and then comparing individual entries.
+
+If the problem is not in the common lisp but is due to axiom code
+then the databases should be broken in similar ways.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 20:18:03 2003
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+From: "Mike Thomas" <mike.thomas@brisbane.paradigmgeo.com>
+To: "Camm Maguire" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 10:19:43 +1000
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+Cc: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
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+
+Hi all.
+
+| Greetings!  Mike, do you have a moment to upload a binary without the
+| path hard-coding?
+
+If I can't get it done tonight (Sunday, unlikely) then not until Friday a=
+t
+the very earliest I'm sorry as I'll be out of town and without a computer
+for the coming week and away from computers most of today.
+
+Cheers
+
+Mike Thomas
+
+
+|
+| Take care,
+|
+| michel.lavaud@univ-orleans.fr writes:
+|
+| > Hello Bill,
+| >
+| > > > http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl/stable-binary/gcl_2.6.1.min
+| > > > gw32_japi_xdr_20030929.zip
+| > > >
+| > > > Unzip it and run the install program. It installed and
+| > > > runs under Windows XP for me with no problems (although
+| > > > an earlier version did fail on the install unless you
+| > > > installed it into a directory named c:/lang).
+| > > >
+| > >
+| > > I have just tried this and I see that the problem with the
+| > > install directory still exists. When the install scripts
+| > > asks where you want to install GCL, tell it
+| > >
+| > >   c:/lang/gcl261
+| > >
+| > > instead of the default, then the install will complete
+| > > normally.
+| >
+| > Yes you are right, the script that creates gcl.bat during the
+| installation
+| > seems to be broken? The only difference I saw between an
+| installation in
+| > c:\lang\gcl261 and another directory is that the c:\lang\gcl261\bin
+| > directory contains 2 more files gcl.bat and gcl.pif. If for some reas=
+on
+| > specific to Axiom you need to use gcl from another directory than
+| > lang/gcl261, it seems that you can just move the whole directory
+| > c:\lang\gcl261 to your new directory, and add the following
+| file gcl.bat
+| > in directory "NewDirectory\bin" (with the example directory
+| > C:\programs\gcl-2.6.1):
+| >
+| > ------------------- gcl.bat
+| > @echo off
+| > rem Define the main directory of gcl
+| > set W$=3Dc:\programs\gcl-2.6.1
+| > rem set C_INCLUDE_PATH=3D%W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\h
+| > path %W$%\mingw\bin;%PATH%
+| > start %W$%\lib\gcl-2.6.1\unixport\saved_gcl.exe -dir %W$%/lib/gcl-
+| > 2.6.1/unixport/ -libdir %W$%/lib/gcl-2.6.1/ -eval "(setq si::*allow-
+| > gzipped-file* t)" %1 %2 %3 %4 %5 %6 %7 %8 %9
+| > ------------------- End of gcl.bat
+| >
+| > This works for me on Windows 98SE, I suppose it would run too under a=
+ny
+| > version of Windows NT (4.0, 2000 or XP)
+| >
+| > It think one can comment the line with C_INCLUDE_PATH, at least
+| as long as
+| > gcl.bat just runs the executable for gcl. I don't think the env
+| variable
+| > for gcc compiler is of any use to run the executable? Or is it for so=
+me
+| > reason I am unaware of ?.  Anyway, on Win98, gcl can be run
+| without this
+| > var being defined.
+| >
+| > Best wishes,
+| >
+| > Michel.Lavaud@univ-orleans.fr
+| > http://www.univ-orleans.fr/EXT/ASTEX
+| > ftp://ftp.univ-orleans.fr/pub/tex/PC/AsTeX
+| > liste de discussion: astex@univ-orleans.fr
+| > Abonnement =E0 la liste: envoyer un message de contenu
+| > "sub astex Nom Prenom Etablissement" =E0 sympa@univ-orleans.fr
+| >
+| >
+| > _______________________________________________
+| > Axiom-developer mailing list
+| > Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+| > http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+| >
+| >
+| >
+|
+| --
+| Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+| =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
+| "The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'l=
+lah
+|
+|
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 20:49:24 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Thread-Topic: completion of algebra lattice
+Thread-Index: AcObKnkK7gbdXuMwSN2VR8hbJoRVvgAL53vQ
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Oct 2003 00:48:41.0254 (UTC)
+	FILETIME=[E678BC60:01C39B5A]
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+The database files that I posted on my website are
+build with a CMU CL version. I got GCL working
+on FreeBSD only lately. I compiled all the algebra
+files on GCL Axiom with the CMU database and rebuild
+a database on GCL. But I probably never tried to
+use that database to compile all algebra files.
+So I'm not sure if that would have been possible.
+
+Juergen
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Bill Page [mailto:bill.page1@sympatico.ca] 
+> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2003 9:02 PM
+> To: Weiss, Juergen
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: RE: completion of algebra lattice
+> 
+> 
+> Juergen,
+> 
+> Just so that I am clear, could you please confirm again that you
+> did *not* create the database files using the GCL version of
+> Axiom?
+> 
+> For Axiom do you currently use GCL or do you use CMU CL?
+> 
+> Tim, is CMU CL an intended target lisp for Axiom? If so, then
+> perhaps we should also be actively using both lisps with Axiom -
+> especially if there are some things that CMU CL can do that
+> GCL can't.
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page
+> 
+> ----- Original Message ----- 
+> From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+> To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>; <daly@idsi.net>
+> Cc: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2003 1:09 PM
+> Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+> 
+> 
+> I think I build the database on cmu cl. Difference in
+> size is probably due to not including hypertex references
+> into the database files. That should not make any
+> difference to the current problems. Besides that, no
+> ``magic'' was involved.
+> 
+> Regards
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 25 21:24:58 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 21:24:22 -0400
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] rebuilding the database
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+
+Tim,
+
+I have a question about the proper procedure for
+rebuilding the AXIOM database.
+
+In the current src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet there are
+two stanza's with targe db: One is in some "old code"
+chuck named <<original Makefile>> which I guess is no
+longer used.
+
+db: ${CENTER}
+        @ echo rebuilding databases...
+        @ cp -p ${SRC}/doc/gloss.text ${LIB}
+        @ cp -p ${SRC}/doc/topics.data ${MID}
+        @ echo rebuilding daase files
+        @ (cd ${MID} ; \
+           echo ')set out le 200' >/tmp/tmp.input ; \
+           echo ')fin' >>/tmp/tmp.input ; \
+           echo '(make-databases "" (QUOTE ("unix")))' >>/tmp/tmp.input
+; \
+           echo '(bye)' >>/tmp/tmp.input ; \
+           cat /tmp/tmp.input | ${INTERPSYS} ; \
+           rm -f /tmp/tmp.input )
+        @ echo If all went well, go-ahead Mike and do a db-install as
+well !
+
+The other is the apparently new code which does get
+executed
+
+db:
+        @ echo rebuilding databases...
+        @ cp ${SRC}/doc/gloss.text ${MID}
+        @ cp ${SRC}/doc/gloss.text ${OUT}
+        @ cp ${SRC}/doc/topics.data ${MID}
+        @ cp ${SRC}/doc/topics.data ${OUT}
+        @ (cd ${MID} ; echo ')lisp (make-databases "" nil)' |
+${INTERPSYS} )
+        @ cp ${MID}/*.daase ${OUT}
+
+--------
+
+1) Are the differences in the make-databases options
+  significant?
+
+2) The new version of db: puts just the *.daase files
+  into the mnt directory ${OUT}, but this is not (at least
+  not usually, I think) where AXIOM looks for the databases
+  files. I guess we are missing the install/promote steps
+  in the new Makefile.
+
+  When I tried to update the database yesterday, what I
+  did was just to copy these .daase files from ${OUT} into
+  src/share/algebra. Is that correct? I wondering if the
+  database files now in the CVS are complete and self
+  consistent.
+
+3) The original makefile has the stanza
+
+db-install:
+#
+#  Now move everything to int/lib/unix
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/compress.daase to ${CENTER}/
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/compress.daase ${CENTER}/
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/interp.daase to ${CENTER}/
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/interp.daase ${CENTER}/
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/browse.daase to ${CENTER}/
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/browse.daase ${CENTER}/
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/category.daase to ${CENTER}/
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/category.daase ${CENTER}/
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/operation.daase to ${CENTER}/
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/operation.daase ${CENTER}/
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/USERS.DAASE to ${CENTER}
+        @ rm -rf ${CENTER}/USERS.DAASE
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/USERS.DAASE ${CENTER}
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/DEPENDENTS.DAASE to ${CENTER}
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/DEPENDENTS.DAASE ${CENTER}
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/libdb.text to ${CENTER}
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/libdb.text ${CENTER}
+#
+        @ echo moving ${MID}/unix/comdb.text to ${CENTER}
+        @ mv ${MID}/unix/comdb.text ${CENTER}
+#
+        @ echo Now you need to promote the databases \(make
+PART=dbpromote\)
+        @ echo Then remake and promote the *.img files
+#       @ echo rebuilding interpsys with the new database
+#       @ touch ${OBJ}/${SYS}/interp/database.date
+#       @ (cd ${SPD} ; ${MAKE} PART=interp)
+
+----------
+
+4) I notice that not only are the .daase files installed
+but also the directories USERS.DAASE and DEPENDENTS.DAASE.
+Since your new db: stanze did not copy these to ${OUT},
+I did not copy them to share/algebra when. Are they needed?
+
+5) Are any of the other non *.daase files needed? E.g.
+the .text files?
+
+6) There does not seem to be any "promote" stanza in
+either the old or new make files but I notice that there
+is a final step to re-build interpsys with the new
+database. Is this necessary or just an optional check?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 04:45:41 2003
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+To: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Another failing build on
+	EFUPXS: GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+References: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<87ekx1ztkg.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54smlh2v7h.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 10:45:02 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <54smlh2v7h.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (Camm Maguire's message
+	of "25 Oct 2003 11:28:02 -0400")
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+
+Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com> writes:
+
+> BTW, you know that there is a pre-built Debian axiom package for ppc
+> (unstable)?  
+
+Yes, I know. But I do not consider myself a debian developer. I'm much a
+bare bone debian user.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: completion of algebra lattice
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C1@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<873cdi7dej.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 10:54:04 +0100
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+	bill.page1@sympatico.ca
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+
+Hello Tim, Bill and Juergen,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> I re-downloaded the CVS copy and did a build from scratch overnight.
+> It appears that the system won't build from CVS at the moment.
+
+Just for the record, my build from scratch, latest CVS, also failed on
+NODE1.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] Another failing build on
+	EFUPXS: GCL 2.6.1 issue??
+References: <87ptgm5sk3.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54r8121dmu.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<87ekx1ztkg.fsf@wanadoo.fr> <54smlh2v7h.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 11:32:47 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <54smlh2v7h.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (Camm Maguire's message
+	of "25 Oct 2003 11:28:02 -0400")
+Message-ID: <877k2sffw0.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+Tim,
+
+Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com> writes:
+
+>> Ouch! So if I read you correclty, you mean I can't compile Axiom on my
+>> Debian stable/gcc 2.95.4 powerpc machine? 
+>> 
+>
+> Most likely not.  On ppc, you'll be much happier with gcc-3.3.  
+
+I have updated web page explaining why Axiom won't build on Debian 3.0
+(stable) on powerpc arch.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+ david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 07:04:35 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: WZocher@t-online.de (Wolfgang Zocher)
+Date: 26 Oct 2003 13:58:32 +0100
+Message-ID: <m3u15wcg07.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de>
+Lines: 52
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Error with Axiom.CVS & gcl-2.6.1
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 12:04:33 -0000
+
+Hi all,
+
+when I tried to build axiom from scratch last night I got the errors listed
+below. Is this kind of error symptomatic for the new release of gcl? Has
+anyone tried to compile with gcl-2.7.x (CVS)? 
+
+Here is the interesting part of the log-file:
+
+   compiling local solveBernoulli : (Record(coef1: F,coefn: F,exponent: NonNegativeInteger),BasicOperator,Symbol,F) -> Union(F,failed)
+   Semantic Errors:
+      [1]  ElementaryFunctionODESolver is not a known type
+
+   Warnings:
+      [1] solve: not known that (OrderedSet) is of mode (CATEGORY package (SIGNATURE solve ((Union F failed) F F (BasicOperator) (Symbol))))
+      [2] checkBernoulli: not known that (Ring) is of mode (CATEGORY package (SIGNATURE solve ((Union F failed) F F (BasicOperator) (Symbol))))
+
+****** comp fails at level 4 with expression: ******
+error in function solveBernoulli
+
+(SEQ (LET |n1| (- 1 (|::| (|rec| |exponent|) (|Integer|))))
+     (LET |deq|
+       (+ (+ (|differentiate| |yx| |x|)
+             (* (* |n1| (|rec| |coef1|)) |yx|))
+          (* |n1| (|rec| |coefn|))))
+     (LET |sol|
+       (|::| | << | (|solve| |deq| |y| |x|) | >> |
+             (|Record| (|:| |particular| F) (|:| |basis| (|List| F)))))
+     (|exit| 1
+             (/ (- (** |yx| |n1|) (|sol| |particular|))
+                (|first| (|sol| |basis|)))))
+****** level 4  ******
+$x:= (solve deq y x)
+$m:= $EmptyMode
+$f:=
+((((|deq| #) (|n1| #) (|exponent| #) (|coefn| #) ...)))
+
+   >> Apparent user error:
+   no modemap for solve with 3 arguments
+
+protected-symbol-warn called with (NIL)
+(1) -> 0 making /home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/mnt/linux/algebra/NODE1.o from /home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/int/algebra/NODE1.NRLIB
+cp: Aufruf von stat für »/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/int/algebra/NODE1.NRLIB/code.o« nicht möglich: Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden
+make[3]: *** [/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/mnt/linux/algebra/NODE1.o] Fehler 1
+make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/src/algebra'
+make[2]: *** [algebradir] Fehler 2
+make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/src'
+make[1]: *** [srcdir] Fehler 2
+make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon'
+make: *** [all] Fehler 2
+
+Regards,
+Wolfgang
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 07:41:41 2003
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+To: WZocher@t-online.de (Wolfgang Zocher)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error with Axiom.CVS & gcl-2.6.1
+References: <m3u15wcg07.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 13:41:03 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <m3u15wcg07.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de> (Wolfgang Zocher's
+	message of "26 Oct 2003 13:58:32 +0100")
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+
+Hello Wolfgang,
+
+WZocher@t-online.de (Wolfgang Zocher) writes:
+
+> when I tried to build axiom from scratch last night I got the errors listed
+> below. Is this kind of error symptomatic for the new release of gcl? Has
+
+No, it is not related to gcl.. It is more probably related to an issue
+in Axiom internal database which describes Axiom knowledge on math
+"modules".
+
+> anyone tried to compile with gcl-2.7.x (CVS)? 
+
+I don't think so.
+
+[...]
+> (1) -> 0 making /home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/mnt/linux/algebra/NODE1.o from /home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/int/algebra/NODE1.NRLIB
+> cp: Aufruf von stat für »/home/wolzoc/axiom-athlon/int/algebra/NODE1.NRLIB/code.o« nicht möglich: Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden
+
+Both Tim, you and I failed on the same file. I have the same error
+message as you.
+
+I think the proper cause of failure is:
+   compiling local solveBernoulli : (Record(coef1: F,coefn: F,exponent: NonNegativeInteger),BasicOperator,Symbol,F) -> Union(F,failed)
+   Semantic Errors: 
+      [1]  ElementaryFunctionODESolver is not a known type
+ 
+   Warnings: 
+      [1] solve: not known that (OrderedSet) is of mode (CATEGORY package (SIGNATURE solve ((Union F failed) F F (BasicOperator) (Symbol))))
+      [2] checkBernoulli: not known that (Ring) is of mode (CATEGORY package (SIGNATURE solve ((Union F failed) F F (BasicOperator) (Symbol))))
+
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: WZocher@t-online.de
+In-reply-to: <m3u15wcg07.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Error with Axiom.CVS & gcl-2.6.1
+References: <m3u15wcg07.fsf@wzocher.dialin.t-online.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Wolfgang,
+
+There is currently a problem with the CVS version.
+We are actively working on it. If we don't solve it
+shortly we will back out to the previous version.
+I'll send you email once there is a buildable version in CVS.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 16:59:34 2003
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+In-reply-to: <1067194536.6216.10.camel@asus> (message from Bill Page on 26 Oct
+	2003 13:55:36 -0500)
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+	<1067194536.6216.10.camel@asus>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: cvs
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+re: commit. 
+
+great. I'll download and test it.
+In general I've learned not to mention to anyone that I've
+changed CVS until I've uploaded, downloaded a brand-new copy,
+compiled, and tested it. It is a long, painful cycle, no?
+
+re: backout
+
+I think the idea is that when you make a change it becomes 
+foo.1.2 and if you want to get the previous version you
+explicitly ask for 
+cvs -r foo.1.1
+I haven't done that explicitly but you're welcome to try it.
+CVS maintains the old versions but I don't know of an explicit
+command to "back out" a change. Usually you download a prior
+version and then check it back in so it becomes foo.1.3
+
+re: daase files
+
+The daase files are random access files.
+You get a number, seek into the file that number of bytes, and call read.
+
+The format of the daase files is:
+
+integer-offset-to-index
+(sexpr) (sexpr) (sexpr) .... (sexpr)
+(index)
+
+The file is read by reading the integer offset,
+seeking into the file that many bytes,
+and reading the index. The index is a table
+of lists of offset numbers (some of the offsets
+are immediate data rather than numbers).
+
+So, for instance, in browse.daase you can open the file in emacs,
+read the first number (2135125) and then do:
+C-u 2135125 C-f 
+and you end up position 2135125 characters into the file which is
+the start of the index list. If you know what the index list
+entries mean then you can look up properties.
+
+One of the subtle parts of some of the files is that there is a
+compression algorithm I wrote to minimize the size of the daase
+files. It could be the case that the compression algorithm has
+a bug. In any case I'm going to write a program to compare two
+daase versions. This involves reading the index, walking the index
+entries to get the data, and comparing the results from the other file.
+I've written a few checking routines of this type before. (see libcheck
+in util.lisp.pamphlet which checks INTERP.EXPOSED (which I have to 
+rewrite to use exposed.lsp)). I plan to add these checking routines
+as part of the build process (they used to be there).
+
+re: conflicts
+
+I deleted some files per requests by David and Camm
+and they've been uploaded again. Be sure to do
+cvs update 
+before you do a 
+cvs commit
+
+The "update" makes sure that you have resolved all of
+the conflicts before adding your code.
+
+I've forgotten this in the past but so far I've been the
+only one making cvs commits. I expect that we'll all be
+doing commits in the future so we have to be careful to
+do cvs updates first.
+
+Despite the unforseen gaffe I'm quite pleased that you 
+went ahead and made independent changes. Provided we all
+carefully check our work I'm hoping to see more of this.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 17:37:09 2003
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+	Sun, 26 Oct 2003 17:34:52 -0500
+From: Bill Page <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: daly@idsi.net
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+References: <000001c39bd6$99457b00$6501a8c0@Asus>
+	<200310261724.h9QHOrO26826@localhost.localdomain>
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+Cc: "axiom-developer@nongnu.org" <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: cvs
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Tim,
+
+Thanks for the notes about the database files.
+
+On Sun, 2003-10-26 at 16:28, you wrote
+
+> re: conflicts
+> 
+> I deleted some files per requests by David and Camm
+> and they've been uploaded again. Be sure to do
+> cvs update before you do a cvs commit
+> 
+> The "update" makes sure that you have resolved all of
+> the conflicts before adding your code.
+> 
+
+Ok, sorry. I did forget the update step. If I had done the
+update would everything have authomatically been alright or
+would I have had to manually delete my copy of the files
+which you had separately deleted in order to avoid having
+them re-added?
+
+> I've forgotten this in the past but so far I've been the
+> only one making cvs commits. I expect that we'll all be
+> doing commits in the future so we have to be careful to
+> do cvs updates first.
+> 
+
+Understood. I am amazed once again that the open software
+movement has gotten as far as it has with CVS. But that's
+dedication, I guess. But once one learns to cope with the
+limitations of some complex tool, it is hard to give it up
+even when something better and easier to use comes along...
+
+> Despite the unforseen gaffe I'm quite pleased that you 
+> went ahead and made independent changes. Provided we all
+> carefully check our work I'm hoping to see more of this.
+> 
+
+You are absolutely right that I should have tested the
+change to the database first (by re-compiling interpsys
+again after changing the database files, obviously)
+*before* uploading my changes to the CVS. Sorry.
+
+The current interp/Makefile does not actually update
+the database files. How do you plan to handle this in
+the future? Would this normally be done as part of
+every build? So does this always mean that we have to
+build interpsys twice?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 18:56:14 2003
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+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+In-reply-to: <1067207624.8135.13.camel@asus> (message from Bill Page on 26 Oct
+	2003 17:33:48 -0500)
+References: <000001c39bd6$99457b00$6501a8c0@Asus>
+	<200310261724.h9QHOrO26826@localhost.localdomain>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: cvs
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+> Ok, sorry. I did forget the update step. If I had done the
+> update would everything have authomatically been alright or
+> would I have had to manually delete my copy of the files
+> which you had separately deleted in order to avoid having
+> them re-added?
+
+It comes with practice which is why I first set up a local CVS
+then the CVS on tenkan before I started using the main website.
+On the first CVS I used remotely I uploaded my whole home directory
+including my mail files. 
+
+If I delete a file and you do the update then the cvs command will
+delete your copy of the file when you do the update. In order to
+avoid stepping on other peoples changes everyone must do a cvs update
+before doing a commit. The cvs update will try to merge changes that
+don't conflict but will complain about ones it can't. You need to
+merge changes that cvs cannot before you check in the files.
+
+> Understood. I am amazed once again that the open software
+> movement has gotten as far as it has with CVS. But that's
+> dedication, I guess. But once one learns to cope with the
+> limitations of some complex tool, it is hard to give it up
+> even when something better and easier to use comes along...
+
+The linux kernel people have partially migrated to bitkeeper.
+Bitkeeper is a much better idea and they let free software
+projects use it for free. However it is the subject of endless
+religious wars and we don't need the grief. There is also a
+free version call subversions, I believe. Change control is
+always a painful subject and I've never seen a system I liked.
+
+Hosting Axiom on savannah makes CVS the required default so 
+using other tools is a moot point.
+
+If the number of developers gets large enough we'll have to
+appoint a person as the "librarian" to centralize changes.
+That person would be responible for applying and testing changes.
+
+In the kernel there are many cvs trees although Linus's tree
+is "the master" people like Alan Cox maintain their own tree.
+You can check out the -ac version to get Alan's copy. Alan
+maintains patches that either Linux won't accept, Alan thinks
+aren't quite ready, or are specific to things Alan wants.
+
+> You are absolutely right that I should have tested the
+> change to the database first (by re-compiling interpsys
+> again after changing the database files, obviously)
+> *before* uploading my changes to the CVS. Sorry.
+
+I follow this cycle:
+
+1) I have a local tree where I make changes. There are currently 3 
+   local trees with changes "in process" in parallel.
+2) Once I'm happy with a local tree I do a cvs checkout of Axiom
+   to a clean directory (call it directory A) and apply the changes 
+   to that directory copy.
+3) I do a build in the A directory.
+4) I do a clean checkout of axiom into a B directory and diff -R A B
+5) I copy the changed files to my "master" directory
+   and do the cvs adds/deletes
+6) I copy the master directory to a local directory C and do a build
+   along with testing.
+7) I cvs checkin the master
+8) I cvs checkout the master to local directory D
+9) I make directory D
+
+It is a painfully long dance but I inserted the various steps 
+because I make a lot of mistakes and each step catches some of
+the errors. I still manage to shank one occasionally.
+   
+
+> The current interp/Makefile does not actually update
+> the database files. How do you plan to handle this in
+> the future? Would this normally be done as part of
+> every build? So does this always mean that we have to
+> build interpsys twice?
+
+Yes, interpsys will eventually be built twice as part of the build.
+During the second build there are a large number of function-calling
+optimizations that get applied which considerably speed up the
+execution.
+
+The database files will only get rebuilt if they need to be.
+Currently databases are rebuilt every time. This used to be
+implemented in Scratchpad but seems to have disappeared.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 20:07:24 2003
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+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 20:06:11 -0500
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: WZocher@t-online.de
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Axiom build restored
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Wolfgang,
+
+The Axiom CVS has been restored to a version that builds properly.
+Sorry for the problems.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Sun Oct 26 22:43:39 2003
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+Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 22:42:36 -0500
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] layer22
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+
+Bill,
+
+I noticed in the last build that you not only removed the databases
+but also your modifications to the src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet.
+I haven't finished testing yet but it appears that you've solved
+most of the problems. A lot of the broken test cases listed in
+src/input/Makefile.pamphlet under the <<regression tests>> chunk
+seem to run with your changes.
+
+I'll run some tests, probably tomorrow, with your layer22 changes
+to see if they can be run out of mnt. If so we should probably 
+restore at least the Makefile.pamphlet you made.
+
+I'll let you know the results of the tests.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 06:12:19 2003
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Axiom build restored
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+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+Tim,
+
+> The Axiom CVS has been restored to a version that builds properly.
+> Sorry for the problems.
+
+you really make me feel ashamed. You're doing a lot of great work with Axiom
+while I'm only whining ... 
+
+I wish I could help you - at the moment my knowledge about the details of the
+Axiom system, its program structure etc. is too little to be ready for doing
+something relevant unless I can help with tasks which don't require such
+deeper knowledge ...
+
+Regards,
+Wolfgang
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 06:58:40 2003
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+
+Wolfgang,
+
+It is not my intention to make anyone feel ashamed. 
+
+Building a running Axiom is a hard problem and involves many people
+who are doing their work in the open where other people can watch.
+Problems arise and we need people who are trying to use the system
+to give us feedback when things don't work. To say that your effort
+amounts to "I'm only whining" is to say that testing and bug reporting
+is "only whining". Whining involves opinion; bug reporting involves
+facts. You reported a fact that the system wouldn't build. That is
+a valid contribution.
+
+Bug reports are always welcome.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 12:53:26 2003
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+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 11:45:30 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310271645.h9RGjU028317@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C3@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C3@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: algebra completion
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+I did a cvs update to get the latest version.
+Then I did a cvs -r to get your previous src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet.
+I did a rebuild of the system with your Makefile.pamphlet.
+I ran the broken test cases.
+Your Makefile.pamphlet solves a couple dozen problems.
+Tonight I'm going to restore your Makefile.pamphlet as well as
+the newly working regression tests.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 13:43:49 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 13:43:13 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
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+
+Tim
+
+On Sunday, October 26, 2003 10:43 PM you wrote:
+> 
+> I noticed in the last build that you not only removed the
+> databases but also your modifications to the
+> src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet.
+
+If that is true then it certainly shows how much
+I do not understand about CVS! It was not my
+intention to remove the new algebra/Makefile.pamphlet
+and I know for certain that it was *not* removed or
+backed-out to the old version in the directory from
+which I updated the CVS since I did a build of Axiom
+right from that directory and ran the regression
+tests.
+
+Odd.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 13:51:13 2003
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+Message-ID: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C7@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Bill. Page1 (E-mail)'" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>, "'daly@idsi.net'"
+	<daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22
+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 13:51:00 -0500
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+
+Tim,
+
+I just checked the CVS using the Web interface on
+Savannah
+
+ 
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/Makefile.
+pamphlet
+
+and it shows only the new version 1.3 of the algebra
+Makefile.pamphlet that I uploaded (along with the
+bad databases) last Friday morning. When you were
+building Axiom you must have got the old one from
+somewhere else. No?
+
+No comprendo.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+On Monday, October 27, 2003 1:43 PM I wrote:
+> 
+> On Sunday, October 26, 2003 10:43 PM you wrote:
+> > 
+> > I noticed in the last build that you not only removed the
+> > databases but also your modifications to the
+> > src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet.
+> 
+> If that is true then it certainly shows how much
+> I do not understand about CVS!
+> ...
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 13:58:54 2003
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+To: "Bill. Page1 (E-mail)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Subject: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C6@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 19:58:10 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9C6@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill Page's message of "Mon, 27 Oct 2003 13:43:13 -0500")
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+Hello Bill,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> and I know for certain that it was *not* removed or
+> backed-out to the old version in the directory from
+> which I updated the CVS since I did a build of Axiom
+> right from that directory and ran the regression
+> tests.
+
+Your right. The src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet currently in CVS is yours:
+http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet?graph=1.3
+
+1.3 - 24-Oct-2003 12:33:11 - billpage1 - HEAD
+
+Please notice that cvs tells you what it does. It is somewhat encoded
+(e.g. in a cvs update) but the information is there.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 14:03:13 2003
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+From: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] axiom compilation problem (gcl)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello,
+
+Some minutes ago, I downloaded the anonymous CVS module
+
+cvs -z3 -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co axiom
+
+There is now a default version 2.6.1 in Makefile.pamphlet which is
+put into Makefile but not into Makefile.dvi.
+
+The gcl versions 2.4.1 and 2.5 are not in the zips directory.
+
+Best
+Ralf
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 14:13:13 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at'" <hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] axiom compilation problem (gcl)
+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 14:12:55 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Ralf,
+
+That is correct. Axiom is now built (by default)
+using GCL 2.6.1. GCL versions 2.4.1 and 2.5 are
+out of date. It is still possible (by a small
+modification) to build with the previous version
+of GCL which was 2.5.2.
+
+When you say "not the Makefile.dvi" do you mean that
+this documentation file is not up to date with these
+changes? If so, then that should not affect the build
+of Axiom and will be corrected as part of the build
+process.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at 
+> [mailto:hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at]
+> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 2:01 PM
+> To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] axiom compilation problem (gcl)
+> 
+> 
+> Hello,
+> 
+> Some minutes ago, I downloaded the anonymous CVS module
+> 
+> cvs -z3 -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co axiom
+> 
+> There is now a default version 2.6.1 in Makefile.pamphlet which is
+> put into Makefile but not into Makefile.dvi.
+> 
+> The gcl versions 2.4.1 and 2.5 are not in the zips directory.
+> 
+> Best
+> Ralf
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 20:02:49 2003
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+Message-ID: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9CA@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2003 19:59:21 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Camm,
+
+When using the -enable-static option on configure under
+RedHat Linux 8.0 and gcc 3.3.2 is it expected that the
+gcl image be only about 180kbytes larger than without
+the -enable-static option? Fram a 6 Mbyte image, this
+seems like a surprizingly small change in size to me.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Camm Maguire [mailto:camm@enhanced.com]
+> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 12:56 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp and rpms)
+> 
+> 
+> Greetings!  OK, thanks for the report -- I've just committed a fix in
+> cvs 2.6.1 and head.  The patch is in two parts, one loads weak symbols
+> as well as undefined symbols into the bfd symbol table, and the other
+> maps the 't' and 'nil stream descriptors properly in optimized
+> references to read-char.  These will be in the next stable and
+> unstable release on the temp site.
+> ... 
+> > 
+> > On Monday, October 20, 2003 11:45 PM Tim wrote:
+> > 
+> > > 
+> > > The statically linked GCL image has a problem:
+> > > 
+> > > make file foo.lisp:
+> > > 
+> > > (defun test (st) (read-char st))
+> > > 
+> > > at lisp prompt:
+> > > 
+> > > >(compile-file "foo.lisp")
+> > > >(load "foo.o")
+> > > 
+> > 
+> > I tried this under Windows with GCL 2.6.1 which is statically
+> > linked without readline by default (I think?). It worked fine.
+> > 
+> > So it seems that moving to 2.6.1, building with the new
+> > .\configure --enable-static option and eliminating readline
+> > might correct your static linking problem.
+> > 
+> > Cheers,
+> > Bill Page.
+> > 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Mon Oct 27 23:22:32 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] cvs
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+
+I've added new regression tests to the src/input/Makefile.pamphlet.
+I've recreated Makefile.dvi
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 05:02:29 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 05:02:06 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+	"'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	"'gcl-devel@gnu.org'" <gcl-devel@gnu.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Camm,
+
+Sorry, let me correct my report of the size of GCL
+under a static build. The size difference that I
+really see is
+
+  7.275 Mb. (static) versus 5.930 Mb. (dynamic)
+
+That's a difference of 1.345 Mb. - more reasonable?
+
+Note also that the dynamic library version was build
+using gcc 3.2.
+
+The number that I reported previously was just the
+different due to the change from gcc 3.2.1 to 3.3.2.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Page, Bill 
+> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 7:59 PM
+> To: 'Camm Maguire'
+> Cc: daly@idsi.net; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: RE: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp and rpms)
+> 
+> 
+> Camm,
+> 
+> When using the -enable-static option on configure under
+> RedHat Linux 8.0 and gcc 3.3.2 is it expected that the
+> gcl image be only about 180kbytes larger than without
+> the -enable-static option? Fram a 6 Mbyte image, this
+> seems like a surprizingly small change in size to me.
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 06:29:53 2003
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+Subject: RE: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:27:50 +0100
+Message-ID: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC046C6484@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
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+Thread-Topic: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+Thread-Index: AcOcvQEvPagX84kqQUqyzLbY+9CIAAAiQ1Jg
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: "David MENTRE" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>,
+	"Bill. Page1 (E-mail)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2003 11:27:48.0407 (UTC)
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+
+I had a look at the algebra Makefile, and it seems that
+the domains/packages INTRVL, ODEEF and RSDCMPK are not
+build. So without them, the database is incomplete and
+it is not possible to recompile the system with the
+incomplete database.
+
+Regards
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 7:58 PM
+> To: Bill. Page1 (E-mail)
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; 'daly@idsi.net'
+> Subject: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Bill,
+> 
+> "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+> 
+> > and I know for certain that it was *not* removed or
+> > backed-out to the old version in the directory from
+> > which I updated the CVS since I did a build of Axiom
+> > right from that directory and ran the regression
+> > tests.
+> 
+> Your right. The src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet currently in 
+> CVS is yours:
+> http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/axiom/axiom/src/alg
+ebra/Makefile.pamphlet?graph=3D1.3
+
+1.3 - 24-Oct-2003 12:33:11 - billpage1 - HEAD
+
+Please notice that cvs tells you what it does. It is somewhat encoded
+(e.g. in a cvs update) but the information is there.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+_______________________________________________
+Axiom-developer mailing list
+Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 06:54:04 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Weiss, Juergen'" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: RE: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 06:46:54 -0500
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Juergen,
+
+Thank you very much for looking at this! You are right
+that the three modules you mentioned are missing from
+the layers defined in the current algebra/Makefile.
+I have added them and am currently re-building a system
+including these. Then I will try to repeat the build
+with the resulting databases files.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Weiss, Juergen [mailto:weiss@uni-mainz.de]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 6:28 AM
+> To: David MENTRE; Bill. Page1 (E-mail)
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net
+> Subject: RE: On CVS (was: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: layer22)
+> 
+> 
+> I had a look at the algebra Makefile, and it seems that
+> the domains/packages INTRVL, ODEEF and RSDCMPK are not
+> build. So without them, the database is incomplete and
+> it is not possible to recompile the system with the
+> incomplete database.
+> 
+> Regards
+> 
+> Juergen Weiss
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 07:56:29 2003
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+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9CB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+If you create a linux-static chunk in the top-level Makefile.pamphlet
+then you can create the static image by setting the Axiom varialble to:
+
+export AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux-static
+
+then we can try a static build of Axiom
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 09:37:22 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:26:39 -0500
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom (was: static lisp
+	and rpms)
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
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+
+Tim,
+
+I have already completed a build with --enable-static.
+However to get things to work I did two things: 
+
+1) I replaced the gcl-2.6.1 tgz file in zips with the
+more recent gcl-2.6.1-16 source from Camm's temporary
+debian site. Since Camm had provided a patch in the
+new version to handle readline in the static case.
+
+2) I upgraded my gcc compiler to version 3.3.2 (the
+newest version) since other emails also indicated that
+there were possible problems with older versions of gcc.
+
+It now seems to work. 
+
+I was about to upload a binary to the files section for
+others to try (since I only have RedHat Linux boxes here,
+moving the static binary between them is not a real test),
+but then Juergen pointed out that we still have three
+missing algebra files, so I decided to include those files
+before uploading the new static binary.
+
+I will also proceed as you suggest and modify the
+Makefile.pamphlet to include a linux-static chuck, however
+I have to think about this a bit more since the change to
+the GCL configuration option is done in the lsp/Makefile.
+So I think this means that it will have to be controlled
+by the GCLVERSION environment variable. E.g. maybe
+
+  GCLVERSION=gcl-2.6.1-static
+
+and then it will use that to pull the right chunk
+out of the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet. Right?
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 7:47 AM
+> To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+> Cc: camm@enhanced.com; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net;
+> gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+> (was: static lisp and rpms)
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> If you create a linux-static chunk in the top-level
+> Makefile.pamphlet then you can create the static image by
+> setting the Axiom varialble to:
+> 
+> export AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux-static
+> 
+> then we can try a static build of Axiom
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 09:56:30 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:13:46 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281413.h9SEDke07945@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+I'm sure you already know this but I'll write it down anyway.
+The steps to take are:
+
+A) CHANGES TO THE Makefile.pamphlet FILE:
+
+*) copy the linux chunk and rename it to linux-static.
+    This will set up almost all of the appropriate variables. The chunk
+    that gets used is decided by the basename of the $AXIOM variable.
+    So to select this new chunk you would make the AXIOM variable be:
+  AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux-static
+    This will create a Makefile.linux-static and invoke it.
+
+*) modify the linux-static chunk to include a new make variable 
+     Something like 
+   STATIC=--enable-static
+
+*) add this variable to the ENV variable
+     This "passes" the variable down to the next level of Makefile
+     which in this case is the lsp/Makefile. The reason this works
+     is that you can generally set a shell variable on the same
+     commandline as the call to make and the shell variables will
+     be seen by the make. The change will look something like:
+   ENV= ...... STATIC=${STATIC}
+
+*) hardcode the GCLVERSION variable in the linux-static chunk
+    GCLVERSION=gcl-2.6.1-static
+
+*) add documentation to the new linux-static chunk to explain what
+   you are doing and why. 
+
+*) run the document command on the top level Makefile.pamphlet thus:
+    SPAD=$AXIOM
+    PATH=$AXIOM/bin:$PATH
+    document Makefile     (don't add the .pamphlet)
+
+B) CHANGES TO THE zips DIRECTORY
+
+*) add the gcl-2.6.1-16.tgz to zips
+
+*) copy the zips/gcl-2.6.1*.patch files to zips/gcl-2.6.1-16*.patch
+
+*) cvs add gcl-2.6.1-16*
+
+C) CHANGES TO THE lsp/Makefile.pamphlet FILE
+
+*) modify the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet 
+     so that the GCL configure line include ${STATIC}. Normally this
+     will expand to the null string so it won't change the behavior
+     of the normal build. When invoked from the Makefile.linux-static
+     the STATIC variable will be defined and will expand to --enable-static.
+
+*) document the change in the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet
+
+D) CHANGES TO THE CHANGELOG FILE
+
+*) add a comment to CHANGELOG
+
+copy the whole pile, try a build, and when it works check it all in.
+
+If you're really feeling ambitious you can go to www.testdrive.hp.com,
+sign up for a password, and try it on several linux variants. I already
+have a password so I'm likely to try it.
+
+Tim
+
+
+  
+   
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 09:57:23 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:16:56 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281416.h9SEGui08850@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+In parallel I'll do a test build to see if gcl-2.6.1-16 works
+properly. If so we can delete the gcl-2.6.1 image and move the
+GCLVERSION variable to the -16 version.
+
+Is gcl-2.6.1-16.tgz in the cvs?
+
+Tim
+
+
+  
+   
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 09:58:59 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:58:28 -0500
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] readline and axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim, Camm;
+
+Am I confused over how readline is supposed to work
+with GCL and Axiom?
+
+Under the Windows version of GCL 2.6.1, I can enter
+an expression like
+
+  > (+ 1 1)
+
+and then hit the up arrow key and make a change
+say to
+
+  > (+ 1 2)
+
+and just hit enter to execute the edited line.
+
+I have not been able to do the equivalent under Axiom.
+When I press up arrow I get
+
+  ^[0A
+
+(^[ means "escape"?) which of course Axiom doesn't
+understand.
+
+And I have just tested the new GCL 2.6.1-16 built
+with --enable-static and --enable-readline and I get
+the same weird characters rather than the "readline"
+behaviour that I expected.
+
+Am I doing something wrong? Is there something that
+has to be enabled in GCL as part of the startup?
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 10:07:44 2003
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+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
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+
+Bill,
+
+We use 2 "features" of noweb, the <<chunk>> mechanism and
+the [[quoting]] mechanism. (btw, I'm about to patch the
+annoying tmpnam message by rewriting that code).
+
+We also have our own extension of noweb which uses code written by
+David to do "booklets". Chunk names that begin with <<pamphlet:
+are treated as a url and are included inline during the literate
+programming pass. Note that we need to do this. The #include 
+mechanism in TeX occurs AFTER the literate programming pass so 
+you can't use it to include pamphlets since they would not be
+expanded properly. The booklet code is in src/doc.
+
+In general the longer term plan is to adopt the "protocol" style
+of URLs (http:, ftp:, etc) to specify literate programming features.
+One feature in the design pipeline is to have biblio references as:
+<<reference: or <<spad:, etc.
+
+Tim
+
+
+  
+   
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 10:11:20 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:28:58 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281428.h9SESwo08903@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Axiom and readline
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bill,
+
+There is a program called clef, which is part of Axiom, that handles 
+this (as well as command completion for Axiom functions, etc). I'll
+look at recovering it.
+
+Tim
+
+
+  
+   
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 10:11:34 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:27:09 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281427.h9SER9J08893@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, vdhoeven@texmacs.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Bill,
+
+Also of note is that the Red Flag Linux person has a deep
+interest in literate programming. Should be fun to add languages
+to the list of things to think about. There is no reason why the
+research work has to be in english.
+
+Tim
+
+
+  
+   
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 11:08:26 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+References: <E1ADl4t-0000YC-00@macavity>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 11:07:37 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <E1ADl4t-0000YC-00@macavity>
+Message-ID: <547k2pbb1y.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 35
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: 217644@bugs.debian.org, Martin Uecker <muecker@gmx.de>,
+	control@bugs.debian.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: Bug#217644: axiom: missing file: SIGNEF.o
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+forwarded 217644 axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+thanks
+
+Greetings everyone!  Another report of a missing file from a Debian
+user -- is this linked with the COMBF.o issue?
+
+Take care,
+
+Martin Uecker <muecker@gmx.de> writes:
+
+> Package: axiom
+> Version: 0.0.0cvs-7
+> Severity: important
+> 
+> 
+> This file seems critical for important functionality
+> like integration:
+> 
+> (5) -> integrate(1/x,x)
+>    Loading /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o for
+>       package ElementaryFunctionSign
+> 
+>    >> System error:
+>    Cannot open the file /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+From: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] axiom compilation succeded
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Hello,
+
+I have just succeded to compile axiom on
+
+> uname -a
+Linux dragonfly 2.2.20-idepci #1 Sat Apr 20 12:45:19 EST 2002
+i686 unknown
+(2.4GHz/1GB Debian Linux)
+
+without any problem.
+
+Congratulations to the developers!
+
+I know that AXIOM is still in a very early state, but I would like to
+add a few comments.
+
+A good thing is that the compilation process works fine. After that
+however, someone who wants to give a try on AXIOM, becomes certainly
+rather frustrated. The reason is the missing documentation. OK, the
+current stage is like that, but I think it is rather important, in
+order to attract new people (users/developers/beta testers). I hope
+the new axiom book is ready soon.
+
+It would be a good idea to provide at least some sample file with a
+collection of commands that are most commonly used in first year
+undergraduate courses. Of course the book by Jenks & Sutor is a good
+reference, but not everyone has it.
+
+After I had finished the compilation, I looked for documentation. 
+Unfortunately only the various Makefile.dvi files yields some
+information, but there is one other file
+
+mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi
+
+which, unfortunately is not a DVI file, but a LaTeX source. The
+extension should be changed to avoid confusion. (OK, it is only for
+the developers, so maybe it sould not be present in the anonymous
+cvs.)
+
+What about ADVI. It seems that it has not been built during make.
+Is this intensional or simply will come later when more documentation 
+files are available?
+
+Wouldn't it be a good idea to rename the top-level README to 00README
+so that it appears first in the directory listing? I would expect that
+it guides me through the system, telling me which things are finished
+and which are not. This would certainly prevent people (like me)
+asking stupid questions about non-existing (or better
+not-yet-existing) stuff.
+
+
+
+Since I have done some development in Aldor, I am rather interested in
+a connection of Aldor and Axiom. Unfortunately, the language is one
+thing, the libraries on which to build one's own program are another.
+
+Is it intended that Manuel Bronstein's libraries libaldor and
+libalgebra and the axiom library converge? I guess, at the moment they
+are incompatible. If I now build some program on libalgebra, is there
+a chance (in a nearer future) that I can run this inside AXIOM without
+modification. Is someone working on such a connection?
+
+Best regards
+
+Ralf
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 11:45:19 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+	by rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id h9SG4u118222;
+	Tue, 28 Oct 2003 11:04:56 -0500
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 11:04:56 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281604.h9SG4u118222@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: muecker@gmx.de, Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] SIGNEF.o
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 16:45:15 -0000
+
+Martin,
+
+The latest version in the CVS solves this problem but thanks for
+the bug report.
+
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+Martin Uecker <muecker@gmx.de> writes:
+
+> Package: axiom
+> Version: 0.0.0cvs-7
+> Severity: important
+> 
+> 
+> This file seems critical for important functionality
+> like integration:
+> 
+> (5) -> integrate(1/x,x)
+>    Loading /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o for
+>       package ElementaryFunctionSign
+> 
+>    >> System error:
+>    Cannot open the file /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o.
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 11:58:50 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+References: <200310281604.h9SG4u118222@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 11:55:18 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310281604.h9SG4u118222@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <54d6ch1evd.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 42
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, muecker@gmx.de
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: SIGNEF.o
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 16:58:34 -0000
+
+Greetings!  Great!  I'll try another package release with the latest
+stuff.
+
+Take care,
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Martin,
+> 
+> The latest version in the CVS solves this problem but thanks for
+> the bug report.
+> 
+> Tim Daly
+> axiom@tenkan.org
+> daly@idsi.net
+> 
+> 
+> Martin Uecker <muecker@gmx.de> writes:
+> 
+> > Package: axiom
+> > Version: 0.0.0cvs-7
+> > Severity: important
+> > 
+> > 
+> > This file seems critical for important functionality
+> > like integration:
+> > 
+> > (5) -> integrate(1/x,x)
+> >    Loading /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o for
+> >       package ElementaryFunctionSign
+> > 
+> >    >> System error:
+> >    Cannot open the file /usr/lib/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/algebra/SIGNEF.o.
+> > 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:10:55 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 11:23:03 -0500
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] SIGNEF.o
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+
+Ralf,
+
+> I have just succeded to compile axiom on
+> 
+> > uname -a
+> Linux dragonfly 2.2.20-idepci #1 Sat Apr 20 12:45:19 EST 2002
+> i686 unknown
+> (2.4GHz/1GB Debian Linux)
+> 
+> without any problem.
+
+Nice computer. Mail it to me :-)
+
+> 
+> Congratulations to the developers!
+
+>From all of us, thanks. Join the party and become a developer.
+
+> 
+> I know that AXIOM is still in a very early state, but I would like to
+> add a few comments.
+> 
+> A good thing is that the compilation process works fine. After that
+> however, someone who wants to give a try on AXIOM, becomes certainly
+> rather frustrated. The reason is the missing documentation. OK, the
+> current stage is like that, but I think it is rather important, in
+> order to attract new people (users/developers/beta testers). I hope
+> the new axiom book is ready soon.
+
+Slowly but surely the docs are coming. I have a near-religious belief
+in documentation so you will eventually see it. 
+
+> 
+> It would be a good idea to provide at least some sample file with a
+> collection of commands that are most commonly used in first year
+> undergraduate courses. Of course the book by Jenks & Sutor is a good
+> reference, but not everyone has it.
+
+The mnt/linux/input subdirectory contains commands that work.
+Eventually these will be in the mnt/linux/doc directory with
+explanations of the associated mathematics.
+
+> 
+> After I had finished the compilation, I looked for documentation. 
+> Unfortunately only the various Makefile.dvi files yields some
+> information, but there is one other file
+> 
+> mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi
+> 
+> which, unfortunately is not a DVI file, but a LaTeX source. 
+
+(humpf. a bug. mumble, mutter, moan. i biffed another one.)
+We'll get it fixed tonight. Sorry about that.
+
+> which, unfortunately is not a DVI file, but a LaTeX source. The
+> extension should be changed to avoid confusion. (OK, it is only for
+> the developers, so maybe it sould not be present in the anonymous
+> cvs.)
+> 
+> What about ADVI. It seems that it has not been built during make.
+> Is this intensional or simply will come later when more documentation 
+> files are available?
+
+I have done several experiments with ADVI. David Mentre has expressed
+interest in looking at further development and integration. ADVI, as
+it stands now, is mostly of interest because it demonstrates the power
+of the dvi file format. We can embed \special tags that allow us to 
+include other pamphlets, include active graphics, include inline axiom
+sessions, etc. In the long term this is very important. However we are
+still recovering old functionality so there is very little time to 
+expend on new work yet.
+
+> 
+> Wouldn't it be a good idea to rename the top-level README to 00README
+> so that it appears first in the directory listing? I would expect that
+> it guides me through the system, telling me which things are finished
+> and which are not. This would certainly prevent people (like me)
+> asking stupid questions about non-existing (or better
+> not-yet-existing) stuff.
+
+Umm, no. It appears that standard expectations are that we have a README
+file (and a configure script). README exists to conform to that expectation.
+The configure script is coming. I'll update the README later tonight.
+I don't mind questions and don't consider them stupid. 
+
+> Since I have done some development in Aldor, I am rather interested in
+> a connection of Aldor and Axiom. Unfortunately, the language is one
+> thing, the libraries on which to build one's own program are another.
+
+Aldor libraries seem to have a rather small overlap with Axiom libraries.
+There are 1100+ domains, packages, and categories in Axiom and, though
+many have tried, there is no easy way to make them available in Aldor.
+(The key problem is that you have to implement underlying lisp functionality
+in Aldor and that is a huge amount of work). Aldor programs can be used
+with Axiom.
+
+> 
+> Is it intended that Manuel Bronstein's libraries libaldor and
+> libalgebra and the axiom library converge? I guess, at the moment they
+> are incompatible. If I now build some program on libalgebra, is there
+> a chance (in a nearer future) that I can run this inside AXIOM without
+> modification. Is someone working on such a connection?
+
+I doubt they'll converge. Some people want standalone code to implement
+a particular algorithm and work in Aldor. Others want to write algorithms
+in a general setting and work in Axiom. It is much easier to move an
+Aldor program to Axiom than it is to move an Axiom program to Aldor. So
+eventually I see Axiom containing algorithms originally written in Aldor
+but not the reverse due to practical considerations mentioned above.
+It's a minor point, really, as the algebra languages are the same.
+
+
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:12:11 2003
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+To: "Bill. Page1 (E-mail)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9CF@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 12:03:18 -0500
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: readline and axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Greetings!
+
+There is a small weakness in our current readline support which could
+be addressed straightforwardly if/when I get a moment.  The way it is
+now, the readline library must be initialized at runtime via the lisp
+command:
+
+(si::init-readline)
+
+The gcl wrapper script should eval this for you automatically, but it
+is likely that axiom users will have to escape to lisp and run this
+command unless we get something more robust implemented.  On maxima,
+this looks like
+
+:lisp (si::init-readline)
+
+In addition, our readline code will probe the running terminal, and
+skip readline initialization if the controlling terminal is not
+readline capable, e.g. an emacs shell buffer, and ilisp emacs
+interface to gcl, etc.  Here is the existing code for this test:
+
+	if (!isatty(0))
+	   return;
+
+	if ((cp=getenv("TERM")) && !strcmp(cp,"dumb"))
+	   return;
+
+Bill, you have access to linux too, no?  Would be nice if you could
+report any readline functionality differences between the to ports, if
+any. 
+
+Take care,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> Tim, Camm;
+> 
+> Am I confused over how readline is supposed to work
+> with GCL and Axiom?
+> 
+> Under the Windows version of GCL 2.6.1, I can enter
+> an expression like
+> 
+>   > (+ 1 1)
+> 
+> and then hit the up arrow key and make a change
+> say to
+> 
+>   > (+ 1 2)
+> 
+> and just hit enter to execute the edited line.
+> 
+> I have not been able to do the equivalent under Axiom.
+> When I press up arrow I get
+> 
+>   ^[0A
+> 
+> (^[ means "escape"?) which of course Axiom doesn't
+> understand.
+> 
+> And I have just tested the new GCL 2.6.1-16 built
+> with --enable-static and --enable-readline and I get
+> the same weird characters rather than the "readline"
+> behaviour that I expected.
+> 
+> Am I doing something wrong? Is there something that
+> has to be enabled in GCL as part of the startup?
+> 
+> Regards,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 11:28:15 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281628.h9SGSFO19286@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca, camm@enhanced.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] readline
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+If you add the line:
+
+)lisp (si::init-readline)
+
+to your .axiom.input file it will get executed when Axiom starts.
+
+Tim Daly
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:38:05 2003
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: SIGNEF.o
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+
+Hello,
+
+> It is much easier to move an Aldor program to Axiom than it is to
+> move an Axiom program to Aldor.
+
+Yes, I know. I don't expect that Axiom (sub-) programs can be
+extracted. What I am interested in is to use axiom as a front-end for
+my program. 
+
+Thus I will have add some functionality to my aldor domains (which
+are, in fact, developed without any axiom domain). Is there someone
+who has made some toy example available?
+
+To make things easy, I want to build on as few axiom domains as
+possible but still want my program run inside axiom. So, in fact, I'd
+like to have the interpreter capabilities of axiom for my program.
+
+Of course, I am willing to help to establish such a connection, but I
+guess, there were already others who have made such connections
+without using src/share/algebra/libaxiom.al.
+
+How was libaxiom.al produced? Are there Aldor sources for it
+somewhere. Maybe I can find out the necessary things myself and create
+a sublibrary for my intended purpose.
+
+Best,
+
+Ralf
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:41:31 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:29:31 -0500
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+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: readline and axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Camm,
+
+On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:03 PM you wrote:
+
+> ... readline library must be initialized at runtime via
+> the lisp command:
+> 
+> (si::init-readline)
+> 
+> The gcl wrapper script should eval this for you automatically,
+> but it is likely that axiom users will have to escape to lisp
+> and run this command unless we get something more robust
+> implemented.
+
+Ok, that's clear. Can we still do something like pass an
+-eval '(si::init-readline)' option to GCL when we startup
+the Axiom image? And expect it to be executed before the
+first prompt?
+
+But Tim also suggests the use of .axiom.input. I guess
+that would be ok if it was automatically installed.
+
+> Bill, you have access to linux too, no?
+
+Yes. In fact for the moment I am primarily working with
+linux. (I can only take the frustrations of trying to
+force Axiom to live with Windows for short periods...)
+
+> Would be nice if you could report any readline functionality
+> differences between the to ports, if any. 
+> 
+
+Well, I did observe that when I start GCL 2.6.1 on windows,
+I don't have to do anything to start readline. So I guess
+the (si::init-readline) got executed somehow but it is not
+in the GCL.BAT startup file.
+
+I'll let you know more once I actually see it work
+under Linux.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:46:10 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:03:10 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281703.h9SH3Ae23456@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] libaldor
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Ralf,
+
+> Yes, I know. I don't expect that Axiom (sub-) programs can be
+> extracted. What I am interested in is to use axiom as a front-end for
+> my program.
+> 
+> Thus I will have add some functionality to my aldor domains (which
+> are, in fact, developed without any axiom domain). Is there someone
+> who has made some toy example available?
+
+I don't know of any toy examples. There might be some documentation
+in the NAG docs. I'll look tonight. If you're willing to email me 
+your code I could look at it and suggest possible solutions.
+
+> To make things easy, I want to build on as few axiom domains as
+> possible but still want my program run inside axiom. So, in fact, I'd
+> like to have the interpreter capabilities of axiom for my program.
+> 
+> Of course, I am willing to help to establish such a connection, but I
+> guess, there were already others who have made such connections
+> without using src/share/algebra/libaxiom.al.
+> 
+> How was libaxiom.al produced? Are there Aldor sources for it
+> somewhere. Maybe I can find out the necessary things myself and create
+> a sublibrary for my intended purpose.
+
+I no longer remember exactly. But Aldor can generate .c files which
+get compiled to .o files. I believe these are boxed up into a .a
+library using ar. Aldor can also generate lisp files and these can
+be used inside Axiom (which is just lisp). The algebra connection
+is a fluffier subject and I'm going to have to do some behind-the-scenes
+review about how that works exactly.
+
+Tim
+axiom@tenkan.org
+daly@idsi.net
+
+
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:51:52 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:51:17 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Cc: "'axiom-developer@nongnu.org'" <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>,
+	"'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	"'gcl-devel@gnu.org'" <gcl-devel@gnu.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: readline and axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Camm,
+
+Is it usual for GCL to ouput a long stream of messages
+following the
+
+  (si::init-readline)
+
+call? What I see when I start the --endable-static image
+that was generated during the Axiom build after the
+(si::init-readline) is
+
+  starting address -T 0x86b04c0 Finished loading ... gcl_readline.o
+  T
+  "Gcl"
+  1
+  (":INTERN: ":STEP" .....
+
+   etc. for about 200 lines of output or so
+
+  ... "PUSH-OPTION-BINDING")
+
+After which readline actually does behave as I had
+hoped and allows me to edit.
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:30 PM I wrote:
+> 
+> On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:03 PM you wrote:
+> 
+> > ... readline library must be initialized at runtime via
+> > the lisp command:
+> > 
+> > (si::init-readline)
+> > 
+> ... 
+> > Would be nice if you could report any readline functionality
+> > differences between the to ports, if any. 
+> > 
+> 
+> Well, I did observe that when I start GCL 2.6.1 on windows,
+> I don't have to do anything to start readline. So I guess
+> the (si::init-readline) got executed somehow but it is not
+> in the GCL.BAT startup file.
+> 
+> I'll let you know more once I actually see it work
+> under Linux.
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 12:59:41 2003
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+From: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: libaldor
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Dear Tim,
+
+>> How was libaxiom.al produced?
+ 
+> I no longer remember exactly. But Aldor can generate .c files which
+> get compiled to .o files. I believe these are boxed up into a .a
+> library using ar.
+
+That is correct. My question was directed to the sources. There must
+be some .as files somewhere which where used to produce libaxiom.a. 
+>From them I could perhaps make a link and a corresponding description
+available. At least I would like to have a look into it to see how
+much work it would be.
+
+> The algebra connection is a fluffier subject 
+
+Since I don't need the axiom algebra, the connection to algebra
+domains is not so important (at least not at the moment). Anyway, I
+guess that connection from my private types to axiom algebra types is
+just a matter of data conversion. I would do this when I see need for
+it.
+
+Ralf
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:03:01 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:22:32 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281722.h9SHMW524425@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] clef
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
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+
+Bill,
+
+Axiom's command-line editor (clef) has been recovered and works.  I'll
+upload it tonight. Memory fails me and I haven't had time to look at
+it deeply but I believe it can do things like function-name completion
+in Axiom. As a side-effect the  mnt/linux/bin/axiom executable will
+now become a shell script.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:03:45 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+References: <200310281416.h9SEGui08850@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 13:02:48 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310281416.h9SEGui08850@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 18:03:44 -0000
+
+Greetings!
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> In parallel I'll do a test build to see if gcl-2.6.1-16 works
+> properly. If so we can delete the gcl-2.6.1 image and move the
+> GCLVERSION variable to the -16 version.
+> 
+
+Great, please let me know if there are problems.
+
+> Is gcl-2.6.1-16.tgz in the cvs?
+> 
+
+Yes.  In general, at least until ftp.gnu.org is again available, my
+development procedure is to commit all changes either to the
+Version_2_6_1 or HEAD CVS branch, then at some interval when an
+important change is made, build and release the cvs tagged version as
+a Debian package, which then automatically updates the temporary
+website. 
+
+Take care,
+
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+>   
+>    
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:04:50 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+References: <200310281413.h9SEDke07945@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 13:00:09 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310281413.h9SEDke07945@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+
+Greetings!
+
+Just a quick query and an observation --
+
+Why would anyone want a static axiom?
+
+Currently gcc warns about several c library functions used by gcl
+which must be present in identical dynamic library form at runtime
+even with the static image:
+
+gcc -o raw_gcl  \
+	-L.  -u __gmpn_toom3_mul_n -lgcl -static -lm  -lgmp /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.2/../../../libbfd.a /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.2/../../../libiberty.a -lreadline -lncurses -lc -lgclp
+> /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.2/../../../libreadline.a(complete.o)(.text+0x1c71): In function `rl_username_completion_function':
+: warning: Using 'getpwent' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+./libgcl.a(unixfsys.o)(.text+0xc7): In function `coerce_to_filename':
+: warning: Using 'getpwnam' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+./libgcl.a(unixfsys.o)(.text+0x165): In function `coerce_to_filename':
+: warning: Using 'getpwuid' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.2/../../../libreadline.a(complete.o)(.text+0x1c62): In function `rl_username_completion_function':
+: warning: Using 'setpwent' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.2/../../../libreadline.a(complete.o)(.text+0x1d0d): In function `rl_username_completion_function':
+: warning: Using 'endpwent' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+./libgcl.a(nsocket.o)(.text+0x351): In function `fSgetpeername':
+: warning: Using 'gethostbyaddr' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+./libgcl.a(nsocket.o)(.text+0xa3f): In function `CreateSocketAddress':
+: warning: Using 'gethostbyname' in statically linked applications requires at runtime the shared libraries from the glibc version used for linking
+
+This would also seem to lessen any attractiveness in a static image.
+
+Take care,
+
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> I'm sure you already know this but I'll write it down anyway.
+> The steps to take are:
+> 
+> A) CHANGES TO THE Makefile.pamphlet FILE:
+> 
+> *) copy the linux chunk and rename it to linux-static.
+>     This will set up almost all of the appropriate variables. The chunk
+>     that gets used is decided by the basename of the $AXIOM variable.
+>     So to select this new chunk you would make the AXIOM variable be:
+>   AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux-static
+>     This will create a Makefile.linux-static and invoke it.
+> 
+> *) modify the linux-static chunk to include a new make variable 
+>      Something like 
+>    STATIC=--enable-static
+> 
+> *) add this variable to the ENV variable
+>      This "passes" the variable down to the next level of Makefile
+>      which in this case is the lsp/Makefile. The reason this works
+>      is that you can generally set a shell variable on the same
+>      commandline as the call to make and the shell variables will
+>      be seen by the make. The change will look something like:
+>    ENV= ...... STATIC=${STATIC}
+> 
+> *) hardcode the GCLVERSION variable in the linux-static chunk
+>     GCLVERSION=gcl-2.6.1-static
+> 
+> *) add documentation to the new linux-static chunk to explain what
+>    you are doing and why. 
+> 
+> *) run the document command on the top level Makefile.pamphlet thus:
+>     SPAD=$AXIOM
+>     PATH=$AXIOM/bin:$PATH
+>     document Makefile     (don't add the .pamphlet)
+> 
+> B) CHANGES TO THE zips DIRECTORY
+> 
+> *) add the gcl-2.6.1-16.tgz to zips
+> 
+> *) copy the zips/gcl-2.6.1*.patch files to zips/gcl-2.6.1-16*.patch
+> 
+> *) cvs add gcl-2.6.1-16*
+> 
+> C) CHANGES TO THE lsp/Makefile.pamphlet FILE
+> 
+> *) modify the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet 
+>      so that the GCL configure line include ${STATIC}. Normally this
+>      will expand to the null string so it won't change the behavior
+>      of the normal build. When invoked from the Makefile.linux-static
+>      the STATIC variable will be defined and will expand to --enable-static.
+> 
+> *) document the change in the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet
+> 
+> D) CHANGES TO THE CHANGELOG FILE
+> 
+> *) add a comment to CHANGELOG
+> 
+> copy the whole pile, try a build, and when it works check it all in.
+> 
+> If you're really feeling ambitious you can go to www.testdrive.hp.com,
+> sign up for a password, and try it on several linux variants. I already
+> have a password so I'm likely to try it.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+>   
+>    
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:12:09 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:30:38 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310281730.h9SHUco24466@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] libaldor
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Ralf,
+
+Yes, there must be .as files somewhere corresponding to the libaldor
+file. Unfortunately I don't believe these sources are available though
+I may be wrong. Contact www.aldor.org and/or NAG for an authoritative 
+answer.
+
+Assuming you used libaldor it shouldn't be particularly hard to 
+get it running in Axiom. Mostly I suspect it involves killing 
+the semicolons :-)
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:14:40 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:34:20 -0500
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] static axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Camm,
+
+We have the usual struggle with dynamic libraries and their versions.
+The idea was raised that if we could get Axiom build in a static
+linked version we wouldn't have to deal with this issue.
+
+glibc is likely to be installed on most machines but other libraries
+appear not to be. Static linking may not solve all of the porting
+issues but it might help.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:17:26 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 13:15:00 -0500
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+
+Camm,
+
+On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 1:00 PM you wrote:
+> 
+> Just a quick query and an observation --
+> 
+> Why would anyone want a static axiom?
+> 
+> Currently gcc warns about several c library functions used
+> by gcl which must be present in identical dynamic library
+> form at runtime even with the static image:
+> 
+
+Umm, well ...
+
+The idea came originally (I think from Joris who says that
+they produce a static version of TeXmacs for installation
+on a wide range of linux machines, (i.e. no special library
+dependencies to worry about).
+
+But are you saying that this is *not* possible with GCL?
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Patch for algebra Makefile
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+
+
+With the following patch applied, I was able
+to compile the algebra, generate a new
+database and regenerate the algebra with the
+new database. INTRVL and ODEEF should 
+probably get compiled earlier. But at least
+it works. 
+
+Index: Makefile.pamphlet
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /cvsroot/axiom/axiom/src/algebra/Makefile.pamphlet,v
+retrieving revision 1.3
+diff -a -u -r1.3 Makefile.pamphlet
+--- Makefile.pamphlet   24 Oct 2003 11:33:11 -0000      1.3
++++ Makefile.pamphlet   28 Oct 2003 18:09:07 -0000
+@@ -1025,7 +1025,7 @@
+ newpoint.spad.pamphlet (SUBSPACE)
+ nregset.spad.pamphlet (NTSCAT)
+ primelt.spad.pamphlet (FSPRMELT)
+-regset.spad.pamphlet (REGSET RSETGCD)
++regset.spad.pamphlet (REGSET RSETGCD RSDCMPK)
+ sregset.spad.pamphlet (SFRTCAT SRDCMPK SREGSET)
+ sttf.spad.pamphlet (STTF)
+ transsolve.spad.pamphlet (SOLVETRA)
+@@ -1038,7 +1038,7 @@
+   ${OUT}/FSPRMELT.o ${OUT}/INBFF.o    \
+   ${OUT}/LODO.o     ${OUT}/LODO1.o    ${OUT}/LODO2.o    \
+   ${OUT}/NTSCAT.o   ${OUT}/REGSET.o   \
+-  ${OUT}/RGCHAIN.o  ${OUT}/RSETGCD.o  \
++  ${OUT}/RGCHAIN.o  ${OUT}/RSETGCD.o  ${OUT}/RSDCMPK.o \
+   ${OUT}/SFRTCAT.o  ${OUT}/SIGNEF.o   ${OUT}/SNTSCAT.o  \
+   ${OUT}/SOLVETRA.o ${OUT}/SRDCMPK.o  ${OUT}/SREGSET.o  ${OUT}/STTF.o     \
+   ${OUT}/SUBSPACE.o ${OUT}/ZDSOLVE.o
+@@ -1062,7 +1062,7 @@
+ LAYER23=\
+   ${OUT}/CPIMA.o    ${OUT}/IRURPK.o   ${OUT}/LAZM3PK.o  ${OUT}/LEXTRIPK.o \
+   ${OUT}/NORMPK.o   ${OUT}/QCMPACK.o    ${OUT}/RURPK.o    ${OUT}/SFRGCD.o   \
+-  ${OUT}/SFQCMPK.o  
++  ${OUT}/SFQCMPK.o  ${OUT}/INTRVL.o ${OUT}/ODEEF.o
+ @
+ \subsection{Order}
+ The final order of the layers is determined here.
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: david.mentre@wanadoo.fr
+In-reply-to: <873cddkz1c.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Tue, 28
+	Oct 2003 19:17:03 +0100)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] clef
+References: <200310281722.h9SHMW524425@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<873cddkz1c.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca
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+
+David,
+
+Ok. The executable will be mnt/linux/bin/AXIOMsys and
+mnt/linux/bin/axiom will be a shell script again.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 13:25:55 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] clef
+References: <200310281722.h9SHMW524425@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 19:17:03 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <200310281722.h9SHMW524425@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> (Tim Daly's
+	message of "Tue, 28 Oct 2003 12:22:32 -0500")
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+
+Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> As a side-effect the mnt/linux/bin/axiom executable will now become a
+> shell script.
+
+Speaking of side-effects and TeXmacs interface, could you rename the
+Axiom binary AXIOMsys or whatever the name was with NAG axiom? And in
+general, could you follow the same naming convention that for the NAG
+version?
+
+It would allow Bill to provide only one tm_axiom TeXmacs/Axiom that
+would support both the free Axiom and NAG one.
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9CD@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 13:27:23 -0500
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+Cc: "Vadim V. Zhytnikov" <vvzhy@mail.ru>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	"'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+	(was: static lisp and rpms)
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+
+Greetings!
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> Tim,
+> 
+> I have already completed a build with --enable-static.
+> However to get things to work I did two things: 
+> 
+> 1) I replaced the gcl-2.6.1 tgz file in zips with the
+> more recent gcl-2.6.1-16 source from Camm's temporary
+> debian site. Since Camm had provided a patch in the
+> new version to handle readline in the static case.
+> 
+
+Just a clarifification here -- my patch was to address certain
+undefined symbols.  The readline/static issue I was referring to
+before has not yet been to my knowledge definitively tested or
+resolved.  I'm cc'ing the gcl developer who first reported this
+problem.  
+
+Take care,
+
+> 2) I upgraded my gcc compiler to version 3.3.2 (the
+> newest version) since other emails also indicated that
+> there were possible problems with older versions of gcc.
+> 
+> It now seems to work. 
+> 
+> I was about to upload a binary to the files section for
+> others to try (since I only have RedHat Linux boxes here,
+> moving the static binary between them is not a real test),
+> but then Juergen pointed out that we still have three
+> missing algebra files, so I decided to include those files
+> before uploading the new static binary.
+> 
+> I will also proceed as you suggest and modify the
+> Makefile.pamphlet to include a linux-static chuck, however
+> I have to think about this a bit more since the change to
+> the GCL configuration option is done in the lsp/Makefile.
+> So I think this means that it will have to be controlled
+> by the GCLVERSION environment variable. E.g. maybe
+> 
+>   GCLVERSION=gcl-2.6.1-static
+> 
+> and then it will use that to pull the right chunk
+> out of the lsp/Makefile.pamphlet. Right?
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> > -----Original Message-----
+> > From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> > Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 7:47 AM
+> > To: bill.page1@sympatico.ca
+> > Cc: camm@enhanced.com; axiom-developer@nongnu.org; daly@idsi.net;
+> > gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> > Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+> > (was: static lisp and rpms)
+> > 
+> > 
+> > Bill,
+> > 
+> > If you create a linux-static chunk in the top-level
+> > Makefile.pamphlet then you can create the static image by
+> > setting the Axiom varialble to:
+> > 
+> > export AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux-static
+> > 
+> > then we can try a static build of Axiom
+> > 
+> > Tim
+> > 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 13:37:52 -0500
+From: William Sit <wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu>
+Organization: City College of New York
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Foreign language port
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+
+Tim Daly wrote ([Axiom-developer] linux-static chunk):
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Also of note is that the Red Flag Linux person has a deep
+> interest in literate programming. Should be fun to add languages
+> to the list of things to think about. There is no reason why the
+> research work has to be in english.
+> 
+> Tim
+Tim:
+
+I think you have misunderstood my message (relevant portion quoted below). Dr.
+Nobuki Takayama (from Japan, Kobe University), I presume is the person you refer
+to, is not involved as far as I know with the Red Flag Linux project (which is
+Chinese). 
+
+According to the quoted reply from Nobuki, he is also interested in (Texmacs?)
+interface.
+
+William
+---
+William Sit wrote to Tim:
+> I returned to the States yesterday. I was fortunate that one of the scheduled
+> speakers did not show up and so I took the slot to present Axiom, to a crowd of
+> over 50 and I got a few enthusiastic response. Specifically, Prof. Nobuki
+> Takayama, one of the two invited speakers who is not only a great mathematician
+> on hypergeometric and special functions, but a very experienced programmer. You
+> can easily look up his web page from google. He has been working for 10 years or
+> more on KAN/SML and recently proposed and implemented a digital formula document
+> format where annotations, references, proofs, etc are embedded (sort of like
+> your literate programming, but using OpenMath, OpenML and XML). He is interested
+> in the Axiom project and asked a lot of questions on who are currently involved.
+> I gave him a list of the recent developers (David, Camm, etc) and tell him to
+> contact you. However, it may be better if you contact him first. His email
+> address is:
+> Nobuki Takayama <taka@math.kobe-u.ac.jp>. He also asked about the licensing and
+> which lisp. I told him what I thought (modified BSD and GCL) and said you will
+> be the one to give authentic answers. If you are writing him, please include the
+> savannah site and how to download Axiom (I ran out of CD at the conference).
+> 
+> I also obtained (downloaded) a copy of Red Flag Linux server version 4.0. I
+> burnt a CD and will give to you when I have the chance (possibly today). I have
+> just installed the basic on a virtual machine. You probably won't be able to
+> because it is in Chinese.
+> 
+> Red Flag linux is apparently the product of some company and the people at MMRC
+> (the unit that sponsored the conference and my contacts) were all using Windows
+> and do not seem to have enough people-power or interest in Red Flag linux (or
+> perhaps even linux). I gave two copies of the CD to them. I think we (I?) have
+> to contact the company, but I may have to learn how to input Chinese first (not
+> an easy project)!
+> 
+> I think the Japanese can contribute more than the Chinese, at least for now.
+
+-------- Original Message --------
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 19:46:40 +0900 (JST)
+From: Nobuki Takayama <takayama@math.kobe-u.ac.jp>
+Reply-To: takayama@math.kobe-u.ac.jp
+To: daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu
+CC: axiom@tenkan.org, daly@idsi.net, wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
+References: <200310271717.h9RHHeE31327@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+
+Dear Prof. Tim Daly;
+Thank you very much for your mail, which will help us to work on
+writing an external interface for axiom.
+Best Regards,  Nobuki
+
+
+-- 
+William Sit
+Department of Mathematics..............Email: wyscc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
+City College of New York..........................Tel: 212-650-5179
+Convent Ave at West 138th Street..................Fax: 212-862-0004
+New York, NY 10031.....Asian Symposium on Computer Mathematics 2003
+USA..........................http://www.mmrc.iss.ac.cn/~ascm/ascm03
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 14:43:30 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Juergen Weiss'" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Patch for algebra Makefile
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 14:42:22 -0500
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+
+Juergen,
+
+That is very good to hear.
+
+I made a patch that was almost identical to yours below.
+But things have not been kind to me. I am now using gcc
+3.3.2 and the GCL .configure option --enable-static.
+
+Earlier I was able to complete a compilation of all the
+algebra except the three files that you mentioned in
+your email using --enable-static. In spite of the missing
+files, the static built version was able to run all of
+the regression tests.
+
+But when I made my patch to add the three files in almost
+the same way that you have (except I did put INTRVL.o
+in layer12 which seemed to be what Tim had planned),
+unfortunately after a 6 hour compilation, the build
+failed with an error when it tried to build the databases!
+I get
+
+    >> Sytem error:
+    build error
+
+  protected-symbol-warn called with (NIL)
+  cp: cannot stat '/home/bpage/axiom-new/int/algebra/*.daase
+
+There were no other errors reported.
+
+So the apparently the make-databases failed. But oddly
+I find if I manually copy the src/share/algebra/*.daase
+databases into mnt/linus/algebra I do get what appears to
+be a fully functional Axiom system.
+
+Hmmm... I do not know the cause of this failure. There
+now seem too many variables. :( However I expect it has
+something to do with the --enable-static option.
+
+Oh and BTW Tim and Camm, issuing )lisp (si::init-readline)
+does make readline work. Aslo it only replied Value=T to me
+and not all that other stuff I reported earlier.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Juergen Weiss [mailto:weiss@uni-mainz.de]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 1:16 PM
+> To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] Patch for algebra Makefile
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> With the following patch applied, I was able
+> to compile the algebra, generate a new
+> database and regenerate the algebra with the
+> new database. INTRVL and ODEEF should 
+> probably get compiled earlier. But at least
+> it works. 
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 15:20:13 2003
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+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9D2@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 15:19:26 -0500
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+	"'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	"'gcl-devel@gnu.org'" <gcl-devel@gnu.org>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: readline and axiom
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+
+Greetings!
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> Is it usual for GCL to ouput a long stream of messages
+> following the
+> 
+>   (si::init-readline)
+> 
+> call? What I see when I start the --endable-static image
+> that was generated during the Axiom build after the
+> (si::init-readline) is
+> 
+>   starting address -T 0x86b04c0 Finished loading ... gcl_readline.o
+>   T
+>   "Gcl"
+>   1
+>   (":INTERN: ":STEP" .....
+> 
+>    etc. for about 200 lines of output or so
+> 
+>   ... "PUSH-OPTION-BINDING")
+> 
+
+This is normal for the current readline implementation.  The symbols
+are those in the current package which could be available from
+command-line completion.  We could silence this I imagine.
+
+I'd be most interested if you find any instability (e.g. segfaults) in
+a static readline build.
+
+Take care,
+
+> After which readline actually does behave as I had
+> hoped and allows me to edit.
+> 
+> Regards,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:30 PM I wrote:
+> > 
+> > On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:03 PM you wrote:
+> > 
+> > > ... readline library must be initialized at runtime via
+> > > the lisp command:
+> > > 
+> > > (si::init-readline)
+> > > 
+> > ... 
+> > > Would be nice if you could report any readline functionality
+> > > differences between the to ports, if any. 
+> > > 
+> > 
+> > Well, I did observe that when I start GCL 2.6.1 on windows,
+> > I don't have to do anything to start readline. So I guess
+> > the (si::init-readline) got executed somehow but it is not
+> > in the GCL.BAT startup file.
+> > 
+> > I'll let you know more once I actually see it work
+> > under Linux.
+> > 
+> > Cheers,
+> > Bill Page.
+> > 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 15:30:05 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 15:26:23 -0500
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+Cc: 'Camm Maguire' <camm@enhanced.com>, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: readline and axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
+Precedence: list
+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+A quick note:
+
+  axiom -eval '(si::init-readline)'
+
+(where the binary 'axiom' is the same as interpsys)
+works just fine and readline works as expected right
+from the first prompt. So I guess in the future
+axiom could be a shell script that runs AXIOMsys (alias
+interpsys) with the eval.
+
+Now if readline is work, I am not sure what will happen
+if we also implement Axiom's clef, but then clef is bsd
+... maybe we don't need readline at all?
+
+Thanks.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 15:46:51 2003
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+	id 1AEafV-0008KS-00; Tue, 28 Oct 2003 15:42:21 -0500
+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] libaldor
+References: <200310281703.h9SH3Ae23456@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 15:42:21 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310281703.h9SH3Ae23456@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <54d6chccwi.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 17
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2
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+
+Greetings!  Another minor issue reported by a Debian user (Igor
+Khavkine <igor.khavkine@utoronto.ca>):
+
+6 making /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi from /fix/g/camm/axiom/axiom-0.0.0cvs/src/doc/DeveloperNotes.pamphlet
+
+This does not produce a dvi file.
+
+Also, the installation is missing the files referrred to by the
+)summary and )copyright commands.
+
+Take care,
+
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 15:50:27 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54d6chccwi.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 28 Oct 2003 15:42:21 -0500)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] libaldor
+References: <200310281703.h9SH3Ae23456@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54d6chccwi.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
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+
+I'll fix the summary, copyright issues tonight. -- Tim
+
+
+
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 21:56:35 +0100
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+
+seems that the following definition for 
+manexp gives resonable results on common lisp
+
+
+#+(or :cmu :akcl)
+(defun manexp (u)
+  (multiple-value-bind (f e s) (decode-float u)
+                       (list (* s f) e)))
+
+
+
+
+Juergen
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: weiss@uni-mainz.de
+In-reply-to: <xzdekwxytbw.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE> (message from Juergen
+	Weiss on 28 Oct 2003 21:56:35 +0100)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+References: <xzdekwxytbw.fsf@zdvnetz.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Juergen,
+
+Where did you find a definition of manexp?
+I can't even figure out what the function might mean from the name.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 16:12:10 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:03:13 +0100 (CET)
+From: Bertfried Fauser <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
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+Reply-To: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
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+
+Hi,
+
+I tried to download axiom from the cvs and to compile it on a SuSE 8.0. I
+get alsmost immediately and error since the noweb.zip files are not found.
+Since I had deleted the whole ./axiom folder, I guess that I have
+downloaded the very recent statut of teh cvs. Do I need to install noweg
+(and what more manually or should it be comming with axiom)?
+
+Sorry for my newby question.
+BF.
+
+% |   | PD Dr Bertfried Fauser    Fachbereich Physik    Fach M 678  |
+%  \ /  Universit"at Konstanz     78457 Konstanz        Germany     |
+% (mul) Phone : +49 7531 693491   FAX : +49 7531 88-4864 or 4266 (comul)
+%   |   E-mail: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de                   / \
+%   |   URL   : http://clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de/~fauser    |   |
+
+
+
+
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
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+In-reply-to: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310282300400.15685-100000@clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+	(message from Bertfried Fauser on Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:03:13 +0100
+	(CET))
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310282300400.15685-100000@clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bertfried,
+
+The noweb file is zips/noweb-2.10a.tgz. It is automatically unpacked
+into place and patches are applied. If this file isn't in your zips
+directory then your cvs co failed. I downloaded a clean version of
+this file so it is certainly in the cvs.
+
+One other symptom that causes an early failure is an incorrect setting
+of the AXIOM variable. It should be:
+
+AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux
+
+Let me know if this helps.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9BB@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<200310232220.h9NMKXP16084@localhost.localdomain>
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+	<200310251825.h9PIPHS18551@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 16:04:20 -0500
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+
+Hi Tim!
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Your list:
+> 
+> These are gone:
+> 
+> lsp/Makefile.dvi 
+> src/algebra/Makefile.dvi 
+> src/input/Makefile.dvi 
+> src/Makefile.dvi 
+> src/interp/Makefile.dvi 
+> src/doc/Makefile.dvi
+> 
+
+Thanks!
+
+> These should never be in the "distribution" which should only contain 
+> files in the mnt directory. The obj and int directories can be deleted
+> at any time. They are only caches.
+> 
+> obj/noweb/contrib/kostas/Makefile 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/notangle.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/getline.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/match.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/modules.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/modtrees.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/strsave.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/main.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/errors.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/columns.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/nt 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/markmain.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/markup.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/markup 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/mnt.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/mnt 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/finduses.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/recognize.o 
+> obj/noweb/src/c/finduses 
+> 
+
+OK, I guess the point was that the clean target of the Makefile does
+not remove these files, at least at the time of my earlier message.
+
+> These are used by noweb. In particular, the document command will
+> invoke nt and markup. 
+> 
+> mnt/bin/lib/nt 
+> mnt/bin/lib/markup 
+> mnt/bin/lib/mnt 
+> mnt/bin/lib/finduses 
+> 
+
+Again, I think these are generated by the build, and can/should be
+removed by 'clean'.
+
+> I'll look into these. There shouldn't be Makefiles in mnt.
+> 
+> mnt/bin/Makefile.dvi 
+> 
+
+Thanks.
+
+> This should remain. It is the primary documentation root and
+> needs to be available to users before the build. It is essentially
+> the top level "README" 
+> 
+> Makefile.dvi 
+> 
+
+As a suggestion, could you provide this in .tex format instead?  At
+least for Debian packages, changes in binary files like .dvi files
+cannot be represented in a diff, so everytime this file changes, if I
+leave it in the package, I have to increment the "upstream" package
+number and install the *whole* original source tree tarball as a
+separate version in the Debian archives.  I.e., multiple axiom
+tarballs installed in their entirety perhaps diffing only in this
+file. 
+
+BTW, do you have a suggestion for the "upstream" axiom version number
+used in the Debian package?  Right now I'm using 0.0.0cvs.
+
+
+> I'm confused. You siad: "need to be executable" but you wrote: "chmod -x"
+> which will remove the execution bit.
+> 
+
+My bad -- Debian policy is that all files installed with executable
+permissions should be elf or scripts.  These files are neither, and so
+I am as you note removing the x permission.  Perhaps you could also in
+the CVS?
+
+> This part of noweb and is an internal command
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/lib/nwmtime 
+> 
+
+executable?
+
+> These are TeX macros not user commands and can't be executed.
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/tex/axiom.sty 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/axiom.sty 
+> 
+> These are the components of the boxup command which works as follows:
+> 
+> boxup foo
+> 
+> rename foo to foo.org
+> concatenate head, foo, and tail (in that order) into foo.pamphlet,
+> run notangle to extract foo from foo.pamphlet,
+> diff foo and foo.org to ensure that 
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/boxup 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/head
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/tail 
+> 
+
+OK, these sound like executables too.
+
+> These will go away:
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/Makefile 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/Makefile.pamphlet 
+> 
+
+OK
+
+> These are Axiom internal data files, not scripts
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/algebra/topics.data 
+> ./mnt/linux/doc/msgs/s2-us.msgs 
+> ./mnt/linux/algebra/gloss.text
+> 
+
+OK, so perhaps a chmod -x in CVS?
+
+> 
+> I have no idea what this does:
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/htmltoc 
+> 
+
+OK, but sounds like an executable.
+
+> This was a feeble attempt at document support. Texmacs and ADVI
+> extensions will eventually do better.
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/bin/showdvi 
+> 
+
+OK, sounds like an executable.
+
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+
+Take care,
+
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>, daly@idsi.net
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 16:27:57 -0500
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+
+On Tuesday, October 28, 2003 4:04 PM
+Camm Maguire camm@enhanced.com wrote:
+> Tim Daly wrote:
+> > 
+> > These are the components of the boxup command which
+> > works as follows:
+> > 
+> > boxup foo
+> > 
+> > rename foo to foo.org
+> > concatenate head, foo, and tail (in that order) into foo.pamphlet,
+> > run notangle to extract foo from foo.pamphlet,
+> > diff foo and foo.org to ensure that 
+> > 
+> > ./mnt/linux/bin/boxup 
+> > ./mnt/linux/bin/head
+> > ./mnt/linux/bin/tail 
+> > 
+> 
+> OK, these sound like executables too.
+>
+
+As far as I can tell Tim, these little scripts were only
+useful to you during the intial conversion of .spad to
+.spad.pamphlet. They can be deleted, no? Especially,
+because we are going to reference mnt/linux/bin in $PATH,
+I don't think you should use names like head and tail
+which conflict with standard unix filters.
+ 
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:02:41 2003
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+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 22:15:19 +0100
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+Thread-Topic: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+Thread-Index: AcOdlzzpnc3OBC+ZRfumys5IMGD0iAAAEDLg
+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+To: <daly@idsi.net>
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+
+Mantissa and Exponent. Arthur Norman pointed me
+to the definition in CSL (arith06.c) in terms of
+the C function frexp.
+
+Juergen Weiss
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net] 
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 10:05 PM
+> To: Weiss, Juergen
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+> 
+> 
+> Juergen,
+> 
+> Where did you find a definition of manexp?
+> I can't even figure out what the function might mean from the name.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:21:40 2003
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
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+
+Camm,
+
+The clean target of the Makefile eventually removes all of int and obj.
+Individual clean stanzas in Makefiles need not care. I eventually plan
+to allow individual directories to be built (the so-called PART function).
+It used to be the case that you could say make PART=doc and it would only
+build the doc directory and any required parts (e.g. noweb). It is too
+early to introduce that ability but as I continue to introduce new parts
+of Axiom we will need it. At that time I'll make sure the "clean" works.
+
+> As a suggestion, could you provide this in .tex format instead?  At
+> least for Debian packages, changes in binary files like .dvi files
+> cannot be represented in a diff, so everytime this file changes, if I
+> leave it in the package, I have to increment the "upstream" package
+> number and install the *whole* original source tree tarball as a
+> separate version in the Debian archives.  I.e., multiple axiom
+> tarballs installed in their entirety perhaps diffing only in this
+> file. 
+
+Ummm, maybe. I plan to update the README file tonight. I'll consider
+splitting out the non-Makefile related stuff into the README and 
+then have the .dvi file autoconstructed. I'll see what I can do.
+
+> BTW, do you have a suggestion for the "upstream" axiom version number
+> used in the Debian package?  Right now I'm using 0.0.0cvs.
+
+I'm unhappy with the version 3.1.4.1.5.9.2.6.5 kind of numbering scheme
+as it is completely content-free. I much prefer a date-based format such
+as YYYYMMDDxxx where xxx is an incrementing number for events on the same
+day. If Debian wants dotted-decimal format I suppose we could use
+2003.10.28 or some such. If that still isn't ok then feel free to invent
+one.
+
+I'm torn about removing the boxup commands. They provide a standard
+head and tail to functions and catch bad pamphlet files. I guess I'll
+leave them there for now.
+
+I'll chmod -x these:
+
+> These are Axiom internal data files, not scripts
+> 
+> ./mnt/linux/algebra/topics.data 
+> ./mnt/linux/doc/msgs/s2-us.msgs 
+> ./mnt/linux/algebra/gloss.text
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:29:44 2003
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+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 17:22:43 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310282222.h9SMMh029840@localhost.localdomain>
+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9D8@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: GCL 2.6.1 on Windows XP
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9D8@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom@tenkan.org, axiom-developer@nongnu.org,
+	daly@idsi.net
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+
+Bill,
+
+The boxup command is still quite useful as it provides a standard header
+and trailer for files and checks for bad pamphlet files. I'm still using
+it (used it today for clef) so I'll keep it hanging around for now.
+The head and tail files are just text. I'll rename them.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:41:09 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 17:34:39 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+Content-Type: text/plain;
+	charset="iso-8859-1"
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+
+Tim,
+
+manexp is defined in domain DFLOAT (sf.spad.pamphlet)
+as
+
+  manexp:% -> Record(MANTISSA:Integer,EXPONENT:Integer)
+
+except for some special cases it is given in terms of
+
+  MANEXP(x)$Lisp
+
+which is unfortunately apparently not to be found in
+the common lisp specs?
+
+Hence Juergen's definition
+
+  (defun manexp (u)
+  (multiple-value-bind (f e s) (decode-float u)
+                       (list (* s f) e)))
+
+But where should it go? And why doesn't the Axiom
+build complain about it's absence?
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 4:05 PM
+> To: weiss@uni-mainz.de
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+> 
+> 
+> Juergen,
+> 
+> Where did you find a definition of manexp?
+> I can't even figure out what the function might mean from the name.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:52:14 2003
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Date: 28 Oct 2003 23:45:31 +0100
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] acot function
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+
+The missing arcus cotangens function
+
+;; stolen from csl
+#+(or :cmu :akcl)
+(defun acot (a)
+  (if (>= a 0.0)
+      (if (> a 1.0)
+          (atan (/ 1.0 a))
+        (- (/ pi 2.0) (atan a)))
+    (if (< a -1.0)
+        (- pi (atan (/ -1.0 a)))
+      (+ (/ pi 2.0) (atan (- a))))))
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+	(weiss@uni-mainz.de)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4D8@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+Juergen,
+
+I've added the MANEXP definition and am testing it now.
+Thanks.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 17:59:36 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9D9@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] manexp
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9D9@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+Bill,
+
+It has been inserted into vmlisp.lisp.pamphlet.
+This is lisp so missing functions are never noted unless you try to 
+execute them. I'm building a test image now and I'll run the test cases
+against it.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 18:23:00 2003
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+	h9SN6tjl007402
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+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
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+
+
+another missing function
+
+#+:cmu
+(defun get-current-directory ()
+  (namestring (extensions::default-directory)))
+
+#+:akcl
+(defun get-current-directory ()
+  (namestring (truename "")))
+
+
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 20:42:54 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 20:38:29 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom
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+
+Camm, et al.
+
+Well I guess I was too optimistic about building
+Axiom with GCL --enable-static. After a day of
+running the cpu around the whole build cycle
+several times and in several different ways, I am
+still not (quite) able to complete a build of Axiom
+using the .configure --enable-static option. I am
+working with gcc 3.3.2 on Linux 8.0 and GCL-2.6.1-16.
+
+In fact, the Axiom build proceeds to very near
+completion. Having added three missing files to
+the build since my last successful attempt, the
+Axiom build now stalls during the make-databases
+stage - the very last stage before finishing normally.
+This seems quite odd to me since at the time the
+build goes into an infinite loop, it is just loading
+NRLIB/code - not compiling. I tried doubling the
+vssize and maxpage parameters but that seemed to
+have no effect.
+
+It turns out that I *can* manually canel and override
+this last step and simply copy the old databases files
+into the new run-time and all seems to work well and the
+resulting Axiom system even runs all of it's regression
+tests in the same way as the non-static build (though
+it is still not be able to re-build it's own databases).
+
+I am now certain that the problem is related to the
+--enable-static option since I am able to repeatably
+remove this option and have the build complete entirely
+normally. Whether I then update the databases to the
+newly built ones or not, as soon as I return to
+--enable-static, a re-build of Axiom will again fail
+at the same point (loading BBTREE.NRLIB/code).
+
+So I am about to give on this for now. But I do have
+one or two final quesitions:
+
+1) Do you think that it would it be worthwhile to
+attempt this using the unstable development branch
+version GCL 2.7.1? Are there changes in 2.7.1 that
+might have subtle effects on a static GCL?
+
+2) What about the choice of versions of gcc? Was
+my approach to upgrade to the most recent gcc 3.3.2
+a good decision or is there an earlier gcc version
+that might be happier building static binaries? Are
+there libraries besides the ones in gcc that should
+also be upgraded?
+
+3) And this more to the Axiom developers: Do you
+think there would be any point in my uploading the
+binary part of the static build even though the database
+build did not complete normally? The possible advantage
+(maybe) would be that we might have a chance to see
+if this approach of a static build will provide a
+single binary that could be run on a larger number of
+linux platforms.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 21:29:55 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+In-reply-to: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9DA@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	(Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca)
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+Cc: camm@enhanced.com, axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
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+
+Bill,
+
+You've had a painful day I see. 
+
+I can think of no reason why the build should hang loading files.
+
+If you put the static image somewhere I can reach I'll try
+it on the hp testdrive machines. 
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 22:20:22 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>
+Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 22:10:51 -0500
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
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+Reply-To: "Bill. Page1 \(E-mail\)" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+Well, I've had worse ... <grin> Actually it seemed
+like quite a productive day as far as Axiom goes.
+
+Thanks for the offer to test drive the static
+version. I am very curious about it.
+
+I have uploaded it to the files section at
+
+  https://savannah.nongnu.org/files/?group=axiom
+
+see
+
+  Axiom_Run
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net]
+> Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 9:26 PM
+> To: Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: camm@enhanced.com; daly@idsi.net; axiom-developer@nongnu.org;
+> gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: On statically linked Axiom
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> You've had a painful day I see. 
+> 
+> I can think of no reason why the build should hang loading
+> files.
+> 
+> If you put the static image somewhere I can reach I'll try
+> it on the hp testdrive machines. 
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Oct 28 22:51:36 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] changes
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+
+*,
+
+manexp, acot, and get-current-directory lisp functions added (Juergen)
+mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi is now a dvi file (Camm)
+head and tail are now boxhead, boxtail (Bill)
+the startup msgs are cleaner (me)
+summary, copyright exist and work (Camm, David)
+more input tests run (me)
+rename r2.*.input.pamphlet to r2*.input.pamphlet (me)
+expanded README (Camm)
+removed Makefile.dvi (Camm)
+added RSDCMPK, INTRVL, ODEEF (Juergen, David)
+added Clef (Bill)
+expanded DeveloperNotes (me)
+
+clef still needs to be enabled. To do that I have to change
+axiom to a shell script and that isn't done yet.
+
+A couple of the input files are still failing. Check 
+src/input/Makefile.pamphlet and look for VALUESTACK.
+
+Virtually all of the MANEXP failures are now errors of the form:
+Error: (7) is not of type NUMBER
+which leads me to believe that the MANEXP definition is somewhat amiss.
+
+The GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY bug has been solved.
+The ACOT bug has been solved but now COT is undefined.
+
+ODEEF's test file ode.input fails
+
+
+I'll check these changes in soon. I want to rebuild from scratch
+once more to make sure they work. Paranoia, yaknow?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 04:51:43 2003
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+From: "Weiss, Juergen" <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
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+
+Sorry, my fault. I did not have any testcases from
+axiom. MANEXP should return a cons, not a list.
+So please exchange list with cons.
+
+Juergen
+
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX:
++49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: root [mailto:daly@idsi.net] 
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 4:44 AM
+> To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Axiom-developer] changes
+> 
+> 
+> *,
+> 
+> manexp, acot, and get-current-directory lisp functions added (Juergen)
+> mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi is now a dvi file (Camm)
+> head and tail are now boxhead, boxtail (Bill)
+> the startup msgs are cleaner (me)
+> summary, copyright exist and work (Camm, David)
+> more input tests run (me)
+> rename r2.*.input.pamphlet to r2*.input.pamphlet (me)
+> expanded README (Camm)
+> removed Makefile.dvi (Camm)
+> added RSDCMPK, INTRVL, ODEEF (Juergen, David)
+> added Clef (Bill)
+> expanded DeveloperNotes (me)
+> 
+> clef still needs to be enabled. To do that I have to change
+> axiom to a shell script and that isn't done yet.
+> 
+> A couple of the input files are still failing. Check 
+> src/input/Makefile.pamphlet and look for VALUESTACK.
+> 
+> Virtually all of the MANEXP failures are now errors of the form:
+> Error: (7) is not of type NUMBER
+> which leads me to believe that the MANEXP definition is 
+> somewhat amiss.
+> 
+> The GET-CURRENT-DIRECTORY bug has been solved.
+> The ACOT bug has been solved but now COT is undefined.
+> 
+> ODEEF's test file ode.input fails
+> 
+> 
+> I'll check these changes in soon. I want to rebuild from scratch
+> once more to make sure they work. Paranoia, yaknow?
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 07:36:47 2003
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] changes
+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4DB@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+Juergen,
+
+The "is not a NUMBER" tests all succeed with your new fix. Thanks.
+COT and ASEC are undefined.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 07:39:32 2003
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+	(weiss@uni-mainz.de)
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+References: <4C0355A6F95639418CEE43EB898354FC03BAA4DB@EXSTORE1.zdv.uni-mainz.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net
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+
+no problem. i'm rerunning the tests now.
+
+any chance you can find a definition for COT?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 07:47:53 2003
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+To: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9DA@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 29 Oct 2003 07:43:25 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: On statically linked Axiom
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+
+Greetings!
+
+Well, while I can't imagine anything in the loader which would
+infinite loop, this is the only place in the gcl code relevant to the
+experience you report below (sfaslbfd.c).
+
+Neither 2.7.0 nor other gcc version is likely to help.  The debugging
+steps are to run a 'nm' on the object file failing to load, an nm on
+the image failing to do the loading, and to make sure no unknown
+symbol was written into the .o.  Then run in gdb, with the build
+having the --enable-debug flag set, and step through the loop in
+fasload where the bfd_relocate_section_contents call is made to see
+what's happening.
+
+>From what you report, I'd expect a simple fix to present itself
+readily, like the recent patch from -15 to -16.  As to my earlier
+comment regarding the gcc linker warnings in writing raw_gcl, I
+believe these refer to a few C library routines used by gcl which do
+the equivalent of a dlopen anyway -- I imagine they are rarely used,
+and we could in principle disable them if needed (for extra safety)
+when the --enable-static option is selected. So in principle there
+should be nothing which would absolutely stand in the way of a static
+build if/when desired. 
+
+If this is important to axiom, please let me know, and I'll try to
+debug the build myself.
+
+Take care,
+
+"Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca> writes:
+
+> Camm, et al.
+> 
+> Well I guess I was too optimistic about building
+> Axiom with GCL --enable-static. After a day of
+> running the cpu around the whole build cycle
+> several times and in several different ways, I am
+> still not (quite) able to complete a build of Axiom
+> using the .configure --enable-static option. I am
+> working with gcc 3.3.2 on Linux 8.0 and GCL-2.6.1-16.
+> 
+> In fact, the Axiom build proceeds to very near
+> completion. Having added three missing files to
+> the build since my last successful attempt, the
+> Axiom build now stalls during the make-databases
+> stage - the very last stage before finishing normally.
+> This seems quite odd to me since at the time the
+> build goes into an infinite loop, it is just loading
+> NRLIB/code - not compiling. I tried doubling the
+> vssize and maxpage parameters but that seemed to
+> have no effect.
+> 
+> It turns out that I *can* manually canel and override
+> this last step and simply copy the old databases files
+> into the new run-time and all seems to work well and the
+> resulting Axiom system even runs all of it's regression
+> tests in the same way as the non-static build (though
+> it is still not be able to re-build it's own databases).
+> 
+> I am now certain that the problem is related to the
+> --enable-static option since I am able to repeatably
+> remove this option and have the build complete entirely
+> normally. Whether I then update the databases to the
+> newly built ones or not, as soon as I return to
+> --enable-static, a re-build of Axiom will again fail
+> at the same point (loading BBTREE.NRLIB/code).
+> 
+> So I am about to give on this for now. But I do have
+> one or two final quesitions:
+> 
+> 1) Do you think that it would it be worthwhile to
+> attempt this using the unstable development branch
+> version GCL 2.7.1? Are there changes in 2.7.1 that
+> might have subtle effects on a static GCL?
+> 
+> 2) What about the choice of versions of gcc? Was
+> my approach to upgrade to the most recent gcc 3.3.2
+> a good decision or is there an earlier gcc version
+> that might be happier building static binaries? Are
+> there libraries besides the ones in gcc that should
+> also be upgraded?
+> 
+> 3) And this more to the Axiom developers: Do you
+> think there would be any point in my uploading the
+> binary part of the static build even though the database
+> build did not complete normally? The possible advantage
+> (maybe) would be that we might have a chance to see
+> if this approach of a static build will provide a
+> single binary that could be run on a larger number of
+> linux platforms.
+> 
+> Cheers,
+> Bill Page.
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: Juergen Weiss <weiss@uni-mainz.de>
+Date: 29 Oct 2003 14:35:25 +0100
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+Lines: 23
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+MIME-Version: 1.0
+Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
+X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] cot and asec
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+
+Here the lisp version of the C versions in csl
+One problem: the formula may work for real arguments
+only.
+
+
+;; stolen from csl
+#+(or :cmu :akcl)
+(defun cot (a)
+  (if (or (> a 1000.0) (< a -1000.0))
+      (/ (cos a) (sin a))
+    (/ 1.0 (tan a))))
+
+;; stolen from csl
+#+(or :cmu :akcl)
+(defun asec (a)
+  (if (and (a > -1.0) (a < 1.0))
+      0.0
+    (acos (/ 1.0 a))))
+
+-- 
+Juergen Weiss	  | Universitaet Mainz, Zentrum fuer Datenverarbeitung,
+weiss@uni-mainz.de| 55099 Mainz, Tel: +49(6131)39-26361, FAX: +49(6131)39-26407
+
+
+
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+From: Mike Dewar <miked@nag.co.uk>
+To: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: libaldor
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+	06:58:19PM +0100
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+
+On Tue, Oct 28, 2003 at 06:58:19PM +0100, hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+wrote:
+> >> How was libaxiom.al produced?
+>  
+> > I no longer remember exactly. But Aldor can generate .c files which
+> > get compiled to .o files. I believe these are boxed up into a .a
+> > library using ar.
+> 
+> That is correct. My question was directed to the sources. There must
+> be some .as files somewhere which where used to produce libaxiom.a. 
+> >From them I could perhaps make a link and a corresponding description
+> available. At least I would like to have a look into it to see how
+> much work it would be.
+libaxiom.al is a "mock" library to allow you to compile Aldor code which
+will run inside Axiom.  It contains equivalent definitions of all the
+Axiom types which IIRC are created by first making Axiom generate ".ax"
+files for each Axiom constructor, then converting those to ".ao" files
+using Aldor, then making them into a library using "ar".  The ".ax"
+files contain Lisp representations of the signatures of the
+constructor's exports.  All the code for doing this was in the src/as
+directory I sent to Tim when we open-sourced Axiom.
+
+> > The algebra connection is a fluffier subject 
+> 
+> Since I don't need the axiom algebra, the connection to algebra
+> domains is not so important (at least not at the moment). Anyway, I
+> guess that connection from my private types to axiom algebra types is
+> just a matter of data conversion. I would do this when I see need for
+> it.
+If you want to run your code inside Axiom then you just need to compile
+against libaldor and )lib it.
+
+We did some experiments with running Aldor code in a "clean" Axiom
+interpreter (i.e. one with no algebra and no databases).  This didn't
+really work because the interpreter code is riddled with assumptions
+about the existence of particular constructors and operations.  It could
+probably be made to work with a bit of effort however.
+
+Mike.
+
+________________________________________________________________________
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+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 12:10:51 2003
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+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 11:26:56 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310291626.h9TGQuC12694@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: hemmecke@risc.uni-linz.ac.at
+Cc: miked@nag.co.uk, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] libaldor sources
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+It appears that I have the sources... somewhere.
+I'll look for them tonight.
+I haven't explored the Aldor connection yet.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
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+To: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310282300400.15685-100000@clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 19:01:59 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0310282300400.15685-100000@clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+	(Bertfried
+	Fauser's message of "Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:03:13 +0100 (CET)")
+Message-ID: <87ad7j3otk.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+
+Hello Bertfried,
+
+Bertfried Fauser <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de> writes:
+
+> I tried to download axiom from the cvs and to compile it on a SuSE 8.0. I
+> get alsmost immediately and error since the noweb.zip files are not found.
+
+What is the content of your AXIOM environment variable?
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Camm Maguire'" <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:16:18 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, "'daly@idsi.net'" <daly@idsi.net>,
+	gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Gcl-devel] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Camm,
+
+Thanks for the describing the debugging approach.
+I do not (yet) feel familiar enough with these tools
+to do what you suggest. As time permits, I may be able
+to attempt this. I am not really sure how important this
+is to the Axiom project as such, unless it should turn
+out that static builds really can be run on a large
+number of platforms without re-building... I consider
+the current attempt as simply an experiment. Perhaps
+Tim can comment further.
+
+Anyway, last night I ran yet another clean re-build with
+up to date Axiom sources and the --enable-static option
+on GCL. As before, it ran all the way through until the
+final make-databases step, but then after doing the
+autoloads I got the following messages:
+
+  ...
+  Loading /home/bpage/axiom-new/mnt/linux/autoload/br-saturn.
+
+Unrecoverable error: mark botch.
+make [3]: *** [db] Error 134
+make [3]: Leaving directory '/home/bpage/axiom-new/src/algebra'
+
+...
+
+Now a quick search of the Axiom and GCL source reveals that
+the error message 'mark botch' comes from either
+
+  o/gbc.c
+
+or
+
+  o/sgbc.c
+
+in GCL. I presume that this is telling me something about
+a garbage collection error?
+
+I guess that this might explain why this error message is
+different than the behaviour I saw yesterday but occurs at
+roughly the same point in the Axiom build.
+
+The only thing that I did different in this most recent
+build was to remove the --enable-vssize --enable-maxpage
+and --enable-statsysfd from the .configure. In fact the
+configure statement is just
+
+  ./configure --enable-static
+
+So far as I can tell, the other options specified in the
+current Axiom lsp/Makefile.pamphlet are either unnecessary
+or defaults. I would expect a more explicit message from
+GCL if we reached any of these limits or had a conflicting
+choice of options. But I am rather unclear about this, so
+of course let me know if I am wrong ...
+
+So, were too from here? I feel even less certain about
+debugging GCL garbage collection then I do about hunting
+for undefined symbols. <grin>
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Camm Maguire [mailto:camm@enhanced.com]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 7:43 AM
+> To: Page, Bill
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org; 'daly@idsi.net'; gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Gcl-devel] RE: On statically linked Axiom
+> 
+> 
+> Greetings!
+> 
+> Well, while I can't imagine anything in the loader which
+> would infinite loop, this is the only place in the gcl code
+> relevant to the experience you report below (sfaslbfd.c).
+> 
+> Neither 2.7.0 nor other gcc version is likely to help.  The
+> debugging steps are to run a 'nm' on the object file failing to
+> load, an nm on the image failing to do the loading, and to make
+> sure no unknown symbol was written into the .o.  Then run in
+> gdb, with the build having the --enable-debug flag set, and
+> step through the loop in fasload where the
+> bfd_relocate_section_contents call is made to see
+> what's happening.
+> 
+> From what you report, I'd expect a simple fix to present itself
+> readily, like the recent patch from -15 to -16.  As to my earlier
+> comment regarding the gcc linker warnings in writing raw_gcl,
+> I believe these refer to a few C library routines used by gcl
+> which do the equivalent of a dlopen anyway -- I imagine they are
+> rarely used, and we could in principle disable them if needed
+> (for extra safety) when the --enable-static option is selected.
+> So in principle there should be nothing which would absolutely
+> stand in the way of a static build if/when desired. 
+> 
+> If this is important to axiom, please let me know, and I'll
+> try to debug the build myself.
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 13:26:57 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'David MENTRE'" <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: RE: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:20:50 -0500
+MIME-Version: 1.0
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+
+David, Tim;
+
+I find this use of the AXIOM environment variable
+awkward and confusing. Wouldn't it be better simply
+to provide SYS as part of the make command and have
+make set up the required environment? E.g.
+
+  make linux
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David MENTRE [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 1:02 PM
+> To: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Bertfried,
+> 
+> Bertfried Fauser <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de> writes:
+> 
+> > I tried to download axiom from the cvs and to compile it
+> > on a SuSE 8.0. I get alsmost immediately and error since
+> > the noweb.zip files are not found.
+> 
+> What is the content of your AXIOM environment variable?
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+> -- 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 13:57:39 2003
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+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:17:15 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310291817.h9TIHFJ22935@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Mark Botch
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+
+Bill,
+
+Try:
+
+make SPD=`pwd` SYS=linux
+
+Tim 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 14:00:13 2003
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+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:14:47 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310291814.h9TIElp22048@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Mark Botch
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+
+Bill,
+
+Guffaw. I owe you. One of my old areas of expertise is memory
+management and I spent quite a while talking to Bill Schelter
+about akcl garbage collection. One of the phases of garbage
+collection is called the "mark" phase where you mark all of
+the "live" objects (then you collect the dead objects and
+reclaim memory). The error message is "mark botch". I got it
+so often that I adopted the pseudonym of "Mark Botch" when
+writing to Bill.
+
+Clearly the garbage collector is unhappy. I'll look at the
+code and see if I can figure out why.
+
+Tim "Mark Botch" Daly
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 14:43:09 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 14:40:07 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: Mark Botch
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+
+Tim,
+
+Yes, I like that better. But it will not correctly
+set the AXIOM environment variable, will it? Later
+on in the build it seems to me that it will fail (or
+doing something unpredictable) if AXIOM is not set
+correctly.
+
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Tim Daly [mailto:daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 1:17 PM
+> To: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Mark Botch
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Try:
+> 
+> make SPD=`pwd` SYS=linux
+> 
+> Tim 
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 15:21:11 2003
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+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 14:40:43 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310291940.h9TJehQ30094@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Mark Botch
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+
+Bill,
+
+The latest CVS has "make install" but it is not complete.
+I can't decide how to put the Axiom shell script on your PATH.
+If the "make install" knows the install location and the SYS type
+we can modify the Axiom script to automatically set the AXIOM 
+variable. 
+
+I have to figure out how other systems handle this problem.
+
+Tim 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 15:43:31 2003
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+From: "Page, Bill" <Bill.Page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+To: "'Tim Daly'" <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 15:39:23 -0500
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+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: Mark Botch
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+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+
+Tim,
+
+I think
+
+  make install
+
+usually installs to a directory that is already
+in (or expected to be in) the user's path. E.g.
+/usr/local/bin ... etc. This directory is specified
+during the ./configure or defaulted. Thus the
+install often requires root priveleges.
+
+In many packages it is possible for a user to run
+the built application without an install, but of
+course then the user must expect to modify their
+path manually or at least cd to the appropriate
+bin directory first. E.g.
+
+  cd axiom/mnt/linux/bin
+  axiom
+
+So I guess the best thing would be to have the
+build initially set
+
+  export AXIOM=${SPAD}/mnt/${SYS}
+
+and also copy it into the mnt/linux/bin/axiom script
+so that the user could run without installing.
+
+Then during
+
+  make install
+
+the entire mnt/linux/bin directory could be copied
+to the final target install directory and the 'axiom'
+script could be updated with the correct location
+and stored in the target directory.
+
+At least I think that's how it usually goes ...
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: Tim Daly [mailto:daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu]
+> Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 2:41 PM
+> To: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Mark Botch
+> 
+> 
+> Bill,
+> 
+> The latest CVS has "make install" but it is not complete.
+> I can't decide how to put the Axiom shell script on your PATH.
+> If the "make install" knows the install location and the SYS type
+> we can modify the Axiom script to automatically set the AXIOM 
+> variable. 
+> 
+> I have to figure out how other systems handle this problem.
+> 
+> Tim 
+> 
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 17:45:02 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 29 Oct 2003 17:44:17 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310291814.h9TIElp22048@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <541xsvmzpa.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 46
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Recent Debian package release
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 22:45:00 -0000
+
+Greetings!  Just released another Debian package of the latest CVS,
+and ran into a problem which will affect ia64, mips, and alpha, all of
+which built axiom until recently.  These platforms relocate/load
+objects using dlopen (pending a bfd enabling patch possible in
+principle), and the build has hit the limit of the maximum number of
+open files (1024).  Is there any intermediate image which could be
+built with the objects preloaded which would minimize the number of
+load attempts made later in the build?
+
+This is perhaps the chief weakness of the dlopen relocation option vis
+a vis the bfd or custom relocation option.
+
+Take care,
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Guffaw. I owe you. One of my old areas of expertise is memory
+> management and I spent quite a while talking to Bill Schelter
+> about akcl garbage collection. One of the phases of garbage
+> collection is called the "mark" phase where you mark all of
+> the "live" objects (then you collect the dead objects and
+> reclaim memory). The error message is "mark botch". I got it
+> so often that I adopted the pseudonym of "Mark Botch" when
+> writing to Bill.
+> 
+> Clearly the garbage collector is unhappy. I'll look at the
+> code and see if I can figure out why.
+> 
+> Tim "Mark Botch" Daly
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Wed Oct 29 20:31:14 2003
+Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.24)
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Mark Botch
+References: <200310291814.h9TIElp22048@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 29 Oct 2003 20:24:25 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310291814.h9TIElp22048@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Message-ID: <543cdb1prq.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Lines: 56
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+Cc: Bill.page@drdc-rddc.gc.ca, axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+:-)
+
+(wondering what neat pseudonym still left for me to claim...)
+
+Just a quick note to state that a significant gbc leak was plugged
+some months ago due to a report by an acl2 user, which involved the
+interaction of contiguous page garbage collection and SGC toggling.
+Object modules are loaded into contiguous pages.  Wondering if there
+is any significant size difference with --enable-static.  Wondering
+also if axiom uses sgc.  Only time I've ever seen a mark botch is when
+heap memory somehow gets allocated past heap_end and into either the
+hole or the relocatable block section.  It may be useful to recall
+that GCL memory is organized into non-relocatable pages of various
+types below heap_end, then a hole of size holesize, then a relocatable
+block section up to core_end, which can be extended up to maxpages.
+
+I must say I haven't seen anything like this in ages -- the gbc has
+been extremely stable since I've worked on gcl save for the one leak
+mentioned above.  Of course I'd be most appreciative of any uncovering
+of a bug in this area.
+
+Take care,
+
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Bill,
+> 
+> Guffaw. I owe you. One of my old areas of expertise is memory
+> management and I spent quite a while talking to Bill Schelter
+> about akcl garbage collection. One of the phases of garbage
+> collection is called the "mark" phase where you mark all of
+> the "live" objects (then you collect the dead objects and
+> reclaim memory). The error message is "mark botch". I got it
+> so often that I adopted the pseudonym of "Mark Botch" when
+> writing to Bill.
+> 
+> Clearly the garbage collector is unhappy. I'll look at the
+> code and see if I can figure out why.
+> 
+> Tim "Mark Botch" Daly
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 03:52:21 2003
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+From: Bertfried Fauser <fauser@spock.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+To: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+In-Reply-To: <200310282125.h9SLPZN29741@localhost.localdomain>
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+
+On Tue, 28 Oct 2003, root wrote:
+
+Hi,
+
+sorry for my compiling ignorance, but I just wished to have a newly build
+axiom, perhaps I should use the compiled version, however...
+
+> The noweb file is zips/noweb-2.10a.tgz.
+
+This file is in place and loos OK
+
+> One other symptom that causes an early failure is an incorrect setting
+> of the AXIOM variable. It should be:
+>
+> AXIOM=(yourpath)/axiom/mnt/linux
+
+I have set this variable
+
+Compilation fails nevetheless....
+
+13 making noweb
+tar: /home/axiomgnu/new/zips/noweb-2.10a.tgz: Cannot open: No such file or
+directory
+tar: Error is not recoverable: exiting now
+tar: Child returned status 2
+tar: Error exit delayed from previous errors
+/bin/sh: cd: /home/axiomgnu/new/obj/noweb/src: No such file or directory
+/bin/sh: ./awkname: No such file or directory
+/bin/sh: cd: /home/axiomgnu/new/obj/noweb/src/c: No such file or directory
+cp: cannot stat `/home/axiomgnu/new/zips/noweb.modules.c.patch': No such
+file or directory
+
+I dound in the makefile under taget 13 that it is looked for ${ZIPS}, at
+the beginning of the makefile ${ZIPS} is set to ZIPS=${SPD}/zips, but
+${SPD} is set to /home/axiom/new, which fails on my machine....
+
+After setting this to ~/axiom/new/new, it unpacks the noweb...tgz but the
+compilation fails with another error, which might also be a path
+problem....
+
+13 making noweb
+/bin/sh: cd:
+/Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser/axiom/new/new/obj/noweb: No such
+file or directory
+/bin/sh: cd:
+/Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser/axiom/new/new/obj/noweb/src: No such
+file or directory
+/bin/sh: ./awkname: No such file or directory
+/bin/sh: cd:
+/Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser/axiom/new/new/obj/noweb/src/c: No
+such file or directory
+can't find file to patch at input line 3
+Perhaps you should have used the -p or --strip option?
+The text leading up to this was:
+--------------------------
+|--- modules.c  Wed Mar 28 13:49:22 2001
+|+++ modules.c.tpd      Mon Nov 18 22:26:35 2002
+--------------------------
+File to patch:
+
+> Let me know if this helps.
+
+regretful to say NO
+
+cheers
+BF.
+
+PS: Please note that I am an "compiling ingnorant", (I need
+./configure, make, make install to run smoothly otherwise I am lost)
+but that might be 99% of the potential users too.
+
+% |   | PD Dr Bertfried Fauser    Fachbereich Physik    Fach M 678  |
+%  \ /  Universit"at Konstanz     78457 Konstanz        Germany     |
+% (mul) Phone : +49 7531 693491   FAX : +49 7531 88-4864 or 4266 (comul)
+%   |   E-mail: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de                   / \
+%   |   URL   : http://clifford.physik.uni-konstanz.de/~fauser    |   |
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 07:10:45 2003
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+Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 07:04:21 -0500
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
+In-reply-to: <Pine.LNX.4.33.0310300842370.29427-100000@bunsen.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+	(message from Bertfried Fauser on Thu, 30 Oct 2003 08:50:43 +0100
+	(CET))
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.33.0310300842370.29427-100000@bunsen.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Bertfried,
+
+It appears that your version of Axiom came from axiom.tenkan.org.
+You probably have a variable called CVSROOT defined somewhere
+that tells you where to get Axiom. Try typing:
+
+echo $CVSROOT
+
+If you any answer at all then you need to unset this variable:
+
+unset CVSROOT
+
+You also need to find where the variable gets set. Look in your .bashrc file.
+
+The CVS for Axiom is now on savannah. The following steps should work:
+
+1) move to your home directory:
+
+   cd /Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser
+
+2) get rid of the old axiom code:
+
+rm -rf axiom
+
+3) log in to savannah. When it prompts you for a password just hit enter:
+
+cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom login
+
+4) get the latest version:
+
+cvs -d:pserver:anoncvs@subversions.gnu.org:/cvsroot/axiom co axiom
+
+5) cd to the new directory:
+
+cd axiom
+
+6) set the AXIOM variable:
+
+export AXIOM=/Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser/axiom/mnt/linux
+
+7) start the build:
+
+make
+
+Try this. Save the console. If it fails send me the console.
+
+Thanks,
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 14:50:21 2003
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+Received: from oops (ARennes-303-1-8-171.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr [80.14.144.171])
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+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 20:47:09 +0100
+Message-ID: <877k2mh5j6.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux)
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+Sender: =?iso-8859-1?Q?David_Mentr=E9?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Build fails on mnt/linux/lib/summary due to
+ missing mnt/linux/lib/ directory
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 19:50:19 -0000
+
+Hello,
+
+I tried to build latest CVS from Axiom on a previous build, just by
+updating required files.
+
+The build failed when making mnt/linux/lib/summary because the
+mnt/linux/lib/ directory was not made.
+
+Making the above directory solves the issue.
+
+I suppose that this directory was made in a previous step, not done
+because I updated on modified files from the CVS. I don't consider this
+a bug, my email is just for information (and if other people fall on
+this issue :).
+
+Yours,
+d.
+
+PS: Another warning during the build:
+
+6 making /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-i386/axiom/mnt/linux/doc/DeveloperNotes.dvi from /home/david/pub/axiom-libre/axiom-i386/axiom/src/doc/DeveloperNotes.pamphlet
+The root module <<*>> was not defined.
+
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 14:56:54 2003
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+To: daly@idsi.net
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.33.0310300842370.29427-100000@bunsen.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+	<200310301204.h9UC4KP32459@localhost.localdomain>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 20:56:15 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <200310301204.h9UC4KP32459@localhost.localdomain> (daly@idsi.net's
+	message of "Thu, 30 Oct 2003 07:04:21 -0500")
+Message-ID: <87y8v2fqjk.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
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+
+Bertfied,
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+>    cd /Net/clifford/CliDiskInt/Users/fauser
+
+you should also notice that Axiom has currently a bug that prevents it
+to build from a directory with upper characters in the directory path.
+
+Patches to solve this issue have been floating around but I don't know
+if they have been integrated in current CVS tree. You have been warned!
+;-) 
+
+Go
+od luck and let us know of any issue,
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
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+In-reply-to: <87y8v2fqjk.fsf@wanadoo.fr> (message from David MENTRE on Thu, 30
+	Oct 2003 20:56:15 +0100)
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] compilation (SuSE 8.0)
+References: <Pine.LNX.4.33.0310300842370.29427-100000@bunsen.physik.uni-konstanz.de>
+	<200310301204.h9UC4KP32459@localhost.localdomain>
+	<87y8v2fqjk.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, Bertfried.Fauser@uni-konstanz.de
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+
+David,
+
+That isn't Bertfried's current problem but it would have shown up later.
+Good catch. I'll move the fix up higher on the todo list.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 22:20:04 2003
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+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Gcl-devel] RE: On statically linked Axiom
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+
+Greetings!  can someone please save me a bit of time and tell me how I
+can run the database rebuilding step by hand (i.e. outside the
+Makefile) -- the path setup and file locations (or absences) are
+eluding me.
+
+Take care,
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 22:28:50 -0500
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54r80u3xk0.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 30 Oct 2003 22:17:51 -0500)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9DE@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<54r80u3xk0.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, gcl-devel@gnu.org,
+	daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] make-databases
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Camm,
+
+First, move to where the .NRLIB files are.
+The databases are built using the *.NRLIB/info files.
+
+  cd int/algebra
+
+Then start interpsys and give it the lisp command:
+
+  )lisp (make-databases "" nil) | (yourpath)/obj/bin/interpsys
+
+I'm still pondering your "split" request for database file loads.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Oct 30 22:48:14 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54r80u3xk0.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 30 Oct 2003 22:17:51 -0500)
+References: <68207C39878CC54695B4E7A1D58E098124D9DE@corporateex.drdc-rddc.gc.ca>
+	<54r80u3xk0.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, gcl-devel@gnu.org,
+	daly@idsi.net
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] make-databases
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Camm,
+
+First, move to where the .NRLIB files are.
+The databases are built using the *.NRLIB/info files.
+
+  cd int/algebra
+
+Then start interpsys and give it the lisp command:
+
+  )lisp (make-databases "" nil) | (yourpath)/obj/bin/interpsys
+
+I'm still pondering your "split" request for database file loads.
+
+In more detail: 
+
+The make-databases function walks across the NRLIB/info files 
+extracting information for documentation (e.g. the browse.daase)
+or other uses. So, in the case of browse.daase, it extracts
+documentation strings, compresses them (see src/interp/daase.lisp),
+and writes them out into a random access file format. 
+
+The random access file format has 3 parts: 
+
+an initial pair, 
+a sequence of s-expressions, 
+a list of lists. 
+
+The list of lists is the index. To look something up in one of these
+files you read the first number (N), seek N bytes into the file, and
+do a (read). Read will return the list of lists.  For each domain
+there is a list. 
+
+Each list consists of indexes into the file (any non-negative number)
+or immediate data (a symbol, a string, or a negative number). If the
+list item is a number (M) you start from the top of the file, seek M
+bytes into the file and call (uncompress (read)).
+
+I'm sure there are more details I missed but the src/interp/daase.lisp
+has the actual code.
+
+The split request is going to be a challenge. I think I need to figure
+out how to dynamically add one file to the databases. Once I can do
+this I can split the database build into any convenient step size.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 07:26:28 2003
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+From: root <daly@idsi.net>
+To: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] changelog
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+
+*,
+
+The bsdsignal.c and openpty.c functions have been modified for clef (me)
+clef has now exists and is used by default (Bill)
+axiom is now a shell script (*)
+AXIOMsys is the name of the axiom image file (*)
+several unused files were deleted (me)
+configure exists, works, and is documented (*)
+make install exists, works, and is documented (*)
+The axiom socket message is gone (me)
+mnt/linux/lib is created before it is used (David)
+COT and ASEC are defined (Juergen)
+
+So basically you now do:
+
+./configure
+make
+make install
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 10:53:31 2003
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+	<54r80u3xk0.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310310343.h9V3hfJ01446@localhost.localdomain>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 31 Oct 2003 10:51:25 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, bill.page1@sympatico.ca, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] make-databases
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+
+Greetings!
+
+root <daly@idsi.net> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> First, move to where the .NRLIB files are.
+> The databases are built using the *.NRLIB/info files.
+> 
+>   cd int/algebra
+> 
+> Then start interpsys and give it the lisp command:
+> 
+>   )lisp (make-databases "" nil) | (yourpath)/obj/bin/interpsys
+> 
+> I'm still pondering your "split" request for database file loads.
+> 
+
+Thanks, Tim.  Please feel free to say it is too difficult if that is
+the case.  It is likely the shortest route to axiom on mips(el),
+alpha, ia64, and hppa, but in principle we should build a bfd backend
+for those targets at some point, and this may provide incentive :-).
+The latter is a large task, and I likely will not have time for it
+until 2004, but should be doable, though ugly.  The following page
+describes the state of bfd relocation pretty well:
+
+http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/info/insight/bfdint_6.html
+
+Apparently these newer target machines are using the 'new linker'
+mechanism which bypasses the bfd_get_relocated_section_contents
+strategy we're using entirely.  Instead, they provide a 'backend'
+specific 'relocate_section' function, an example call of which can be
+found in the elflink.h file in the binutils/bfd subdir of the gcl
+source tree.  While in principle such a call might work across the
+board, it appears to use quite a few auxiliary structures which
+require building before the call.  Energetic volunteers appreciated!
+Perhaps if anyone feels motivated, they could fork the sfaslbfd.c file
+into sfaslbfd_new.c, and rewrite the section relocation calls using
+bfd's 'new' linker strategy.  (While I'm sure he is too busy, we do
+have such a bfd-knowledgeable person on the gcl team, right Aurelian?
+:-)).
+
+Take care,
+
+> In more detail: 
+> 
+> The make-databases function walks across the NRLIB/info files 
+> extracting information for documentation (e.g. the browse.daase)
+> or other uses. So, in the case of browse.daase, it extracts
+> documentation strings, compresses them (see src/interp/daase.lisp),
+> and writes them out into a random access file format. 
+> 
+> The random access file format has 3 parts: 
+> 
+> an initial pair, 
+> a sequence of s-expressions, 
+> a list of lists. 
+> 
+> The list of lists is the index. To look something up in one of these
+> files you read the first number (N), seek N bytes into the file, and
+> do a (read). Read will return the list of lists.  For each domain
+> there is a list. 
+> 
+> Each list consists of indexes into the file (any non-negative number)
+> or immediate data (a symbol, a string, or a negative number). If the
+> list item is a number (M) you start from the top of the file, seek M
+> bytes into the file and call (uncompress (read)).
+> 
+> I'm sure there are more details I missed but the src/interp/daase.lisp
+> has the actual code.
+> 
+> The split request is going to be a challenge. I think I need to figure
+> out how to dynamically add one file to the databases. Once I can do
+> this I can split the database build into any convenient step size.
+> 
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 11:49:02 2003
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+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 11:08:10 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310311608.h9VG8Ae32761@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] make-databases
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Camm,
+
+The databases do not contain system-specific code. 
+It would be possible to skip the make-database code for particular
+platforms and just untar a copy into the mnt directory.
+
+If you have the right switches to run gcl on the alpha I'd be
+most interested. I have access to a dozen or so alpha machines
+on the HP Testdrive website. If I could build GCL there I could
+probably build Axiom there.
+
+We're also trying to get Axiom on a Zaurus 5600. Do you know if
+GCL runs there? It's an Intel X-scale processor running Lineo Linux.
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 12:20:37 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+References: <200310311608.h9VG8Ae32761@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 31 Oct 2003 12:19:44 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] make-databases
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+
+Greetings!
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Camm,
+> 
+> The databases do not contain system-specific code. 
+> It would be possible to skip the make-database code for particular
+> platforms and just untar a copy into the mnt directory.
+> 
+
+i.e. cp src/share/algebra/*daase mnt/linux/algebra/ ?  Can I do this
+at the start of the build?
+
+> If you have the right switches to run gcl on the alpha I'd be
+> most interested. I have access to a dozen or so alpha machines
+> on the HP Testdrive website. If I could build GCL there I could
+> probably build Axiom there.
+> 
+
+Axiom does build on Debian alpha, at least.  --disable-statsysbfd
+--enable-dlopen are needed.  You will also need to build a few of the
+intermediary images with the calls to (compiler::link...  I posted a
+while ago.  These work everywhere, but are required on dlopen systems,
+as unexec will not dump dlopen'ed loaded modules.  I can repost the
+details if needed.
+
+> We're also trying to get Axiom on a Zaurus 5600. Do you know if
+> GCL runs there? It's an Intel X-scale processor running Lineo Linux.
+> 
+
+I thought the Zaurus was an ARM processor?  If so, gcl is fully
+supported there without dlopen.  Config should start at least with
+--enable-machine=arm-linux if not autodetected.  Don't know what
+X-scale is, but if its not arm and is x86, the answer should also be
+positive.
+
+If you want to avoid any of the gcl builds, you can grab a .deb off of
+the temporary dist site and unpack on any linux box (with compatible
+shared libs installed, do a ldd unixport/saved_gcl to confirm).
+
+Take care,
+
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Gcl-devel mailing list
+> Gcl-devel@gnu.org
+> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gcl-devel
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
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+To: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] make-databases
+References: <200310311608.h9VG8Ae32761@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54vfq58gun.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 18:36:21 +0100
+In-Reply-To: <54vfq58gun.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (Camm Maguire's message
+	of "31 Oct 2003 12:19:44 -0500")
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org, daly@idsi.net, gcl-devel@gnu.org,
+	Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+
+Hello,
+
+Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com> writes:
+
+> I thought the Zaurus was an ARM processor?  If so, gcl is fully
+> supported there without dlopen.
+
+XScale is ARM architecture (with few additions). Intel loves rename
+things it touches. :)
+
+Yours,
+d.
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 12:42:01 2003
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+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:00:47 -0500
+Message-Id: <200310311700.h9VH0l405304@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+To: camm@enhanced.com
+In-reply-to: <54vfq58gun.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com> (message from Camm Maguire
+	on 31 Oct 2003 12:19:44 -0500)
+References: <200310311608.h9VG8Ae32761@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54vfq58gun.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] make-databases
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+Yes, if you 
+  mkdir mnt/linux/algebra
+  cp src/share/algebra/*daase
+the databases won't get rebuilt. However, the databases will be old
+NAG databases. What you really want to do is copy the databases from 
+another recent build, tar them up, copy them over, and untar them
+into mnt/linux/algebra.
+
+The Zaurus 5500 is arm, the 5600 is X-scale.
+
+Could you point me at a site with the .deb file?
+Is a .deb file a tgz file? How do I unpack one?
+I'm not a debian user. Is there a faq someplace?
+
+Tim
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 13:07:17 2003
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+To: Tim Daly <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] Re: [Gcl-devel] make-databases
+References: <200310311608.h9VG8Ae32761@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+	<54vfq58gun.fsf@intech19.enhanced.com>
+	<200310311700.h9VH0l405304@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
+From: Camm Maguire <camm@enhanced.com>
+Date: 31 Oct 2003 13:06:34 -0500
+In-Reply-To: <200310311700.h9VH0l405304@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>
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+
+Greetings!
+
+Tim Daly  <daly@rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu> writes:
+
+> Yes, if you 
+>   mkdir mnt/linux/algebra
+>   cp src/share/algebra/*daase
+> the databases won't get rebuilt. However, the databases will be old
+> NAG databases. What you really want to do is copy the databases from 
+> another recent build, tar them up, copy them over, and untar them
+> into mnt/linux/algebra.
+> 
+
+Thanks!  Will try this in a new package ...
+
+> The Zaurus 5500 is arm, the 5600 is X-scale.
+> 
+> Could you point me at a site with the .deb file?
+> Is a .deb file a tgz file? How do I unpack one?
+> I'm not a debian user. Is there a faq someplace?
+> 
+
+http://people.debian.org/~camm/gcl
+
+There is a file there called HOWTO-UNPACK-DEBS, but in short, .deb as
+an ar format.  ar x ....deb gives a data.tar.gz, which can be unpacked
+with gzip and tar.
+
+Take care,
+
+> Tim
+> 
+> 
+> _______________________________________________
+> Axiom-developer mailing list
+> Axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> http://mail.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/axiom-developer
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+-- 
+Camm Maguire			     			camm@enhanced.com
+==========================================================================
+"The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens."  --  Baha'u'llah
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 15:51:37 2003
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+To: Bill Page <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Organization: none
+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 21:50:58 +0100
+Message-ID: <87u15pw2q5.fsf@wanadoo.fr>
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] Line breaking and small font
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+Precedence: list
+List-Id: Axiom Developers  <axiom-developer.nongnu.org>
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+	<mailto:axiom-developer-request@nongnu.org?subject=subscribe>
+X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:51:35 -0000
+
+Hello Bill,
+
+While testing your tm_axiom (1.0.2), I noticed that if I use a small
+font in TeXmacs (Format->Size->Small) the line breaking is done too
+early. In other words, the Axiom/TeXmacs interface seems to not take
+into account the page size and font size parameters. Any idea to solve
+that?
+
+Yours,
+david
+
+PS: You have probably noticed that I re-submited to texmacs-dev your
+    tm_axiom against latest TeXmacs (1.0.2.4), taking into account axiom
+    renaming (AXIOMsys).
+-- 
+David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 15:56:32 2003
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+	Fri, 31 Oct 2003 15:55:42 -0500
+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: <axiom-developer@nongnu.org>
+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 15:54:47 -0500
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+Cc: texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] Patch for axiom plugin:
+	line-breaking algorithm & support of both NAG and free Axiom
+X-BeenThere: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
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+
+David,
+
+Can you upload this new version to the files section
+at Savannah? Maybe as version 1.0.3 or such?
+
+Also, if you do upload it to the files section, let me
+know if you have any problem with access restrictions.
+A couple of days ago I had trouble trying to add the
+static build tar.gz file to a directory that you had
+previously set up. I thought at first that it might be
+a space problem so I tried to remove one of the older
+binary files. But Savannah did not let me do it. I
+ended up just creating another directory and everything
+uploaded properly. I am not sure whether I did something
+wrong or not.
+
+Do you think we should make a place for this in the
+Axiom CVS or will the TeXmacs people take this on?
+
+There was also another modification recently providing
+a command line option to tm_axiom which specified either
+one or two prompts. With this change to AXIOMsys, that
+option should not longer be necessary, right?
+
+I think the question of line-breaking: tm_axiom vs. TeXmacs
+is still an active issue. And there are some bugs in the
+line-break code in this new version of tm_axiom. Should we
+track these bugs as part of the Axiom project?
+
+Regards,
+Bill Page.
+
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: texmacs-dev-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@gnu.org 
+> [mailto:texmacs-dev-bounces+bill.page1=sympatico.ca@gnu.org] 
+> On Behalf Of David MENTRE
+> Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 2:05 PM
+> To: texmacs-dev@gnu.org
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: [Texmacs-dev] Patch for axiom plugin: line-breaking 
+> algorithm & support of both NAG and free Axiom
+> 
+> 
+> Hello,
+> 
+> Here is a patch against TeXmacs 1.0.2.4 axiom plugin that
+> includes:
+> 
+>  - support of both free and NAG versions of Axiom (only tested
+>    on the free Axiom, I have not access to the NAG version)
+> 
+>  - inclusion of a line-breaking algorithm
+> 
+>  - modification on prompt handling to interact correctly with
+>    Axiom
+> 
+> Please notice that this patch will work only with releases of 
+> Axiom starting from current CVS tree. Older Axiom (like those 
+> found precompiled on Axiom web site) won't work.
+> 
+> Most of the work of this patch comes from Bill Page.
+> 
+> Let me know of any issue with this patch.
+> 
+> Yours,
+> d.
+
+
+
+
+From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Oct 31 16:19:16 2003
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+From: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?'David_Mentr=E9'?= <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 16:17:35 -0500
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+Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+Subject: [Axiom-developer] RE: Line breaking and small font
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+
+David,
+
+At the present time the line-break code in tm_axiom
+makes assumptions about the font size (and type) and
+has a single parameter which specifies a maximum line
+length (now set at 4500, I think, which means 4.5 inches).
+When you change the font size used by TeXmacs to render
+the mathematics, tm_axiom does not know this. It might
+be possible to pass a command-line parameter to tm_axiom
+to set line length and font-scaling etc. I guess these
+numbers could be extracted from TeXmacs by the init-axiom.scm
+script but exactly how to do this is beyond my level of
+knowledge of TeXmacs at this time.
+
+I think this complication supports the idea promoted by
+Joris that we should leave line-breaking to TeXmacs itself.
+But to do this, we might then be forced to make improvements
+to TeXmacs LaTeX conversion routines. That makes me think:
+
+"Well, ok maybe, but Axiom is already a pretty big thing to
+take on, adding TeXmacs to the top of that makes it seem like
+too big a task for me right now ..."
+
+Still, I do think TeXmacs has a great potential to achieve
+not only an excellent display of Axiom's mathematics within a
+full mathematical document preparation system, but also can go
+a long way towards providing the kind of literate programming
+tools that Tim has argued is important to Axiom's future. The
+extensions necessary to TeXmacs to make it handle the noweb-style
+pamphlet files and to provide a "tangle" operation to extract
+code etc. are (in principle) quite straight forward.
+
+So I am still of two minds about this. But I am definitely
+leaning toward the idea of suggesting that Axiom adopt TeXmacs
+as it's primary user interface. In which case, investing the
+time necessary to help adapt TeXmacs for this purpose might
+be justified.
+
+Cheers,
+Bill Page.
+
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: David Mentr=E9 [mailto:david.mentre@wanadoo.fr] 
+> Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 3:51 PM
+> To: Bill Page
+> Cc: axiom-developer@nongnu.org
+> Subject: Line breaking and small font
+> 
+> 
+> Hello Bill,
+> 
+> While testing your tm_axiom (1.0.2), I noticed that if I use 
+> a small font in TeXmacs (Format->Size->Small) the line 
+> breaking is done too early. In other words, the Axiom/TeXmacs 
+> interface seems to not take into account the page size and 
+> font size parameters. Any idea to solve that?
+> 
+> Yours,
+> david
+> 
+> PS: You have probably noticed that I re-submited to texmacs-dev
+> your tm_axiom against latest TeXmacs (1.0.2.4), taking into 
+> account axiom renaming (AXIOMsys).
+> -- 
+> David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr> -- http://www.nongnu.org/axiom/
+> 
+
+\start
+Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 22:43:56 +0100
+From: David MENTRE <david.mentre@wanadoo.fr>
+To: "Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca>
+Subject: Re: [Axiom-developer] RE: [Texmacs-dev] Patch for axiom plugin: line-breaking algorithm & support of both NAG and free Axiom
+
+Hello Bill,
+
+"Bill Page" <bill.page1@sympatico.ca> writes:
+
+> Can you upload this new version to the files section
+> at Savannah? Maybe as version 1.0.3 or such?
+
+I tried but...
+
+> Also, if you do upload it to the files section, let me
+> know if you have any problem with access restrictions.
+
+...as you, savannah did not let me upload the files. I wonder if the
+directory owner on savannah is not the guy who has done the last
+successful upload.
+
+I'll send you the files by email, so you could give it a try. 
+
+> Do you think we should make a place for this in the
+> Axiom CVS or will the TeXmacs people take this on?
+
+I think it would be better to let TeXmacs people to integrate it. But if
+they don't do it, we will add this work to our CVS.
+
+> There was also another modification recently providing
+> a command line option to tm_axiom which specified either
+> one or two prompts. With this change to AXIOMsys, that
+> option should not longer be necessary, right?
+
+I think so. At least in my version, AXIOMsys is called directly. And as
+it was mentioned on the list, it should work with NAG's version.
+
+> I think the question of line-breaking: tm_axiom vs. TeXmacs
+> is still an active issue. And there are some bugs in the
+> line-break code in this new version of tm_axiom. Should we
+> track these bugs as part of the Axiom project?
+
+As we have wrote and we maintain this software, we should fix bugs
+ourself, as time permits.
+
+
+
diff --git a/changelog b/changelog
index bb969ed..9b89554 100644
--- a/changelog
+++ b/changelog
@@ -1,3 +1,5 @@
+20140418 tpd src/axiom-website/patches.html 20140420.01.tpd.patch
+20140418 tpd book/2003-10.txt regularize
 20140418 tpd src/axiom-website/patches.html 20140419.01.tpd.patch
 20140418 tpd book/2003-09.txt regularize
 20140418 tpd remove, reorder CC lines
diff --git a/src/axiom-website/patches.html b/src/axiom-website/patches.html
index 0b50025..65d7b74 100644
--- a/src/axiom-website/patches.html
+++ b/src/axiom-website/patches.html
@@ -4280,6 +4280,8 @@ book/2003-07.txt regularize
 book/2003-08.txt regularize
 <a href="patches/20140419.01.tpd.patch">20140419.01.tpd.patch</a>
 book/2003-09.txt regularize, remove, reorder CC lines
+<a href="patches/20140420.01.tpd.patch">20140420.01.tpd.patch</a>
+book/2003-10.txt regularize
  </body>
 </html>
 
